Southwest Airlines to allow miniature horses as service animals in new policy
quote:
Originally posted by maladat:
quote:
Originally posted by Icabod: Then there are companies that train and sell service animals. The average price is $17,000. They would love training and licensing requirements and no doubt demand rules that are difficult for owner handlers to pass.
And just imagine how much more expensive it could be once we got a nice fat bureaucracy set up to manage it all!
It doesn’t have to be a fat bureaucracy at all though. In fact if owners and advocates themselves get in front of it then the owners and advocates can help decide how much of a bureaucracy it is. I am not suggesting that service animals get priced out of reach. But I would really like this fake emotional support animal nonsense to stop. I’m sick of dealing with them and their owners every time I fly.
“Everybody wants a Sig in the sheets but a Glock on the streets.” -bionic218 04-02-2014
August 17, 2018, 06:52 AM
joel9507
Pivoting around the quote in Para's signature above, one is free to avoid airlines with irrational animal travel policies.
When Airline A allows Boris, the comfort squid, to accompany their passengers, if that bothers you it's time to give your business to Airline B that doesn't.
August 17, 2018, 06:58 AM
recoatlift
Jeepers, remember when it was a pleasure to fly? Folks seemed happier, dressed better & no animals were needed. Now, boarding a plane is like stepping into a 3rd world country.
August 17, 2018, 07:08 AM
2BobTanner
Flying in civilian aircraft makes me long for flying in a C-130 for a trans-Atlantic crossing once again.
--------------------- DJT-45/47 MAGA !!!!!
"Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it." — Mark Twain
“Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard.” — H. L. Mencken
August 17, 2018, 07:18 AM
Cliff
quote:
Originally posted by PD: It’s all cool until the horse shits all over the plane.
Damn skippy.
"All great things are simple, and many can be expressed in single words: freedom, justice, honor, duty, mercy, hope."
--Sir Winston Churchill
"The world is filled with violence. Because criminals carry guns, we decent law-abiding citizens should also have guns. Otherwise they will win and the decent people will lose."
--James Earl Jones
August 17, 2018, 08:03 AM
MikeinNC
quote:
Originally posted by 2BobTanner: Flying in civilian aircraft makes me long for flying in a C-130 for a trans-Atlantic crossing once again.
Hahaha, hear are your earplugs, the head is over there...
"Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor.” Robert A. Heinlein
“You may beat me, but you will never win.” sigmonkey-2020
“A single round of buckshot to the torso almost always results in an immediate change of behavior.” Chris Baker
August 17, 2018, 08:15 AM
Doc H.
When civilization collapses, let's not bring this particular policy back. When we build airplanes again.
"And gentlemen in England now abed, shall think themselves accursed they were not here, and hold their manhoods cheap whiles any speaks that fought with us upon Saint Crispin's Day"
August 17, 2018, 08:16 AM
Vanwall
What about having special flights for people with service animals. The reduced availability of flights to choose from would be an inconvenience from the people with service animals but not for other people flying.
August 17, 2018, 08:23 AM
wcb6092
quote:
Originally posted by sns3guppy:
How does a service animal help a diabetic? Were you not just told? Service animals on aircraft are allowed under federal law, but the airline can (and usually does) require documentation that the animal is required. The airline cannot ask the condition.
This law will only work with honest people.Some people will say anything to fly their animal for free.
Inquiries, Exclusions, Charges, and Other Specific Rules Related to Service Animals
When it is not obvious what service an animal provides, only limited inquiries are allowed. Staff may ask two questions: (1) is the dog a service animal required because of a disability, and (2) what work or task has the dog been trained to perform. Staff cannot ask about the person’s disability, require medical documentation, require a special identification card or training documentation for the dog, or ask that the dog demonstrate its ability to perform the work or task.
_________________________
August 17, 2018, 08:58 AM
maladat
quote:
Originally posted by Pale Horse:
quote:
Originally posted by maladat:
quote:
Originally posted by Icabod: Then there are companies that train and sell service animals. The average price is $17,000. They would love training and licensing requirements and no doubt demand rules that are difficult for owner handlers to pass.
And just imagine how much more expensive it could be once we got a nice fat bureaucracy set up to manage it all!
It doesn’t have to be a fat bureaucracy at all though. In fact if owners and advocates themselves get in front of it then the owners and advocates can help decide how much of a bureaucracy it is. I am not suggesting that service animals get priced out of reach. But I would really like this fake emotional support animal nonsense to stop. I’m sick of dealing with them and their owners every time I fly.
How much control does any group of ordinary citizens exert over any government agency?
Also, emotional support animals are not service animals.
Service animals are trained to perform a specific task that helps a person with a disability.
Emotional support animals help a person with a psychiatric condition feel better just by being present.
August 17, 2018, 09:01 AM
maladat
quote:
Originally posted by joel9507: Pivoting around the quote in Para's signature above, one is free to avoid airlines with irrational animal travel policies.
When Airline A allows Boris, the comfort squid, to accompany their passengers, if that bothers you it's time to give your business to Airline B that doesn't.
This is actually not really an option.
A federal law, the "Air Carrier Access Act," requires all airlines to allow both service animals and emotional support animals in-cabin on flights.
Part of the ACAA is that you can't use certain "unusual" animals as emotional support animals, so you're probably safe from emotional support squids, but not ESAs in general.
August 17, 2018, 09:37 AM
V-Tail
quote:
Originally posted by sns3guppy:
The airline cannot ask the condition.
I was under the impression that the person may not be questioned re his / her "condition," but it is acceptable to ask what "service" the animal performs.
Is this correct?
הרחפת שלי מלאה בצלופחים
August 17, 2018, 09:49 AM
maladat
quote:
Originally posted by V-Tail:
quote:
Originally posted by sns3guppy:
The airline cannot ask the condition.
I was under the impression that the person may not be questioned re his / her "condition," but it is acceptable to ask what "service" the animal performs.
Q7. What questions can a covered entity's employees ask to determine if a dog is a service animal?
A. In situations where it is not obvious that the dog is a service animal, staff may ask only two specific questions: (1) is the dog a service animal required because of a disability? and (2) what work or task has the dog been trained to perform? Staff are not allowed to request any documentation for the dog, require that the dog demonstrate its task, or inquire about the nature of the person's disability.
For emotional support animals, the answer is a bit different. From the "Air Carrier Access Act."
(e) If a passenger seeks to travel with an animal that is used as an emotional support or psychiatric service animal, you are not required to accept the animal for transportation in the cabin unless the passenger provides you current documentation (i.e., no older than one year from the date of the passenger's scheduled initial flight) on the letterhead of a licensed mental health professional (e.g., psychiatrist, psychologist, licensed clinical social worker, including a medical doctor specifically treating the passenger's mental or emotional disability) stating the following:
(1) The passenger has a mental or emotional disability recognized in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders—Fourth Edition (DSM IV);
(2) The passenger needs the emotional support or psychiatric service animal as an accommodation for air travel and/or for activity at the passenger's destination;
(3) The individual providing the assessment is a licensed mental health professional, and the passenger is under his or her professional care; and
(4) The date and type of the mental health professional's license and the state or other jurisdiction in which it was issued.
August 17, 2018, 10:07 AM
Snake207
quote:
Originally posted by PD: It’s all cool until the horse shits all over the plane.
Originally posted by V-Tail:...but it is acceptable to ask what "service" the animal performs.
...
You are a dirty old man.
"the meaning of life, is to give life meaning" ✡ Ani Yehudi אני יהודי Le'olam lo shuv לעולם לא שוב!
August 17, 2018, 11:59 AM
Pale Horse
quote:
Originally posted by maladat:
quote:
Originally posted by Pale Horse:
quote:
Originally posted by maladat:
quote:
Originally posted by Icabod: Then there are companies that train and sell service animals. The average price is $17,000. They would love training and licensing requirements and no doubt demand rules that are difficult for owner handlers to pass.
And just imagine how much more expensive it could be once we got a nice fat bureaucracy set up to manage it all!
It doesn’t have to be a fat bureaucracy at all though. In fact if owners and advocates themselves get in front of it then the owners and advocates can help decide how much of a bureaucracy it is. I am not suggesting that service animals get priced out of reach. But I would really like this fake emotional support animal nonsense to stop. I’m sick of dealing with them and their owners every time I fly.
How much control does any group of ordinary citizens exert over any government agency?
Also, emotional support animals are not service animals.
Service animals are trained to perform a specific task that helps a person with a disability.
Emotional support animals help a person with a psychiatric condition feel better just by being present.
It does not have to be a government agency. There are all sorts of certification programs that are not controlled by or administered by the government yet are recognized and sometimes required for a field of work. For instance UL certification is not a government certification but it is required by many people before they will buy a product.
“Everybody wants a Sig in the sheets but a Glock on the streets.” -bionic218 04-02-2014
August 17, 2018, 12:03 PM
Pale Horse
quote:
Originally posted by joel9507: Pivoting around the quote in Para's signature above, one is free to avoid airlines with irrational animal travel policies.
When Airline A allows Boris, the comfort squid, to accompany their passengers, if that bothers you it's time to give your business to Airline B that doesn't.
As posted above, no I cannot. And while technically support animals do not have to be allowed on without a note, which I doubt is very hard to get, the restrictions against requiring any sort of proof that the animal is an actual service animal creates a massive loophole for anyone willing to lie.
“Everybody wants a Sig in the sheets but a Glock on the streets.” -bionic218 04-02-2014
August 17, 2018, 01:06 PM
synthplayer
Of all the enemies the American citizen faces, the Democrat Party is the very worst.
August 17, 2018, 01:12 PM
nhtagmember
I have no problems with real service dogs such as seeing eye dogs and the like on airplanes
I have no problem with bringing a miniature critter like a dachshund in an under-seat case or crate
I do have a problem with so-called emotional support animals of ANY kind
if you're that emotionally fragile, you should think about another mode of transport
[B] Against ALL enemies, foreign and DOMESTIC
August 17, 2018, 01:20 PM
HRK
My problem is with the people that abuse exceptions and options like these in order to get away with taking their precious pets wherever they go, it reduces the support for those truly in need by extorting rules for personal gain, and we all know that many of these "support" animals provide no real life saving services.
They only detract from those that do....
It's hard to know what is really a support animal outside of seeing a blind person with a dog, we see all sorts of people in stores with support pets that don't meet the "reasonable and customary" idea of what a support pet is.
I guess the days of Lassie pulling Timmy out of the well are now replaced with Muffin the pet Tarantula that jumps when it senses the owners about to pop a hemorrhoid
