A woman left kids sleeping in a van parked in a Walmart parking lot. She only went in to shop for a few minutes, but when she came out, the van was engulfed in flames. One child died, one was permanently disfigured. She's suing Walmart for failing "to provide staff to oversee the appropriate use of its parking lot as a campground.”

https://www.yahoo.com/news/sis...alive-171500335.html

While I'm sorry for the loss of life and disfigurement of a child why on earth would a responsible parent EVER leave small children unattended and asleep in a vehicle in a parking lot? I'm surprised the mom wasn't charges with negligence.

Why did it take three years for her to file the suit? Lawyer shopping?

I'll be surprised if Walmart doesn't prevail. Neither of the two instances of negligence (leaving the kids alone and the still-hot stove) had anything to do with any action or lack thereof by Walmart.

Regardless of the suits outcome, I'll not be surprised to see parking lot overnights end across the board i.e Cracker Barrels, Cabela's etc. Risk avoidance y'know.

Sad all around

There's a little more to the story than mom leaving kids in the car to sleep and oversight of parking lots.

The fire was started by a camping couple who cooked breakfast in the parking lot, stuck a hot cooking plate back in their van and then moved it up front by the van with the kids in it.

She's claiming that Wal-Marts open camping policy and zero supervision exposes normal shoppers to perils that might otherwise not exist such as a camping couple setting their van on fire, resulting in the death of two kids.

From the article

In a statement to McClatchy News, Walmart spokesperson Randy Hargrove said “our sympathies remain with the friends and family impacted by this tragic even three years ago,” adding that the retail corporation “plan(s) to defend the company and will respond in Court to the Complaint as appropriate. The fire started with a camping stove, investigators say. A California man was traveling with his wife in their 2005 Dodge Caravan, living out of it as they drove across the country, according to documents. They decided to stop at the Walmart in Fridley and camp in the parking lot. The morning of the fire, the man used a camping stove to make breakfast, documents say. Once finished, he put it into the back of their vehicle “without waiting for it to cool,” then drove from the back of the lot into a parking space closer to the store entrance — a parking space right next to McKenzie’s minivan. The man went into the store and the camping stove ignited a fire inside his vehicle, documents say. His wife tried to put out the flames but was unsuccessful. Their vehicle was engulfed and the blaze spread to McKenzie’s van.

Again no parental responsibility asssumed.

On the other hand Walmart parking lots have been areas of high crime 24/7. After several murders, Walmart then had the guy ride around in the golf cart. The cheapskates did not want to spend money on parking lot security. What happened here is a different matter.

I'll bet she was in the store a lot longer than 'a few minutes'. That is about as accurate as 'ociffffer I only had 2 beers'.

The California man screwed up.

The mom screwed up - big time.

Walmart has the deep pockets.

Deep pockets that they never empty. They are notorious for fighting every suit no matter how small or how much they are to blame.

The police should charge her with arson child endangerment and homicide of a child,that is what she and he deserve.

quote:

Originally posted by 45 Cal:
The police should charge her with arson child endangerment and homicide of a child,that is what she and he deserve.

The fire wasn't intentionally set, so no Arson.
Negligent Homicide or a similar charge, maybe.

Mom needs to get slapped with 2X of Child Endangerment.

The Walmarts around here all have big signage up: “NO OVERNIGHT PARKING”.

The one I go to was getting overrun by tractor trailers parking there at night.

quote:

Originally posted by CPD SIG:

quote:

Originally posted by 45 Cal:
The police should charge her with arson child endangerment and homicide of a child,that is what she and he deserve.

The fire wasn't intentionally set, so no Arson.
Negligent Homicide or a similar charge,

maybe.

Mom needs to get slapped with 2X of Child Endangerment.

Also from the article
“ The man, who pleaded guilty to two counts of “negligent fire causing great bodily harm,” was sentenced in 2020 to 120 days in jail and three years probation, outlets reported.”

As far as I can tell, the mother hasn’t been charged with anything. She should be.

Negligence resulting in death / disfigurement is only 120 days? Stupid should hurt more than that.

Yep, expect to see more, ‘no overnight parking or camping’ signs at Walmart. Of course not a campground, but convenient if making time & stopping for a short overnight.

Walmart has deep deep pockets and a very large stable of lawyers on staff for dealing for all finds of legal actions against themselves as well as customers being the defendant or the plaintiff...... This case will drag on thru the legal system for many many years before it is settled or thrown out for any number of reasons..........Have seen the no truck parking signs and no overnight parking signs posted but until enforcment is implemented this is still private property that belongs to Walmart .... Maybe They need security guards to enforce the parking rules.... ..Their property--Their rules......Now as far as the mother leaving the sleeping children in the van that should be left up to the local district attorney as to bring charges against the mother. Same goes against the camper whos stove started the fire..................drill sgt.

quote:

Originally posted by ZSMICHAEL:
Deep pockets that they never empty. They are notorious for fighting every suit no matter how small or how much they are to blame.

Good fiscal policy, especially in cases like this.

Do you have a parking lot or a driveway? If some low-life caused someone to die in it, would you have your insurance company roll over?

Rhetorical question. Of course not.

Deepest pockets get the attention, legally speaking.
Why?
Money.

Our local Walmarts used to allow campers for days, even weeks, that parked at the far end of parking lots away from the store, but now have signs saying no overnight camping and enforced by roving private security vehicles during all store hours. Also, Walmart and several other big business' parking lots now have the local P.D. solar powered 360° video camera trailers with 24 hour monitoring. But I seriously doubt any of the surveillance methods would have either noticed or reacted to kids sleeping in a car.

When I was a young boy, maybe 5 or 6 years old, my Dad worked a good hour + drive from our house. He worked a Swing shift which meant he often had to work through the night at a communication earth station, located in a remote corn or wheat field, miles from any homes or businesses.

Depending on where we went, some of the best fishing and camping was in the opposite direction from our house, and it simply made no sense for him to get off work after working all night, drive an hour in one direction to our house to pick me up, then drive back past where he worked for another 100-150 miles... all with no sleep.

He used to load me up in our VW bug, I had blankets, a sleeping bag, a toy or book, and maybe a snack like an apple. He'd go into work, and when I was ready to sleep I would curl up in that little cubby hole behind the VW rear seat, and fall asleep in the parking lot.

The engineers and techs there weren't just co-workers, but friends too. Throughout the night, either my Dad or one of the other guys would come out to check on me. If I was asleep, they'd leave me be. If they found me awake they'd ask if I needed anything, or would take me into the building to use the bathroom, or nuke a corndog for me in the lunch room, which was a real treat. First time I ever saw a microwave was about '70 or '71.

Soon as Dad got off his shift, he'd let me use the bathroom, maybe have a tiny quick breakfast, and off we went camping and fishing.

So, was my Dad negligent in leaving me to sleep in a car overnight in a well lit remote parking lot?

There is a risk to virtually everything we do in life. How often do sleeping kids die in burning vehicles? Sure, yeah, it does happen... but how often?

The mother had no reasonable expectation that her daughters would come to any harm for the few minutes she planned to be in Walmart...although I'm not sure anyone can plan on being in any store for just a few minutes.

Flip side of the coin.. what if the mother woke the daughters up, brought them into the store, and a shooter starts blasting away and the daughters are injured or killed. Is she negligent then for bringing them in the store, when they could've otherwise been safely sleeping in the car?

I just can't blame the mother for the death and injuries to her daughters...

Now, her lawsuit against Walmart is pure b.s. I agree that she is going after the "deepest pockets", which I find despicable...but I believe there is a secondary motivation involved. A grieving mother who dearly loves her daughters, is feeling guilt over her decision, and is trying desperately to displace the blame onto Walmart for her decision. I mean, if it's the greedy wealthy corporation's fault, then she is both well compensated and able to tell friends, family and co-workers that Walmart is the evil one to blame... so it can't possibly be her fault.

I don't much like Walmart's business practices or politics... but the true blame should be placed squarely on the couple in the van that left a fire hazard next to a vehicle with sleeping children in it... but she instead went for the deep pockets.

My heart goes out to the family but this is an uncommon tragedy made worse by a grieving mother's misplaced blame and greed.

They will fight this (as they should) and win.

In AZ leaving a child in a car is a surefire way that you'll never win a suit against anyone. You may not get prosecuted, but you will always be the one responsible for whatever bad happens.

Pretty certain that Walmart banned overnight camping in their lots after the Gaver Family melee at the Cottonwood Walmart. This is where I live.


COTTONWOOD, Ariz. — Seven members of an Idaho family who had been camping in a Walmart parking lot are at the center of a melee Saturday that ended with one man dead, and two people, including a police officer, wounded, according to police.

An Arizona Department of Public Safety spokesman said Cottonwood Sgt. Jeremy Daniels, 31, a 10-year-veteran, should make a full recovery from his injuries and is expected to be released soon from the Flagstaff Medical Center.

The man who died in the officer-involved shooting has not been positively identified and another man who was shot in the abdomen has not been identified, either, said Bart Graves, the DPS spokesman.

The wounded man is expected to be arrested on suspicion of aggravated assault when he is released from the hospital, Graves said.

The incident started Saturday night when a female Walmart employee was shoved aside when she tried to enter a restroom, Graves said.

When police arrived, the Idaho family members "immediately attacked the responding officers,'' Graves said.

Nathaniel Gaver, 27, is accused of assault of a law enforcement officer after a brawl in a Cottonwood, Ariz., Walmart parking lot March 21, 2015.
"During the course of the fight, we believe there was a struggle for the officer's gun," he added.

Three shots were fired and three people were hit, Graves said. It is not clear at this time who fired the shots, he said.

He said seven members of the Idaho family were arrested, in addition to the man who was killed. Graves identified one suspect, Jeramiah Gaver, 29, of Boise, who was arrested on suspicion of aggravated assault.

"The process of identifying all of these people is painstaking,'' Graves said. "We believe there is a family connection.''

Graves said the fight involved eight police officers and a Walmart loss-prevention officer, who went into the parking lot in an attempt to help. The officers suffered lacerations, bruises and a twisted ankle during the fight.

Peter Gaver, 55, is accused of hindering prosecution and resisting arrest after a brawl in a Cottonwood, Ariz., Walmart parking lot March 21, 2015.
Although DPS released only one defendant's name, the other defendants names, booking photos and charges were released by the Yavapai County Sheriff's Office, which has several members of the Gaver family in custody.

The other defendants were identified as Nathaniel Gaver, 27, accused of assault of a law-enforcement officer; Peter Gaver, 55, accused of hindering prosecution and resisting arrest; Ruth Gaver, 52, accused of assault of a law-enforcement officer; and David Gaver, who remains hospitalized.

The Gavers' next court date is scheduled for March 31, according to Dwight D'Evelyn, a spokesman for the Yavapai County Sheriff's Office. He said two juveniles from the Gaver family are in custody at the Prescott Juvenile Detention Facility.

Ruth Gaver, 52, is accused of assault of a law enforcement officer after a brawl in a Cottonwood, Ariz., Walmart parking lot March 21, 2015.
DPS identified the juveniles as a boy and a girl but did not release their ages.

Sgt. Tod Moore, a Cottonwood police spokesman, said the department has been involved in three officer-involved shootings during his six years in investigations.

"What makes this one unique was the whole family assaulting our officers,'' Moore said. "It was out of the blue. This family has been in Cottonwood for a month or two.''


https://www.usatoday.com/story...ly-members/70366110/

quote:

...

He said seven members of the Idaho family were arrested, in addition to the man who was killed.
...

Wait. They arrested the man who was killed too?

That right there is some exemplary tough on crime law enforcement.