Carriers face a quandary when contagious fliers board planes—an issue with higher stakes during the coronavirus pandemic

The child in the window seat was sneezing and coughing. Passengers nearby grew increasingly nervous that perhaps the kid had Covid-19 and was spreading the virus. The mother claimed allergies; flight attendants said there was nothing they could do.

Sick passengers on airplanes have become a deeper concern for travelers during the pandemic, as this scene was for a friend of mine. The controversy around how airlines treat the sick has grown, since they give passengers a big financial incentive to fly while ill.

Most carriers in the U.S., and many others around the world, charge fliers the difference in fare between their discounted advance-purchase ticket and a new ticket to travel after illness recovery. That often means a one-way unrestricted walk-up fare, usually hundreds and even thousands of dollars more, which some fliers can’t afford and none are happy to pay.



“The pandemic has really underscored the need for a sick-passenger rule,” says Charles Leocha, president of Travelers United, a Washington, D.C., advocacy group. “Something needs to be done to give people an affordable alternative.”

He faced the issue when he got sick in Spain four years ago. Delaying his trip home would cost $2,000 in airfare, even though he had a note from the doctor who had just treated him at a hospital for an infectious lung ailment, as well as X-rays. Rather than wait until his fever and cough subsided, he got on the flight—and soon after began advocating for a rule addressing very sick passengers.

Airlines argue that removing all financial penalties for sick passengers would mean anyone could extend a trip just by feigning illness. That would upend the entire fare structure. Need another day to close a deal? Meet a new friend and want to stay longer? Just tell the airline you’re not feeling well and fly whenever you want, as long as there’s an open seat.

Requiring a doctor’s note has proved a feeble deterrent in the past—just look at the wave of emotional support animals enabled by doctor’s orders purchased online.

Airlines for America, the industry’s trade group, says passengers who worry about the cost of getting sick could purchase full-price refundable fares. The group also notes that many airlines have done away with most change fees, which had been added on top of fare differences before, and some have been more lenient with allowing ticket changes during the pandemic.

“The adjustment of travel policies to offer vouchers and credit is an effort by carriers to be responsive to customer needs and allow passengers to avoid traveling when they are sick,” an Airlines for America spokeswoman says in an email. “We encourage travelers to communicate with their carrier regarding individual circumstances.”

A Senate committee recently passed an airline-industry health-safety bill with bipartisan support that calls for establishing a joint task force on air travel during and after the pandemic. The task force would be expected to issue recommendations on health, safety, security and logistical challenges for air travel.

In an interview, Sen. Richard Blumenthal, the Connecticut Democrat who co-sponsored the health-safety legislation, calls airline handling of sick passengers “really insidious malevolence,” because it encourages dangerous travel.

“What they are doing now is creating incentives for sick or contagious people to fly. That really can’t be good for their own employees,” he says, adding that now is a good time for airlines to reconsider travel policy and penalties because carriers got gigantic government bailout support in the pandemic.

Airlines have been pushing improved health standards and practices during the pandemic, trying to reassure customers that getting scrunched next to other passengers is safe because of robust ventilation and enhanced cleaning procedures. Studies have shown that diseases can spread in cabins, with higher occurrence for people within two rows of an infected passenger.



United got the Cleveland Clinic to endorse its health standards; Delta is working with the Mayo Clinic on health issues. Both medical organizations say they can’t comment on airline policies regarding sick passengers.

“Our work with Delta is intended to help make travel safer, or as safe as possible, but of course there are limitations to that,” a spokeswoman for the Mayo Clinic said in an email.

Some carriers do make accommodations for sick passengers. Singapore Airlines lets sick passengers delay a flight and travel on their original ticket within the same season. A Singapore spokesman says the carrier hasn’t had a problem with passengers abusing the flexibility offered to sick passengers.

Air Canada says it introduced a refundable fare called Comfort in 2018 that gives passengers more ability to make changes to plans. On a Houston-Toronto round trip for September, Comfort fares this week were almost double the lowest economy fare, $754 compared with $388. A spokesman also suggests that customers concerned about having to pay more if they get ill should purchase travel insurance.

Like higher refundable fares, purchasing travel insurance means an added cost whether you get sick or not. And if the illness is related to a pre-existing condition, many travel insurance policies won’t cover added travel costs.

Mr. Leocha, the consumer advocate, says he doesn’t have an answer for how airlines should handle sick passengers because he expects people would take advantage of that leniency, as they did with their pets.

“It’s a tough call. However, it’s a call that the airlines have to figure out,” he says. “Right now, airlines have no way to say someone can’t fly.

link: https://www.wsj.com/articles/w...sjhp_columnists_pos2

I've been on 3 flights in my life that had Medical Emergencies while in flight.

I've got a friend who's a retired Airline Captain and his wife is a retired stewardess (I still call them that). I asked how many medical emergencies happened on his flights. He said none. I asked how many medical emergencies on his wife's flights. The next day, he told me, none.

How is it I end up on planes with sick people? Not just sick, but sick enough the Captain asks if there's a Doctor on the plane.

Incidentally, each time 3 or 4 doctors would present themselves, so I guess a lot of them fly.

People who are ill will continue to fly, and try and hide it if airlines start restricting seats to those who are sick, or charge fees, higher fares.

You'll never know Mrs. Smith has the flu until she gets aboard and starts coughing or throwing up, these things are flying petri dishes...

Once again government trying to fix a problem that doesn't really need fixing...

quote:

etired stewardess (I still call them that)

Sky waitress

-- (Third Rock from the Sun)

That’s hard to believe. I have been an airline pilot for 22 years and there are medical emergencies quite often. They usually still involve going to the original destination but to go an entire career or two without having one is unheard of.

People aren’t healthy. Drugs and alcohol don’t help. I’ve never had anybody die though so there’s that.

That idea in the article is fucking idiotic. It would be abused exactly as described. The airlines also want no part in determining if a passenger is “sick enough” not to fly. What’s next? A nurse at the mall telling you that you can’t come in because she heard you sneeze?

Nanny state nonsense.

Or people could just stop freaking out about someone coughing or sneezing FFS

People cough. People sneeze. All the time.

And sneezing WAS NEVER a symptom of Covid, then or now.

quote:

Originally posted by ZSMICHAEL:
Airlines for America, the industry’s trade group, says passengers who worry about the cost of getting sick could purchase full-price refundable fares.

It isn't the people getting sick who're worried about it. It's the other people in the cabin with them. The people to whom they might spread whatever infectious thing they have.

It's not that people who are sick should be allowed to re-schedule for their own good, but that they should be required to reschedule for the good of the rest of the passengers.

Hospital, doctor's office, and dentist's office personnel will take ones temperature before being allowed to enter. One presumes they'll be shown the door if they have a high temperature. The same should be true of flying metal tube transports. Particularly with the way airlines have now have people crammed in asshole-to-elbow

Though it doesn't matter all that much to me anymore. I've flown a total of four times in the last decade or more. I used to love flying. Back then my break-even between flying and driving was around 3-4 hours. Now I hate flying and avoid it to the extent possible. My driving/flying break-even is now out to 10-12 hours. That's how much I hate flying these days.

quote:

Airlines argue that removing all financial penalties for sick passengers would mean anyone could extend a trip just by feigning illness. That would upend the entire fare structure.

As a former high-tier frequent flyer, I say the entire fare structure needs to be upended. Entire model is bite the hand that feeds you.

quote:

Entire model is bite the hand that feeds you.

Business paid for airline travel.

The entire concept of travel for business is upended, and all the legos have fallen out.

</chris>

quote:

Originally posted by tatortodd:

I say the entire fare structure needs to be upended. Entire model is bite the hand that feeds you.

Does anybody remember airline travel prior to 1978?

There were not a bazillion different fares for the same seat on the same flight.

There were many more direct city-to-city flights, instead of the hub-and-spoke model that we now have, which requires you to fly to someplace you don't want to go, in order to get to where you do want to go.

Thankfully, I have no need for airline travel now, but when I did, the pre-1978 model worked a heck of a lot better for me.

quote:

Originally posted by PASig:
Or people could just stop freaking out about someone coughing or sneezing FFS

People cough. People sneeze. All the time.

And sneezing WAS NEVER a symptom of Covid, then or now.

Exactly. For chrissakes, what a topsy-turvy world.

Same as it ever was. You’re tightly packed in a tube with recirculated air with 100 strangers for hours. It’s a chance you take. If you’re worried about COVID, get the vaccine or drive instead. Otherwise, man up and take your chances like everyone else.

A few weeks ago, a crew member said he felt fine when we arrived for an overnight. In the morning, he said he didn't sleep well, had a headache. The next day, he told me he tested positive for Covid. I was headed for China at the time, and that presented a problem for me.

Sick people or medical emergencies on airplanes. I've seen quite a few, from passengers losing consciousness to a pilots and crew collapsing as the flight was being prepared. I've had it in the cockpit, and several times as a passenger, I've ended up giving aid to other passengers who collapsed, including doing compressions until we could get on the ground. It happens. Conversely, I began giving a woman aid on a flight over the Atlantic, and was soon replaced by three doctors and six nurses who were nearby.

People with covid on a flight, or other illnesses? Averages say it's inevitable.

The entire cabin air is constantly being replaced, and it's replaced every few minutes, as compressed bleed air is pumped on board from the engines, and let out through the outflow valves; it's how the aircraft is pressurized. whatever air you're breathing right now won't be the same air you're breathing a few seconds or a minute from now. It's very different than sitting in room with someone.

I am exposed to different crew members regularly. We've had a lot of them get sick. Some very sick. No deaths in our group, thus far. But quite sick. I don't wear a mask in the cockpit; it affects my ability to see with my glasses, and interferes with the ability to get an oxygen mask on in the event of smoke or a loss of cabin pressure. Going without the mask is simply the way it's got to be, and part of the job.

People in the cabin who are sick? Yes. Every airline I'm aware of has warnings that people can't fly sick, but it's not like everyone gets a physical exam to get on the airplane. Now that passenger load factors are back up and every flight is full, everyone is cattle-car jammed together.

Another concern going into this fall will be the various flu and colds that will be going around. With everyone practicing distance handwashing, and all the other precautions, few have been getting sick...that's going to rebound with a vengence, and all the other things people pass around.

I still maintain that the main source of illness in my family for years was what kids brought home from school.

For a bunch of guys who jump to defend crazy capitalism price gouging nonsense you guys sure seem ok with re regulating airlines. Fuck that. You don’t like the price? Drive.

Americans are such whiny bitches. Go look at prices adjusted for inflation back in the good old days. There was a reason flights seemed genteel. Only the wealthy could afford flying.

As for taking your temperature, also fuck that. You sound like you will be wearing your mask for the rest of your life. You can catch anything anywhere. I don’t want to live in an America where some “illness nazi” is taking temperatures in every public place to allow or deny entry. Nope. You guys have been brainwashed.

Just about every country I enter has a temperature monitor. All our crew members pass through it. I don't think any have ever been flagged as sick, based on the temperature. Given that most carriers of covid have been asymptomatic, temperature isn't much of a metric to see if someone is sick.

I do carry a thermometer and I do take my temperature daily, because I do not want to get stuck somewhere if I end up with an elevated temperature (china, for example). Better to catch it early and stay in the hotel, rather than go to the next stop and get quarantined.

So far as taking the temp of passengers, it won't do much except identify the few who are actually running a temperature.

Even most of our crew who got sick, weren't running a temp. Not at first, anyway. They had other signs and symptoms, but the temp wasn't one of the early ones. Most countries still use that for every passenger entering, however, and even hotels where I stay often take the temperature.

quote:

Originally posted by pedropcola:
For a bunch of guys who jump to defend crazy capitalism price gouging nonsense you guys sure seem ok with re regulating airlines. Fuck that. You don’t like the price? Drive.

Slow your roll. You're making a red herring argument. Our argument is the model sucks but you're misrepresenting it as we hate capitalism and want government to swoop in and change it. One poster merely remembered fondly a better travel experience with more direct flights and different price structure, but never called for the government to mandate it. Efficient market theory actually says that if the government does NOT swoop in then the market which will correct itself due to the reality of virtual business. The fact is those of us who used to business travel are now doing everything virtually. It turns out a lot of business trips were just people meeting in a meeting room where a lot of them spent thousands or tens of thousands to be there. Instead, that meeting is now virtual and the biggest expense is time. It's getting to be a pretty high bar to justify a business trip.

In other words, somebody will figure out something better than the status quo and the b-school lemmings will all follow suit. That's upending the business model without the damn government.

quote:

Originally posted by tatortodd:

quote:

Airlines argue that removing all financial penalties for sick passengers would mean anyone could extend a trip just by feigning illness. That would upend the entire fare structure.

As a former high-tier frequent flyer, I say the entire fare structure needs to be upended. Entire model is bite the hand that feeds you.

I thought the fare structure was pretty much in line.

How would you like it to be? Serious question.

quote:

Originally posted by ZSMICHAEL:
…Airlines argue that removing all financial penalties for sick passengers would mean anyone could extend a trip just by feigning illness. That would upend the entire fare structure. Need another day to close a deal? Meet a new friend and want to stay longer? Just tell the airline you’re not feeling well and fly whenever you want, as long as there’s an open seat.

link: https://www.wsj.com/articles/w...sjhp_columnists_pos2

Oh no! People have plans that change? This complaint from the same industry that was bailed out with public funds and have zero issues overbooking seats and bumping people because of their overbooking policies?

They can get fucked. Flying should not be financially debilitating.

quote:

Originally posted by Flash-LB:
I thought the fare structure was pretty much in line.

How would you like it to be? Serious question.

Their prices are disconnected from their expenses. A few examples:

It costs them the same fly to from Point A to Point B no matter when their customer buys the ticket. Servicing debt, air crew, ground crew, jet A, snacks, airport fees, etc. They start ramping up their rates inside of 21-days when the majority of business travel is booked.

A few years ago, I needed to go to Edmonton for business and then Upper Midwest for personal. It was 30% cheaper to book Houston to MSP to Edmonton to MSP to Houston to Upper Midwest to Houston than the the route that cost them the least amount of jet A and hours on their airframe. Even more idiotic, MSP was a hub serving the location in the Upper Midwest so that wasn't a factor.

Sundays and Fridays are big business travel days so flights cost more on these days even though their expenses are the same.

Their fees are disconnected from their expenses. A few examples:

You can change your flight from your phone/computer so it's not costing them employee time. It just has IT expenses and a very tiny opportunity cost.

At the same time one side of their business is trying to gouge existing customers for change fees, the other side of their business is trying to sell empty seats on discount websites. The reality is a person with 70ish pounds of luggage costs them very small incremental amount of money versus an empty seat.

The opportunity cost for them is the cubic feet the customer and their luggage use. A customer bringing the same bag as carry-on or checked takes the same cubic feet on plane and its weight consumes the same amount of Jet A. Their fee is a profit center not reflective of the difference in handling costs between them handling and customer handling. Alaska Airlines used to host luncheons for high-tier frequent flyers and they'd put an executive at each table plus have a speaker. This was when everybody in industry was adding baggage fees so of course the executive at my table was asked about it. His response was, "if I eliminate it, tell me how I'm going to make up for the billion $ income from it?" The only answer is that they can't charge the high fee if competitors quit charging it.

The portion of business world who used to travel has now spent over a year virtual:

Many business are finding they can get same or more done with less people because its people aren't experiencing all of the nonproductive time they used to spend when they flew (e.g. driving to airport, going through security, queuing up to board/deplane, the time when electronics have to be turned off between gate and 10k feet, etc).

If a meeting time/day changes in the virtual meeting, nobody is paying any change fees.

If somebody wants to bring 3 bags to a meeting it doesn't cost them any more than somebody bringing 2 bags.

Nobody is using an hotels, taxis/ubers, paid parking, charging any meals, etc. to attend a virtual meeting that occurs both Tuesday and Wednesday.

A meeting doesn't cost more if it starts on a Monday or ends on a Friday.

A meeting costs the same whether it's booked 22 days in advance or 2 days in advance

Granted, there are some efficiencies in face to face meetings:

better relationship building

better picking up tone and non-verbal communication

Less IT issues. I attended a 100% virtual industry conference in March that had so much potential. More people were able to attend because of no travel costs, but there was a SNAFU in the live virtual conference software. Even on the lowest resolution (e.g. one I would've used 15 years ago), it would be buffering 90% of the time. When it wasn't buffering, lowest resolution also meant nobody could read everything on a slide. Ended up punting and watched the recorded sessions a day or two later which meant no interaction with speaker.

In the current and future business climate, I'd envision them doing the following to stay relevant:

Flights from point a to point b cost nearly the same every day of the week

Flights are discounted 21-days out (i.e. they need some certainty it's worth flying the route), but day 20 to 0 the flights cost the same.

Multileg trips cost less than 2 separate trips

Change fees only cover the cost of their IT plus a modest profit. It doesn't matter whether it's a medical reason (i.e. the point of this thread) or a business reason. Don't cost your customers time & money by having to get a damn doctor's note.

Checked baggage fees decrease. Not only does it reduce business travel costs, it also reduces some of the bad passenger behavior that frustrates business travelers.

I actually want airlines to succeed because:

I like to see the world. I no longer like the portion in airport & airplane, but I like exploring the destination. I never would've seen some of the things I've seen on business trip (e.g. polar bears in ANWR) on a personal trip.

I'm in oil & gas and we need the jet A portion of the distillation column to sell. The military and vacation travelers just don't need enough jet a.

Without business travelers traveling 12 months a year, there will be less planes for when people want to travel during summer, holidays, and spring break.

---

Ego is the anesthesia that deadens the pain of stupidity

DISCLAIMER: These are the author's own personal views and do not represent the views of the author's employer.

Thanks