I suspect that BA got a favorable deal.

“British Airways parent company IAG today revealed plans to buy 200 Boeing 737 MAX jets in a huge £19billion deal despite the troubled aircraft being grounded following two fatal crashes that killed 346 people.

The model has been widely criticised after two disasters within six months of each other, and the announcement at the Paris Air Show sent shockwaves through the aviation world.

Boeing, which is a U.S company and has offices all over the country from California to Chicago, used the first two days of the event for an apology tour over the two tragedies, and continues to face lawsuits and calls from victims' families for answers about what went wrong.

However, the International Airline Group - which also owns Iberia, Vueling and Air Lingus - said it had been convinced by Boeing assurances that safety concerns had been rectified…”

https://mol.im/a/7154585

Like buying a Prius right after those people were plowing them into storefronts.

quote:

Originally posted by r0gue:
Like buying a Prius right after those people were plowing them into storefronts.

Wasn't that self-induced - Large American feet on the wrong pedal ???

Well thats the wrong way to start a Navy, but thats none of my business....

While there was a problem with the aircraft, weren't the crashes a result of improper training?

quote:

Originally posted by sigalert:
While there was a problem with the aircraft, weren't the crashes a result of improper training?

This again?

They probably got one hell of a deal. Consider, the 737, before Max, has a pretty good safety record. The problems have been exposed and will be addressed. By the time the Max is cleared for flight it will have been reviewed in excruciating detail.

There was a report on the news about the Boeing CEO being on the first commercial Max flight after clearance. My wife asked if I would fly on that plane. My answer: yes, it will be the safest plane in the air at that moment. Truth be told, I have already flown on a Max. Southwest has a fleet of them and we were on one before the grounding.

quote:

Originally posted by sigalert:

While there was a problem with the aircraft, weren't the crashes a result of improper training?

According to the gentleman I rent my hangar from, yes -- pilot error, a lack of addressing this area in training.

His authority to make a statement like this? Does he know what he is talking about? Yes. He is a senior captain for an airline that uses 737s. That's the only airplane that he currently flies (except for his daughter's C-172). He flies regular line routes, and he also is a trainer / check pilot. Dealing with runaway trim is a routine part of training for that airline.

Remember, each airline can write its own training manual. If it's a U.S. airline, the manual needs to be "blessed" by the FAA, so if an aspect of training is not covered properly, it's mostly the airline's fault for not including it in the training curriculum, and partly the FAA's fault for approving an inadequate training syllabus.

Side note, minor drift: When I do any training for pilots in Bonanzas, one of the areas I cover before we even start the engine for the first time, is "show me all the ways that you know, to disconnect the autopilot and / or electric trim system, in the event that they malfunction." My V-tail, for example, had five separate ways to do this (circuit breakers and switches), any one of which will do the job. Any pilot who flew it, was trained (by me) to thoroughly understand the airplane's systems.

The loss of the two 737-800 Max aircraft wasn't lack of pilot training; it was failure to fly the airplane.

In the case of the Ethiopian airplane, the preliminary report is fairly comprehensive; more than adequate to clearly show what occurred. While a trim error did occur along with instrument errata and erroneous cockpit indications, the crew failed to fly the airplane. They allowed it to accelerate right out of the envelope, far in excess of the operating limitations of the aricraft. The trim problems would have been manageable, but at such high speeds, the trim forces became unmanageable.

All they had to do was maintain their airspeed and fly the airplane. They didn't do that.

Third world countries, and even many developed countries, employ pilots with no experience outside of their airline. Where little or no general aviation exists to build time and experience, the pilots for those airlines get minimal training then go to work for the airline. The copilot on the Ethiopian airplane had just barely enough hours for a commercial pilot certificate, and the captain had never worked anywhere else. If you fly anywhere in the world on an airliner, you'll find this to often be the case.