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The Unmanned Writer
Picture of LS1 GTO
posted
IMO as a career aviation guy, these things are n engineering wonder to behold.

(disregard the inflammatory and unrelated comments by the article's writer)

https://www.nbclosangeles.com/...le-and-rare/3605782/

quote:
One reason last week’s collision between a firefighting plane and a drone caused such a stir was because Los Angeles doesn’t have many spare “Super Scoopers” to take the aircraft’s place.

The Los Angeles Fire Department typically leases two each year, but authorities have requested more to combat the wildfires that continue to burn throughout the metro area. There are only about 160 in operation around the world, each one constructed by a single Canadian company based on a design that has barely changed in 55 years.

“It is a rugged, reliable and very tough aircraft,” said Neil Sweeney, vice president of corporate affairs at De Havilland Aircraft, the planes’ manufacturer, which is based in Calgary.

Super Scoopers get their name from their ability to pick up 6,000 liters from bodies of water and drop them in just 12 seconds on wildfires burning nearby, he said. It’s a specialized task that’s becoming more in demand as a warming climate contributes to bigger, hotter, more frequent blazes that are often difficult to control.

Unlike most other firefighting aircraft that must return to base after each drop, Super Scoopers can fly continuously for three to four hours, returning to ingest and release water on a fire repeatedly. Their powerful engines let pilots slow down and execute drops with precision, Sweeney said, and the planes have proved capable of operating in “some of the worst conditions possible,” including high winds.

So losing just one Super Scooper even temporarily can hamper firefighting operations when every hour is critical. Thursday’s drone crash, which punched a hole in the plane’s left wing, was a close call, Sweeney said. The aircraft landed safely and no one was injured, but it could’ve been much worse if the drone had hit elsewhere, he added.

The incident nonetheless grounded the plane for days, keeping it out of action as authorities struggled to respond to shifting winds over the weekend. It was expected to fly again Tuesday, according to Los Angeles County Fire Chief Anthony Marrone, but officials said they’re taking the incident seriously and the FBI is seeking information about the drone’s operator.

The California Department of Forestry and Fire Protection, meanwhile, has urged people to respect restricted airspace. “There could have been injuries,” said Scott McLean, an information officer for Cal Fire. “There could have been fatalities.”

So far, there aren’t many alternatives to Super Scoopers. While tech startups are racing to build bigger, more powerful firefighting drones, most are still under development. Experts say it could take some time before effective, affordable autonomous aircraft are in widespread use, given the logistical hurdles and safety regulations that need to be cleared first.

De Havilland mainly focuses on special-mission aircraft. The company has been making the current Super Scooper model since 2015, when former manufacturer Bombardier sold the program to De Havilland. The company is now working on producing its first order of 22 new Super Scoopers, or the De Havilland Canadair 515, for fire departments in Europe, Sweeney said.

Earlier versions — the CL-215, produced in the 1970s and ’80s, and the CL-415, produced from the ’90s through 2015 — are still in use as well. Sweeney estimated about 70 of the Super Scoopers currently in action are the older CL-215 model. He expects more fire departments will soon seek replacements as many contend with more intense, longer-lasting fire seasons, and as other places that don’t typically experience wildfires begin to do so.

“We’re seeing significant demand around the world,” Sweeney said, adding that De Havilland hopes to ramp up production to nine or 10 planes each year.

Most Super Scoopers in the U.S. are owned by Montana-based Bridger Aerospace. With six planes, the company holds the largest private Super Scooper fleet in the world and leases the aircraft to fire departments. Over the weekend, Bridger sent a CL-415, which had been undergoing winter maintenance, to California.

Other Super Scoopers operating in the U.S. are on loan from Canada, like the Quebec 1 that was hit by the drone in L.A. Officials there have leased a pair of CL-415 planes from the government of Quebec each fire season for the past 31 years.

That partnership reflects the long history of cross-border resource-sharing for wildfire control, Sweeney said, adding that he hopes it will continue even as the challenges grow.

The incoming U.S. administration could throw a wild card into this arrangement, with President-elect Donald Trump already threatening tariffs of up to 25% on imports from Canada and Mexico. He also suggested this month that he wanted to make Canada the 51st state, adding to diplomatic tensions that factored into a leadership change atop the country’s ruling party.

For now, though, “there’s a high degree of cooperation worldwide, but especially between North American states and provinces when we have severe wildfires,” Sweeney said. “Our American friends send equipment, send personnel up to us, and vice versa.”







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The definition of the words we used, carry a meaning of their own...



 
Posts: 14296 | Location: It was Lat: 33.xxxx Lon: 44.xxxx now it's CA :( | Registered: March 22, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Savor the limelight
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Brought down by a DJI Mini 3 Pro drone under 250 grams and this not required to be registered with the FAA. Fucking idiot drone owner. They don’t know exactly where the plane hit the drone. Because it has built in GEO fencing and can’t handle winds above 24mph, I’m going to guess it happened while the plane was scooping up water and not over the fires. It happened on the 9th.

FBI working to piece together drone that damaged super scooper while battling Palisades Fire

Excerpt:
“According to officials, the plane collided with a privately-owned drone, causing significant damage to it. The drone put a 3x6 hole in the aircraft, causing a 20- to 30-minute delay in the aerial firefight.”
 
Posts: 12202 | Location: SWFL | Registered: October 10, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Ignored facts
still exist
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I read on the internet some time ago that It all went well until that scuba diver in Australia got scooped up and dumped into the wildfire that the plane was fighting. Poor soul, they found him charred and hanging in a tree.


.
 
Posts: 11256 | Location: 45 miles from the Pacific Ocean | Registered: February 28, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by radioman:
I read on the internet


So it must be true. I've read that many times. True story?
 
Posts: 1465 | Location: Mason, Ohio | Registered: September 16, 2015Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Only the strong survive
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It is LA County that leases these planes not LA City. At $30M, how many homes are they worth?



41
 
Posts: 11950 | Location: Herndon, VA | Registered: June 11, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Ignored facts
still exist
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Schmelby:
quote:
Originally posted by radioman:
I read on the internet


So it must be true. I've read that many times. True story?


Well, the story is usually told along with the story about the guy who wakes up in a 'Vegas hotel after a wild night with a prostitute and finds his kidney missing. If that's any indication.

but both stories sound plausible.


.
 
Posts: 11256 | Location: 45 miles from the Pacific Ocean | Registered: February 28, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Sigforum said: "You'll be fine trust us."


Picture of mn_smokeater
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The water inlets on the Cl215 and 415 are roughly the size of a persons fist.


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Posts: 1361 | Location: Bemidji, MN | Registered: March 06, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Only the strong survive
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Looks like Europe is planning to buy up to 12 Super Scooper planes:

18 Sep 2023
Europe to invest in dozens of new water bombers - EU order may spark redesign of new Canadair "super scooper" design

After yet another difficult fire season in Europe, the European Union has said it will invest in up to 12 new firefighting planes, the news site EuroNews reported on September 17.

The Canadair belongs to a unique and small family of dedicated aerial firefighting aircraft, . According to their article, the EU Commissioner for Crisis Management, Janez Lenarcic, expects individual member states to order 12 more planes separately.

Lenarcic has allegedly revealed that manufacturer De Havilland Canada has agreed to re-launch production of the iconic "Canadair" aircraft if the EU orders are placed.

The Canadair is often referred to as a "super scooper" since it does not have to return to a base to refill its water tanks. Instead, the aircrafts are designed to be able to skim along the surface of a water source, refilling their tanks through inlets before taking off again.

https://www.ctif.org/news/euro...nadair-super-scooper

..............................

Jan. 15, 2025, 12:31 PM EST
By Alexandra Byrne

One reason last week’s collision between a firefighting plane and a drone caused such a stir was that Los Angeles doesn’t have many spare “Super Scoopers” to take the aircraft’s place.

Los Angeles fire authorities typically lease two each year, but officials have requested more to combat the wildfires that continue to burn throughout the metro area. There are only about 160 in operation around the world, each one constructed by a single Canadian company based on a design that has barely changed in 55 years.

“It is a rugged, reliable and very tough aircraft,” said Neil Sweeney, vice president of corporate affairs at De Havilland Aircraft, the planes’ manufacturer, which is based in Calgary.

Super Scoopers get their name from their ability to pick up 6,000 liters from bodies of water and drop them in just 12 seconds on wildfires burning nearby, he said. It’s a specialized task that’s becoming more in demand as a warming climate contributes to bigger, hotter, more frequent blazes that are often difficult to control.

Unlike most other firefighting aircraft that must return to base after each drop, Super Scoopers can fly continuously for three to four hours, returning to ingest and release water on a fire repeatedly. Their powerful engines let pilots slow down and execute drops with precision, Sweeney said, and the planes have proved capable of operating in “some of the worst conditions possible,” including high winds.

So losing just one Super Scooper even temporarily can hamper firefighting operations when every hour is critical. Thursday’s drone crash, which punched a hole in the plane’s left wing, was a close call, Sweeney said. The aircraft landed safely and no one was injured, but it could’ve been much worse if the drone had hit elsewhere, he added.

The Super Scooper that was hit by a drone sat in a maintenance hangar in Los Angeles on Friday.Patrick T. Fallon / AFP - Getty Images

The incident nonetheless grounded the plane for days, keeping it out of action as authorities struggled to respond to shifting winds over the weekend. It was expected to fly again Tuesday, according to Los Angeles County Fire Chief Anthony Marrone, but officials said they’re taking the incident seriously and the FBI is seeking information about the drone’s operator.

The California Department of Forestry and Fire Protection, meanwhile, has urged people to respect restricted airspace. “There could have been injuries,” said Scott McLean, an information officer for Cal Fire. “There could have been fatalities.”

https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/s...able-rare-rcna187795


41
 
Posts: 11950 | Location: Herndon, VA | Registered: June 11, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Maybe California should invest in some of these airplanes. Duh....


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“A man’s treatment of a dog is no indication of the man’s nature, but his treatment of a cat is. It is the crucial test. None but the humane treat a cat well.”
-- Mark Twain, 1902
 
Posts: 9459 | Location: Northern Virginia | Registered: November 04, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by 229DAK:
Maybe California should invest in some of these airplanes. Duh....

LA and San Diego already have them in their inventory. The backlog of orders on them is years long.

Helicopters are more versatile, along with their vertical lift capability, they're able to dip into reservoirs, water tanks and swimming pools. While these scooper's capabilities are impressive, they are also limited to certain water source size-minimums where they can draw from.
 
Posts: 15302 | Location: Wine Country | Registered: September 20, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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^^^

Cal Fire already has quite the air fleet:

https://www.fire.ca.gov/what-w...ion/aviation-program
 
Posts: 16112 | Location: Eastern Iowa | Registered: May 21, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Savor the limelight
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Flight path of the two Super Scoopers from Jan 9 between 10:14am and 12:30pm PST:



They took off from Van Nuys, dumped their first load at about 10:14am, flew to the Pacific, filled up, dumped their loads, and repeated until dumping their last load at 12:30pm and landing at Van Nuys. Because of the damage from the drone collision, only one returns to the fight a few hours later.

The orange lines is the flight path and it becomes an orange blob because of how many times the flew that path over and over and over. Awesome machines just relentlessly pounding the fires.

The helicopters to the west also made a ton of round trips, filling up where it says Malibu on the map. By contrast, there’s a DC-10, a C-130 Hercules, a pair of BRITISH AEROSPACE 146-200 Quiet Traders, and a pair of GRUMMAN S-2 Turbo Trackers that show up occasionally.

There’s also a couple of Turbo Commanders and King Airs that swap out doing circles around the fires for hours. These guys must be calling the shots. Then there’s a couple OV-10 Broncos flying around. I have no idea what roll they play, but their twin boom T-tails are interesting.
 
Posts: 12202 | Location: SWFL | Registered: October 10, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Then there’s a couple OV-10 Broncos flying around. I have no idea what roll they play
CalFire command and control, according to their website posted by Sigmund.


_________________________________________________________________________
“A man’s treatment of a dog is no indication of the man’s nature, but his treatment of a cat is. It is the crucial test. None but the humane treat a cat well.”
-- Mark Twain, 1902
 
Posts: 9459 | Location: Northern Virginia | Registered: November 04, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Juan Browne has a lot of other video on CalFire aircraft and how they use them.

 
Posts: 15302 | Location: Wine Country | Registered: September 20, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Here's a four-minute video about building the 515. There are just a few flying scenes, it's the less exciting but critical assembly.

https://youtu.be/eOin6F8aQXw


Company page with the above video:

https://dehavilland.com/de-havilland-canadair-515/
 
Posts: 16112 | Location: Eastern Iowa | Registered: May 21, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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