quote:

Originally posted by nhracecraft:

quote:

Originally posted by kkina:

quote:

Originally posted by DirectDrive:
The trigger blade safety may help some, although Glock with the blade safety had numerous ND/AD events when first being introduced.
Agree that there should have been an option for a Police Version of P320 with the MS like M17/18

Yes, good point and I agree. There are people (some rather well-known) who think Glocks should also have manual safeties.

I guess they could do both as well, but personally, I would push for the thumb safety alone. Again, no need to redesign anything, just make the optional safety no longer optional but mandatory.

Mandatory seems a bit extreme...You can do as you please, but leave the rest of us out of it, thank you!

Don't mean to use such a loaded word, but I nonetheless think no 320s should be sold without one or the other type of safety. I guess we'll agree to disagree.

I don't know why Sig only has the Compact version with the manual safety available commercially. It's also only Massachusetts compliant with 10rd magazines. I'm sure a Department could order Full size versions with regular capacity mags but their officers probably don't want them with the safeties.

quote:

I cannot envision any way that simple lateral pressure on the trigger could cause a discharge, even with significant independent rearward movement.

Correct, simple lateral force on the side of the trigger would not per se cause rearward movement, but add in a secondary vector to the rear and the trigger would actuate.

Exactly what would happen if you insert the weapon into a poorly-designed holster. The side of the holster presses against the side of the trigger. That gives it a certain amount of lateral grip force. Then pushing deeper into the holster moves the trigger and releases the striker. It's actually all very simple.

quote:

Originally posted by kkina:
It's actually all very simple.

Uh ..., yes: Push/pull/press or otherwise move the trigger to the rear and the striker will be released. That is how the gun is designed to function.

Perhaps you did not understand what I was saying.
Or perhaps I did not understand your simple explanation.

Well, perhaps...but my intent was not to impugn your fine detective work, Sigfreund. Just wanted to take your excellent findings a step further.

This is an interesting document posted on another forum. I don’t think it applies to holstered discharges, but 320 owners should be aware.

https://john1911.com/wp-conten...Publish-Approved.pdf

quote:

Originally posted by Voshterkoff:
This is an interesting document posted on another forum.

Indeed it is, and is something everyone with a P320 should be aware of. Thank you.

The bulletin indicates that if the safety lever (striker block) is “missing” or doesn’t protrude down through the bottom of the striker assembly that that’s an indication it’s broken. Although that’s true, it could still be broken and/or the safety lever spring could be missing even if the safety lever itself is visible.

Quick checks:
Is the safety lever present and protruding from the bottom of the striker assembly?
When pressing on the safety lever, does it move back under spring pressure?
When pressing forward on the striker lug, does the striker move forward so that the firing pin protrudes through the breech face?

I believe this issue deserves a separate thread.

Added: I did post a detailed description of the issue in the pistols section, but as I think about the Army report, I find it hard to believe that safety lever parts could just disappear from the striker assembly unless the striker was removed from the slide. In that case it was probably by an unauthorized user or perhaps a poorly-trained or careless armorer. Just speculation, but Occam’s razor and all that.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: sigfreund, July 30, 2023 04:04 PM

I could see the value of a grip safety like the Springfield Armory pistols have applied to the Sig P320.

I would much rather have a manual thumb-operated safety than a safety that requires a proper grip on the pistol to release. I have read of too many incidents in which officers were injured and partially disabled. Although that could still be a problem with a thumb safety, once it's off, it's off and doesn't have to be reengaged after reloading or other action such as switching to the other hand.

quote:

Originally posted by kkina:
[M]y intent was not to impugn ....

I meant to respond to this earlier.
I have a tendency to misconstrue other people's posts, and should avoid responding unless I am certain what is meant.

^No worries. Your in-depth contributions to threads is always impressive and appreciated.

quote:

Originally posted by wcb6092:
I could see the value of a grip safety like the Springfield Armory pistols have applied to the Sig P320.

Although rare, the grip safety has been a point of failure on XD platform guns, which is why HS Produkt/Springfield Armory elected to leave it off their next generation handguns: the Hellcat and Echelon platforms.

I stopped carrying my XD as a daily carry specifically because of the grip safety.

Never had an issue with it under normal circumstances, but I performed a drill where I imagined a situation where I was in a tight quarters struggle and had to draw and fire my gun when I was for instance on the ground or pinned in some way, and 30% of the time I didn't get a full grip on the gun even though it was pointed at the "bad guy" and I was able to squeeze the trigger. But because of the grip safety, the striker wouldn't drop and the gun wouldn't "fire." Obviously I was dry firing.

After that, I just couldn't trust it as a daily carry. Still a great shooting pistol though.

quote:

Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:
I stopped carrying my XD as a daily carry specifically because of the grip safety.

Never had an issue with it under normal circumstances, but I performed a drill where I imagined a situation where I was in a tight quarters struggle and had to draw and fire my gun when I was for instance on the ground or pinned in some way, and 30% of the time I didn't get a full grip on the gun even though it was pointed at the "bad guy" and I was able to squeeze the trigger. But because of the grip safety, the striker wouldn't drop and the gun wouldn't "fire." Obviously I was dry firing.

After that, I just couldn't trust it as a daily carry. Still a great shooting pistol though.

That is an interesting point I had never considered. Since the 1911 has had the same type of grip safety since it was first made, I just assumed it worked fine because they are still making them like that today, saw decades of use in the military and law enforcement.

When it comes to holsters, when I buy one for my 320 (Glocks, too) I test it by putting an unloaded gun in and out of the holster about 100 times or so. I twist it and torque it to see if I can get the striker to activate. If I was a 320 armed cop, you can bet I would test the crap out of my duty holster to make sure it was safe.
A while back, I shitcanned an unmarked Kydex holster a friend gave me on a trade. He said it fit a Glock 19. Nope. It was so loose the gun would almost turn 90 degrees in it.
Bottom line: Thoroughly test holsters for striker guns. They are as vital to safe carry as the guns safety systems are.

I have 4 1911’s of various ilks. I can easily grab a couple of them single handed and my grip won’t actuate the safety. 2 handed it has never occurred. 1 handed its a 1 in 4 let’s say. That may be an exaggeration but I’m ok with that because any time it occurs is too many. It is easily my best reason why 1911’s are range toys in my hand.

It would take an act of god for a Safariland 6-series light bearing holster to trip a trigger.

Just curious
Any Sig 365’s reported to just go bang?
Design and all that stuff…

quote:

Originally posted by Voshterkoff:
It would take an act of god for a Safariland 6-series light bearing holster to trip a trigger.

Of course, this assumes that the Holster is designed for the EXACT model Pistol in question, with the EXACT model Light mounted on the Pistol though...And therein lies the problem sometimes.

Trying to get an overview:

Is holstering a round-chambered/fully-cocked P320 somewhat the same

as holstering a round-chambered/fully-cocked/safety-off Hi Power,

or a loaded DA/SA revolver with the hammer fully cocked?

Relatively short, lightweight trigger pulls ready to go?

This message has been edited. Last edited by: RichardC, July 31, 2023 10:31 AM