I didn't want to dirty up Para's thread any more than it was already.

I think there is a lot of work to be done to fix public schools, but here's what it boils down to in my opinion. Roughly 87% of our nation's children will attend public schools. Doesn't matter if we pull our children and give them the best education money can buy, as they will live in a country controlled by the 87% with a public education.

When talking to many of those in public, I often hear that those tax payers "don't care" because they "don't have kids in the schools". Great! Just remember that we're graduating students where less than 40% are proficient in any given subject. When you're older and in a nursing home, guess who's going to be taking care of you? When you're older and getting taxed out of your home, guess who's going to be the politicians voting for that? You either start fixing it now, or we'll be dealing with the consequences for quite some time.

Some states hold a requirement to educate the public, others do not.

At this point, I think it’s clear the current system is a failure.

It’s not a money issue - Baltimore has some of the highest per capita budgets, but the worst? outcome.

I happen to agree that an educated voter base is a good investment- but the current system is incapable of delivering it.

At a minimum, an educated citizen must be taught basic civics and economics, and enough English and Math to comprehend it.

Probably enough history to enable the students to understand the reasons for the American position on civics and economics.

SC doesn’t even teach civics and economics.

You need a system that will deliver it.

You need recipients who will accept it.

You need a culture that values and prioritizes education over extracurricular. Extracurricular is good and valuable but secondary to education. When the "system" gets more budget and opts for a nicer football stadium instead of better education, then culturally we've failed, systemically we've failed, and personally we've failed. (not individually but as groups).

I'm not sure what it means to fix schools. But I'm gonna guess that even if schools were "fixed" that things won't change much. Agree that this is not a money issue at all. Funding is not the problem (I think schools are overfunded; this is not to say teachers are overpaid.).

Schools aren't the problem. It's the population and culture.

The only way to save public education is to completely dismantle the current system and start over.

The next step is to get educated educators. We don’t have that right now. We have highly indoctrinated people pretending to be educators.

Go back to the basics.

^^^^ Yup. And if you cannot do that, then it's just BS talk.

Two crucial steps to take:

1. Get rid of the department of education. The federal government should have zero say/influence as to what happens in local school districts.

2. Start holding parents feet to the fire when it comes to the education of their children. It's education, not a babysitting service. Little pookie wants to fuck around in school, then the parent(s) need to pay the price if little pookie doesn't want to stay disciplined.

Public anything sucks.

How about we stop putting the .gov in charge of EVERYTHING?

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Some states hold a requirement to educate the public, others do not.

Doesn't matter who's responsible, it only matters that it gets done. I also agree with the remainder of your post.

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Schools aren't the problem. It's the population and culture.

There's plenty of blame on both sides. However, each side points the finger at the other while neither side is correcting the issues. It seems that everybody keeps fixing it until it's completely broken.

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Go back to the basics.

Those who are "educated" would disagree, but I too think this is exactly what needs to happen.

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1. Get rid of the department of education. The federal government should have zero say/influence as to what happens in local school districts.

100%. There even needs to be some easing up at the state level. Schools should be under (mostly) local control.

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2. Start holding parents feet to the fire when it comes to the education of their children. It's education, not a babysitting service. Little pookie wants to fuck around in school, then the parent(s) need to pay the price if little pookie doesn't want to stay disciplined

The schools could also hold the students responsible, but often they don't for a myriad of reasons.

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Public anything sucks.

How about we stop putting the .gov in charge of EVERYTHING?

Because all things government must continue to grow. It must always gain more power, control, and funding.

Vouchers would solve a sizable percentage of the problems…which is why we’ll never see a voucher system implemented.

Ideally, a public school system but with significant choice, maybe vouchers, would be best, because education is partly for civic unity.
This is--and historically was--particularly important when a large proportion of school pupils are recent immigrants, who need to be assimilated into a common culture.
In the past virtually everyone agreed with this idea. In the present it is progressives and their paramilitary affiliates the teachers' unions have pushed divisiveness; denouncing the idea of assimilation to a common culture; and teaching that America is a force for evil, not good.

A teacher told me that the cost of education is six times more expensive than in 1970.

The cost of interpreters , security, special needs humans, insurance and benefits has not been sufficiently accounted for.

The Moline, illinois school district has 12 interpreters.

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The only way to save public education is to completely dismantle the current system and start over.

When I was first elected to the local school board my brother asked me (jokingly, of course): "How many For Sale signs do you need?"

I do wish there was an informed public willing to vote for change. We were better off 50 + years ago; we provided better basic education for far less money than it consumes today.

The biggest trap that people fall for is the ‘cost per student’ which is bogus. Spend less money on worthless technology and get back to the basics. Real textbooks that you have to read.

Learn how to write. Learn how to do math. Ban common core crap and go back to what we were doing that educated us enough to put a man on the moon in 1969.

And get rid of the teachers unions and the Department of Education. What does a bureaucrat in DC know about the 3R’s in Arizona?

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Spend less money on worthless technology and get back to the basics. Real textbooks that you have to read.

Often on the forum you'll see me comment about "the power going out" one day and how it will impact society.

I mention this to my now 13 year old son all of the time. At no point in human history have we ever had just about every bit of human knowledge accessible any time and anywhere. Yet in modern history, I'm not so sure humans have ever been as dumb as they are today.

A local school district experienced this scenario this last school year when their computer system was hacked. They had to close the school for almost a week. No textbooks, so the student laptops were all they had. Couldn't take attendance. Couldn't even open the doors to the school which are all computer controlled.

Technology sure is convenient until the day that it isn't.

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Roughly 87% of our nation's children will attend public schools.
Doesn't matter if we pull our children and give them the best education money can buy, as they will live in a country controlled by the 87% with a public education.

Not sure I agree or understand these statements.

While, I fully agree that there are deficiencies in education, I don't quite connect-the-dots with the "control" part?