quote:

Originally posted by vthoky:

quote:

Originally posted by Fla. Jim:
An electric M/C for around town would be a hoot if it can get out of it's own way. and was cheap enough to purchase.

Those are in the works. Have a look at Zero Motorcycles, if you haven't already heard of them.

Heard about them. Had not looked into them....Definite maybe, when the range gets a little better and charge times decrease.

quote:

Originally posted by henryaz:
 
Wickenburg is Tesla-ready.
 

 

We got them down here, just south of Tucson, off I-10, Shell station. Worker there told me it takes about 45 minutes for a Tesla full charge which gives a range of around 300 miles.

It usually took me about 10 minutes to pump 13 gallons of Diesel fuel in my VW TDI. Fuel range of close to 600 miles.

I really don't see the advantages of an Electric car over a Diesel powered car.

I think the Tesla charging stations are cool, but the more advanced idea would be wireless charging under the asphalt. The parking space becomes a docking station and the car charges like my cell phone wirelessly. Then I'd like to see electric cars rival conventionally powered cars in performance and price. Do that, and then I'll buy one.

quote:

Originally posted by GWbiker:
We got them down here, just south of Tucson, off I-10, Shell station. Worker there told me it takes about 45 minutes for a Tesla full charge which gives a range of around 300 miles.

It usually took me about 10 minutes to pump 13 gallons of Diesel fuel in my VW TDI. Fuel range of close to 600 miles.

I really don't see the advantages of an Electric car over a Diesel powered car.

The advantage is I don’t use a gas station for my electric car. So that ten minutes you spend at the pump, I don’t spend that. I plug it in before I go to bed in my own garage. Also don’t spend that money you do filling up at the pump. Most Teslas do not use public chargers. Tesla branded ones or otherwise. You only use those when traveling. And if traveling 45 minutes is not a big deal because you have to piss, eat, etc. rest of the time these cars are plugged in at night while you sleep in your own garage. Owners get it, convenient, filling up at home at a substantial cost difference compared to gasoline. Fuel is way cheaper. Range anxiety, charging times, non-owners worry about such things. I had range concerns and charging concerns for about 30 days until I put my 240v charger in my garage and it was history. Maintenance is also much less frequent.

quote:

Originally posted by Prefontaine:

quote:

Originally posted by GWbiker:
We got them down here, just south of Tucson, off I-10, Shell station. Worker there told me it takes about 45 minutes for a Tesla full charge which gives a range of around 300 miles.

It usually took me about 10 minutes to pump 13 gallons of Diesel fuel in my VW TDI. Fuel range of close to 600 miles.

I really don't see the advantages of an Electric car over a Diesel powered car.

The advantage is I don’t use a gas station for my electric car. So that ten minutes you spend at the pump, I don’t spend that. I plug it in before I go to bed in my own garage. Also don’t spend that money you do filling up at the pump. Most Teslas do not use public chargers. Tesla branded ones or otherwise. You only use those when traveling. And if traveling 45 minutes is not a big deal because you have to piss, eat, etc. rest of the time these cars are plugged in at night while you sleep in your own garage. Owners get it, convenient, filling up at home at a substantial cost difference compared to gasoline. Fuel is way cheaper. Range anxiety, charging times, non-owners worry about such things. I had range concerns and charging concerns for about 30 days until I put my 240v charger in my garage and it was history. Maintenance is also much less frequent.

I was wrong in the charging times at the Tesla charging stations. It's an hour and fifteen minutes with the station Supercharger and now with a fee imposed to give you a range of 300 miles.

In an hour and fifteen minutes I can be 75 miles down the road.

But, do have fun with your Electric car.

The tax credit is all about propping up an otherwise unsustainable business model. Also, don't ask where the power comes from to build or charge the batteries.

I think hydrogen powered vehicles are probably much more practical, but not really useful until there are as many places to get hydrogen as their is gasoline.

We're still using gas for a reason. If I recall, the energy density of gasoline beats the snot out of just about everything else.



look at where batteries are on the graph compared to gas - they're the least desirable

quote:

I think hydrogen powered vehicles are probably much more practical, but not really useful until there are as many places to get hydrogen as their is gasoline.

Agreed, I think pure electric is a stepping stone while other technologies and infrastructure mature.

I actually held a reservation on the Tesla 3 that I just canceled. I like to keep cars for 8-10 years, I don't like to pay more than $40K for a car, and I want more than 200 mile range.

As I watched the Tesla3 story unfold, the real cost soared to north of $50K for a car with 280 mile range (even with rebate), infrastructure to charge is still coming into place, and after 4 years the battery efficiency starts to take a nosedive.

Cool tech, v1.5 gen tech if being honest - so more than a toy but not a vehicle as I see it. Technology like Hydrogen cells combined with advancements in battery tech/lighter/cheaper/less exotic elements.

Until then I'll keep burning dinosaurs despite my flirtation with Electric. Besides - burning dinosaurs is also a lot of fun

Gratuitous pic of car I replaced the Tesla3 with...

quote:

Originally posted by GWbiker:
I was wrong in the charging times at the Tesla charging stations. It's an hour and fifteen minutes with the station Supercharger and now with a fee imposed to give you a range of 300 miles.

In an hour and fifteen minutes I can be 75 miles down the road.

But, do have fun with your Electric car.

I do, and with my gas car. My electric sees a public charger maybe 2-3 times a year. So 99% of the time it’s plugged in, in my garage, charging while I sleep. So I don’t deal with pumps, punblic chargers, or anything else. Most Tesla owners do not either. Those super chargers you saw and keep quoting charge times on, we only use those on road trips. As in outside of your regular area. Man I haven’t used a public charger like that in a year. My charger is in my garage and it’s used when I’m at home relaxing or while I sleep.

I do see issues and that’s from non-owners finger pointing with zero experience.

Regardless if you love or dislike LEV the fact remains, every one sold has been paid for in part by other taxpayers.

Anyone that owns one took taxpayer money (and yes we know those that buy them paid taxes too but they don't just take your taxes to do this) to subsidize the purchase.

The inevitable "oil companies get breaks" comment is usually reserved for Facebook progressive Teslaophiles however that's been proven to be a false flag argument years ago.

Oil company tax breaks are the same breaks given to Tesla, GM, Ford, Toyota USA, Target, Wal-Mart, every single US corporation gets those tax incentives, Every, single, company.

What Target, Wal-Mart, and every single non LEV producing US corporation doesn't get is direct funding from Taxpayers for purchases of their products from Federal and State taxpayer funds.

Which is what the discussion is about, not if LEV's will replace the gasoline engine, maybe it will, and probably will take decades if not more simply because of logisitics and technology.

ANother tidbit that confirms Teslas failing fiscal policy that depended on Taxpayer funding to fill the gap between loss and profit is Musks continued effort to try and thwart state franchise laws that prohibit the direct sale of vehicles from manufacturers to customers.

He isn't doing it for some grand worthy scheme to help consumers, he's doing it because he can't afford dealers at his price point, he's losing $10K or more a car, and dealers would double that.

Would I like to see it succeed?
Sure

But as a federal and state taxpayer subsidized luxury brand where high income people get to buy a top end vehicle with the assistance of taxpayer money, nope.

Just like the rest of us, Musk should be able to sell cars at a profit, and since his customers are affluent I don't see why he doesn't raise prices to make a profit, they can afford $120K if they can afford $100K.

quote:

Originally posted by Prefontaine:

quote:

Originally posted by GWbiker:
I was wrong in the charging times at the Tesla charging stations. It's an hour and fifteen minutes with the station Supercharger and now with a fee imposed to give you a range of 300 miles.

In an hour and fifteen minutes I can be 75 miles down the road.

But, do have fun with your Electric car.

I do, and with my gas car. My electric sees a public charger maybe 2-3 times a year. So 99% of the time it’s plugged in, in my garage, charging while I sleep. So I don’t deal with pumps, punblic chargers, or anything else. Most Tesla owners do not either. Those super chargers you saw and keep quoting charge times on, we only use those on road trips. As in outside of your regular area. Man I haven’t used a public charger like that in a year. My charger is in my garage and it’s used when I’m at home relaxing or while I sleep.

I do see issues and that’s from non-owners finger pointing with zero experience.

Yes, I do have zero experience with a $85K car with a very limited driving range, with software issues and being subsidized by the Feds.

I do have many years experience with Diesel power which has fallen out of favor with general public and the feds. A form of power that could run on products that we waste - cooking oils.

I wouldn't mind the Model 3 but its going to have to get better mileage trip than my Hybrid CT200h.
And for us Cali people Our ding don governor just put a $100 a year tax on electric just because he could.
Go electric but then let me put a tax on it, like the .12 cents a gallon that just went into effect.