“Stop sticks” are rows of hollow spikes that can be deployed across a roadway and when a vehicle drives over them they deflate the tires. I don’t have any personal experience with the devices, but every video I’ve seen of their use shows an officer attempting to throw them away from him and across the path of the approaching vehicle.

There are at least two problems with that method of getting the sticks in front of the vehicle: The officer must be skilled and strong enough to throw them to the proper position, and it requires the officer to be close to the roadway until the vehicle is very close. The latter problem is why many officers have been killed either intentionally or inadvertently by the subject vehicle. (There was another such incident just recently.)

My question for the knowledgeable, therefore, is why can’t the “sticks” package be set up across the road from the officer and rather than throwing it in front of the vehicle, it’s pulled by means of a rope across the roadway at the proper moment? If that were possible, it seems to me it would be more reliable and would allow the officer to be positioned farther from the road, possibly even concealed from the subject’s view. The only disadvantage I can see is that the deployment rope would have to lay across the road and possibly be run over by other vehicles, but would that matter? (The far end of the stick array would also have to be fixed in position by some means, but that wouldn’t seem to be very difficult—?) I have wondered about this for some time.

Comments?

I may be thinking about this incorrectly, but in order to set up the system as described, does that require the officer to make two trips across the road? (One to set the package, and another to bring the rope back.) If so, there's an additional element of danger in that, plus there's some additional time necessary for the setup.

I'm not in law enforcement and I have no experience with the device, so anything I've blurted out is -- at best -- a guess. I'm looking forward to input from those more knowledgeable than me. Thanks for asking the question!

Most of the videos you see are less than ideal deployments. Ideally. the sticks are deployed in a manner that traffic can pass and the sticks are then pulled into the roadway by the officer. The officer should have hard cover (bridge, big tree, etc). The material from Stop Stick (the brand name and probably biggest provider of the devices in the industry) are very clear on this. They also provide instructions on how to throw the sticks, that, when followed, will get you pretty good range.

The problem is that when it's go time, guys lose sight of these guidelines and try to deploy them in less than ideal circumstances. They are generally not far enough ahead of the pursuit, pick bad locations, etc. Then, on the back end, nobody rips their shit for an unsafe deployment. I'm not saying it's that way everywhere, but it's common.

My only successful stick hit was in the wee hours on an interstate. I had a trainee and sent him across the lanes with the actual sticks to place them on the shoulder. He got behind a guard rail while I pulled the sticks back from the other side of the Jersey barrier. We knew that car was coming when they were 20 miles away and they got to us in EIGHT MINUTES (it was a Corvette that was running close to 150 being pursued by the State Patrol). Even with that much warning, they were there quick.

Tire deflation devices are the Tasers of car chases. Guys try to shoe-horn them into situations where they don't work. They also try to keep stop-sticking cars that already have flat tires. Whatever. I think that the gold standard in pursuit termination is to crash them out one way or another at the first opportunity, but many agencies (including mine) are just not willing to do it.

The officer’s having to cross the road twice is a valid concern, and might make it too dangerous in some situations, but many of the videos I’ve seen don’t show that much traffic. Very often such events involve road closures behind the fleeing vehicle, so it might not always be a significant concern, especially as compared with standing right next to the road to throw the sticks across. Part of the need for that is because if they’re deployed too soon, the subject can simply swerve to avoid them.

Good point, though.

quote:

Originally posted by DaBigBR:
Ideally. the sticks are deployed in a manner that traffic can pass and the sticks are then pulled into the roadway by the officer.

So you are saying that pulling across is an approved/best method—?

I had stop sticks and Stingers and I preferred the stinger. The stop sticks I had were linked and had a weird all most fishing rod attachment to deploy and retrieve the sticks. We got rid of that damned thing and just threw them as best we could. The problem I encountered in multiple deployments was time to get them out and how they landed on rough roads.

First time I tried deploying them I parked on the side of the road and the bad guy just drove into oncoming traffic on the other side of the road.

The next time I did the same thing ran across the road and hid behind a car that was parked. The bad guy saw my police car and did the same thing. He swerved hard into oncoming traffic to get as far away from my marked police car and that made it easy for me to slide my stop stick right out in front of him. My set of stop sticks were two three foot sticks tied together. Bad guy drove over one and the other ended up laying parallel to the road markings and he drove over it. He didn't just drive over it. The stop sticks were launched into the air and it yanked the rope I was holding out of my hand. Sticks went at least 20 feet in the air.

I have never played the game of trying to get in front of the pursuit. I just pick a main road set up my car and hope he comes my way. I have managed to spike 4 cars in my 25 years as an LEO.

quote:

Originally posted by sigfreund:

quote:

Originally posted by DaBigBR:
Ideally. the sticks are deployed in a manner that traffic can pass and the sticks are then pulled into the roadway by the officer.

So you are saying that pulling across is an approved/best method—?

Yes. They should be placed and then pulled back.

A Bluffton Ohio police officer was killed early today deploying stop sticks on I75.

https://www.10tv.com/article/n...88-8cd4-830f7fd122c8

I've had two successful stick deployments. They are meant to be deployed in the manner that you described in the last paragraph of your initial post (throwing them across the road then pulling them back into the path of the suspect vehicle as it approaches), but it doesn't always play out like that.

My first one, I didn't have time to get them out across the road, or even mess with the handle. I had just pulled over and retrieved them from the back of my car when they got to me, and the bad guy actually stopped in the middle of the road just short of my squad. Knowing that the high risk stop was about to commence and the guns were going to come out with me downrange, I was just about to un-ass the area when he took off again. I just threw the whole thing, handle and all, in front of his car and managed to get two of his tires. Unfortunately, this left me no way to retrieve the sticks. The other guys were close enough to see what was going on, and went around, but another guy came flying up just as everybody else went by, and he ran them right over. So I got 2 suspect tires and 2 squad tires with the same set of sticks.

The second time was better. I had more lead time, it was the middle of the night on an empty highway, and I was able to toss them across the road and pull them back as he approached. The only bad part was I had no hard cover and had to use my squad, which wasn't ideal, but at least I had something. I got one tire, and was able to pull them out of the road before the pursuing unit got there. Another officer sticked him again about a mile down the road and got a second tire, and he ultimately gave up on his car and bailed on foot a mile after that. Joke was on him though because the guy who started the pursuit was K9, and he was right behind him when he bailed.

The big downside to the sticks being across the roadway is the cord itself. It can get wrapped around stuff or you and cause damage or serious injury. Theoretically, if you toss the sticks across the road and wait to pull them back out until the suspect gets there, other cars can just drive over the cord. It's possible, though, for that cord to get caught and wrapped around a tire or axle, and if that happens anything attached to that string is going with it, including you. I had a buddy almost lose some fingers that way when we were practicing with them in the academy. He didn't have his hand wrapped in the string or anything...it just whipped around on impact and got him. He got cut up pretty bad, but thankfully didn't lose anything permanently. I like to stick the handle on the ground once they're in place, stand upstream of it, and then pick it back up after they go by if at all possible.

quote:

Originally posted by DaBigBR:
Yes. They should be placed and then pulled back.

That was a very informative video. Thanks and thanks for all the other comments.

Couldn't something similar to a MCLC be devised to quickly throw the spike out?

flashguy

And the pursued vehicle from time to time will swerve to avoid the sticks and crash into your patrol car.
As in real estate, its location, location, location!

Everyone wants to be like Mike:

https://youtu.be/d5_b0Vs-2cY

This is the video they showed us on how NOT to do it. Warning...it's not pleasant. But it served it purpose in that it's definitely something I'm fully cognizant of every time I set up to deploy them.

We use Stingers. Kind of a pain in the ass to use w/ the accordion type action but they do deflate tires like a mother!!! We almost had a local deputy smoked by a cara little over a year ago by using the undesired let me step out and throw them in front of turd mobile. If you have time it is best to get them across the road and deploy from cover.

My record is ten tires on four cars at the same deployment site!!! Bad guy got around them but, two County Mounties and two BIA cruisers needed new shoes!!! Told them on the radio 6 times where I was set up at. Total tunnel vision/hearing.

I'm a Stop Stick instructor. It isn't rocket surgery, and pulling them across the road beats throwing them. But I've really become reticent about their use given the number of officers hurt and killed using them. The killing of the Bluffton officer was just the last of too many. Anytime you are near traffic moving at speed you are at risk.

Part of my concern stems from the jurisdiction in which I worked, made up of a lot of country roads with ditches, culverts, cattle gates, gravel and so forth. There just were too few areas where the sticks could be deployed from, so we didn't carry them. There were also few locations to PIT someone, so we tended to wait for the inevitable crash without contributing to it.

I’ve carried Stingers for years, but I haven’t ever spiked anyone…yet. I’ve been setup on the side of the road on occasions, but the pursuits just didn’t make it to me for various reasons.

I was originally trained to deploy them by throwing them out from me where they would expand out across the roadway like an old watch band. Our last training has us setting them across the roadway, and then pulling them to us to expand them across the road. The cord is designed to be driven over by vehicles, so you can wait a while with passing traffic waiting for pursuit.

After pursued vehicle gets spiked, you just yank the cord, which is connected to a spool, and pull spikes out of way of pursuing vehicles. MANY police vehicles have been spiked when officers didn’t do that effectively or fast enough.

We had a bad one in SE WI last Aug. From what I know the deputy was behind a guardrail, the stop sticks flew up & somehow wrapped around him.

He’s recovering, but I think it lead to live-long injuries.

https://www.fox6now.com/news/l...rsuit-deputy-injured

Momentum? Throwing them creates some and they self-deploy from there. Pulling them removes that, and you'd have to reel in the whole width of road. Not to mention what I assume is a significant risk of having ahold of these when a car runs over them and snags them up into wheel well, etc. Less than zero actual experience here admittedly. CPAs experience with spike strips is typically a flight of tequila.....

Oops - you said knowledgable....

I’ve had one successful deployment and that was on a vehicle going slow for a pursuit. I absolutely hate using them for the danger reasons that have already been mentioned. It may be the thing I hate the most. Like daBigBR said, officers usually get in bad position (without hard cover and not far enough ahead to deploy them properly) and that makes for a dangerous situation. For most cops they might receive training in the academy on stop sticks and, if they’re lucky, may watch a training video once a year after. So it’s understandable that they don’t remember the training in a high adrenaline situation. Another mistake that officers make is using their vehicle as protection when deploying them.