There are way too many photos and charts to post the entire article.

From NASA To Amtrak, These Are All The Government Agencies With Tactical Teams

A recent review of federal law enforcement tactical teams explores various units spread across 18 different government agencies.

BY JOSEPH TREVITHICK
SEPTEMBER 16, 2020

The Government Accountability Office, a Congressional watchdog, has released a new audit of "federal tactical teams," or specialized law enforcement units, often generically referred to as SWAT teams, across the U.S. federal government. These range from better-known organizations, such as the Federal Bureau of Investigation's Hostage Rescue Team and the U.S. Secret Service's Counter Sniper Team, to much more obscure ones, including those that fall under the National Institutes of Health and Amtrak...

Much more here:

https://www.thedrive.com/the-w...-with-tactical-teams

I might be incorrect here but I am pretty sure Amtrak’s Police Department is a private department and not a governmental agency?

While they may frequently partner with local, state, federal, and likely Canadian departments I am pretty sure they are private.

Most railroad police are private entities.
Pretty sure CSX and Norfolk Southern have a combined tactical team.

Been awhile since I have done anything with the big railroad companies but that is how it was explained to me a number of years ago.

They're considered a federal law enforcement agency.

Even though Amtrak is a quasi-independent company, it's wholly owned by the federal government, and it was federal legislation that established the Amtrak police and granted them federal law enforcement authority, with interstate police powers.

You may be thinking of some of the other private "railroad police" agencies, which are allowed to be certified as law enforcement despite being employees of wholly private companies, like BNSF, Union Pacific, etc.

Meh, nothing to see here.

About every county in my state has some type of SWAT, Tactical Negotiation Team, Emergency Response Team, or whatever else you choose to call them.

They're everywhere. Everybody has one.

I work white-collar cases and at least eight of the scary things they chart in that article are either a) in the back of my work truck or b) in my bag right now.

If they saw what the DSS MSD guys routinely play with, they'd crap themselves. If they saw what DoE Nuclear Material Couriers have in their arsenal they'd go into immediate cardiac arrest.

We don’t have a tactical team but we do have an anthem...

https://youtu.be/Pw9pNrMRlto

The article says Amtrak has 25 "swat" operators. Google shows Amtrak operates on 21,000 miles of track. Thats 840+ miles for each operator.

How could they possibly get a team together in a reasonable amount of time to respond to an incident? At what point do they not serve a purpose?

By that chart, it looks like these fed teams are woefully under-equipped with revolvers.

Interesting article. What's also interesting is the number of federal agencies that have employees who carry firearms and have arrest authority. From the following article: "More than a few eyebrows were raised in 2010 when the U.S. Department of Agriculture bought 85 fully automatic submachine guns."

The Social Security Administration, for example, has a firearms budget. The SSA OIG agents carry weapons and make arrests. (These are not the private contract security guards that provide security in SSA offices.) Why is this necessary? Well, some specialization is necessary. If SSA has a fraud case and had to contact the FBI to investigate it, how much priority would the case get, as opposed to bank robberies and all of items the FBI has on their plate? Not much. Having an SSA OIG insures that these cases get investigated and prosecuted. The SSA OIG makes more arrests than all of the other OIG Agents from the other agencies combined. Not a surprise considering the size of the program.

Here is the link to the article: https://www.thoughtco.com/fire...ral-agencies-3321279

quote:

Originally posted by DennisM:
If they saw what the DSS MSD guys routinely play with, they'd crap themselves. If they saw what DoE Nuclear Material Couriers have in their arsenal they'd go into immediate cardiac arrest.

Hahahahaha indeed. I have a friend of mine who is middle management with their tactical side.

Everything from Stingers and Dillion’s to small arms.

quote:

If they saw what DoE Nuclear Material Couriers have in their arsenal they'd go into immediate cardiac arrest.

Yep. I had one of those guys as my partner for an Active Shooter Response Instructor course. He had all kinds of nice toys.

quote:

Originally posted by jljones:

quote:

Originally posted by DennisM:
If they saw what the DSS MSD guys routinely play with, they'd crap themselves. If they saw what DoE Nuclear Material Couriers have in their arsenal they'd go into immediate cardiac arrest.

Hahahahaha indeed. I have a friend of mine who is middle management with their tactical side.

Everything from Stingers and Dillion’s to small arms.

Have a friend over at Lawrence Livermore Lab, their armory is...impressive.


People like to make hay over the number of 'tactical teams' that exist around the country. Then you remind them that, we're the 3rd most populace country in the world, and 4th largest by landmass. When things go bad and you need a specialized unit...how long should it take for them to get there?

10 or so years ago I was putting my wife on Amtrak early in the morning and decided to take some pictures of the Train with my new Nikon... after about five minutes a guy comes out of no where (bushes) and tells me it is a federal crime to take pictures of a passenger train... per the patriot act. (you can't make this stuff up)

Unless there is no other agency then this is another reason why our country is heading to hyoer inflation and devaluation of our dollar. We waste tax money on unnecessary things due to perceived needs. I would think the FBI team could handle anything CONUS. We are almost to the point where we can't pay the interest we owe, I guess when our country goes into financial collapse we will find out what we really need. Any private business would need to justify benefits of anything they have and non essentials usually get cut. How many businesses scaled down during Covid just to survive? Not our government though, they can print more money until it's worth nothing.

quote:

Originally posted by Oat_Action_Man:
By that chart, it looks like these fed teams are woefully under-equipped with revolvers.

Yes, what was missing was more interesting than what was there. Not everyone has aiming devices, really? What agency is running around without sights

quote:

Originally posted by slosig:

quote:

Originally posted by Oat_Action_Man:
By that chart, it looks like these fed teams are woefully under-equipped with revolvers.

Yes, what was missing was more interesting than what was there. Not everyone has aiming devices, really? What agency is running around without sights

GAO = A congressional clown show. The agencies interviewed probably assumed that it wasn't necessary to explicitly say that.

quote:

Originally posted by DennisM:
The agencies interviewed probably assumed that it wasn't necessary to explicitly say that.

That, or USMS SOG told them to "fuck off" when asked that question too, like they did when asked how many team members they had.

quote:

Originally posted by mrvmax:
I would think the FBI team could handle anything CONUS.

Putting aside the fact that the FBI is an investigative agency (it's right there in the name) and not our national police force, they have tactical teams for the same reason the rest of us do: Because no other agencies have a particularly great interest in doing OUR work for us, to include such things as guarding embassies for the DOS, arresting Federal probation/supervised release violators for the USMS, guarding nuclear materials in transit for the DoE, flying on planes for the FAMS, serving immigration-based warrants for ICE/HSI, or taking down clandestine labs in wilderness areas for USFS/NPS/BLM/etc, among many others.

Unless you do want a single, omnipotent, all-seeing national Gendarmerie? If so, I'm still not entirely sure that you want the FBI to be that agency.

Saying the FBI (or any other single agency) should be the go-to for EVERYTHING is like saying you should just have general practitioners in medicine. What the heck, my dermatologist has a degree... I'm sure she can do a cardiac cath, too...

quote:

Originally posted by mrvmax:
Unless there is no other agency then this is another reason why our country is heading to hyoer inflation and devaluation of our dollar. We waste tax money on unnecessary things due to perceived needs. I would think the FBI team could handle anything CONUS. We are almost to the point where we can't pay the interest we owe, I guess when our country goes into financial collapse we will find out what we really need. Any private business would need to justify benefits of anything they have and non essentials usually get cut. How many businesses scaled down during Covid just to survive? Not our government though, they can print more money until it's worth nothing.

So, who will pick up the FBI's investigative mission, and how will that be funded? What you propose, based upon demand, is turning the Feeb into a full time tactical unit. And how do you propose funding all the additional equipment for the FBI?

I think you may still be buying into this idea that everyone has a SWAT team because it is cool, and they are just sitting around doing nothing but looking at their "toys". ("Toys" was what everyone in the 2000s called reasoning for tactical units, so I suppose in 2020, it's still toys, eh?).

The realistic view is tactical teams in 2020 are turning down operations because they are stretched too thin. Fed teams cover vast areas, and are in high demand. All federal teams, to include the ones that you look at the why and you scratch your head over. They may work for the USDA, or whatever, but wind up serving a FBI warrant out of the local RA. So, feds then use local teams. Guess what? Local teams do local stuff first, and loan themselves out to the feds second. This often causes agents to serve their own warrants on people that by all means should be a SWAT call. This leads to mistakes, and lawsuits due to the fact that they aren't properly trained or equipped to do the job they were sent into.

Lawsuits cost money.

Basically, you can choose to pay for it now. Or you can pay for it on the back side.

And as an addendum, bean counters in agencies look to cut special teams and training first when they are in need of money to cover budget shortfalls. There is no magical SWAT union that has kept these teams afloat. If they couldn't justify their piece of the pie they got defunded. (ala all of the teams that popped up in the 90s that have went away since). Liars and hacks like Radley Balko and Peter Kraska made a fine living off of seeing a tactical team behind every tree, and "researching" a false narrative at the CATO institute on it for years. They were the golden goose of these types of threads for years.

The sad state of affairs is LE special operations in busier than ever. It's a cross section of the society in which we live.

You want to save money? Figure out how to decrease the type crimes that create the demand. THEN you will be onto something.