Pale, I see your point, and I genuinely do agree with your approach (and I loved your story of that football game)

Sometime around or before 20-0, I’d have a nice chat with the umpire and opposing coach and dial things back (bunt, swing at anything close, not take extra bases, etc). Once it got past 25-0, the game is over. Present bunt each time, and miss (intentional strikeout).

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Originally posted by bigdeal:

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Originally posted by Dusty78:
The story I read said the coach for the winning team tried to stop the game but the officials wouldn’t let him. He told his players to just bunt and not take extra bases but the losing team committtd 22 errors and their pitcher gave up 92 hits.

Somebody is not telling the truth here. Years ago, one of my travel baseball teams faced a completely stacked team with a few players that everyone knew were too old for our division, but couldn't prove definitively Saturday. After the first inning with that team putting up 12 or so runs, I warned the other coach I'd pull my team off the field if he continued to run up the score. He let his team hit away and steal in the second inning, and with no outs on the board, I pulled my kids and ended the game with a forfeit. Nothing is accomplished when vastly superior (and in this case illegitimate) teams attempt to demoralize another team. 'Real' coaches on both sides of one of these games won't let that happen.

You do realize that not every league has exactly the same as the league you were a part of right?

In the league I coach in if you walked off the field you would have been fined $200. you could not pay of course but you would never be allowed to coach if you didn't.

It sure doesn't seem like the losing team was demoralized in this case either. It sounds bad I give you that but it seems both teams are taking it well so I don't think this is that big a deal.

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Originally posted by reloader-1:
Pale, I see your point, and I genuinely do agree with your approach (and I loved your story of that football game)

Sometime around or before 20-0, I’d have a nice chat with the umpire and opposing coach and dial things back (bunt, swing at anything close, not take extra bases, etc). Once it got past 25-0, the game is over. Present bunt each time, and miss (intentional strikeout).

It could have been handled differently for sure and given the time to think about it I agree that I would have tried harder to not run the score up that much. But I have spent a lot of time on sidelines and I know that sometimes the stress of the moment clouds the decision making. Both teams seem okay with the outcome so I am not too quick to crucify the coach of the winning team.

But again I understand how 82-0 seems really bad.

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Originally posted by TXJIM:
My 14 year old son was playing in a tourney in San Antonio last month. In the top of the 1st we got them out 3 up 3 down. We scored 16 runs in the bottom of the 1st and only had 1 out. The umpire just stopped the inning and let them bat to start the 2nd inning. We put our weakest pitcher in and he gave up a walk but only had to face 4 batters to record 3 outs. The umpire called the game without having us bat again. It was clear that the game was not competitive and our kids were smashing the baseball which can be dangerous. The umpire in our game could give some lessons to the umpire in the OP story.

Yet as a longtime baseball coach, I see this as a weakness as well. You can read my post above, but nothing is more important than the mental and physical development of my players. If 'I' see things headed in the direction they were in your game, I'm going to be talking to the losing coach between innings and telling him I'm going to dial it way back, but if the game continues to get out of control, I'd strongly encourage him to forfeit, and if he doesn't, I will. We won some games big over time, but my teams were never allowed to demoralize anyone because it serves no purpose whatsoever for either team.

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But again I understand how 82-0 seems really bad.

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Originally posted by Pale Horse:
In the league I coach in if you walked off the field you would have been fined $200. you could not pay of course but you would never be allowed to coach if you didn't.

Two comments to that. One, I am usually very good at stirring things up and driving home a point. I have been dragged in front of league management a couple times over the years and have 'never' paid a penalty. Of course having one of the most competitive teams in the division we play in and playing in ten or more tournaments a season tends to afford me a bit of sway with management given the money I contribute to their till. And two, I've always had a corporate sponsor (or two) that paid my team costs. So if I had to pay a fine, it damn sure wouldn't have come out of my pocket.

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Originally posted by bigdeal:

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Originally posted by Pale Horse:
In the league I coach in if you walked off the field you would have been fined $200. you could not pay of course but you would never be allowed to coach if you didn't.

Two comments to that. One, I am usually very good at stirring things up and driving home a point. I have been dragged in front of league management a couple times over the years and have 'never' paid a penalty. Of course having one of the most competitive teams in the division we play in and playing in ten or more tournaments a season tends to afford me a bit of sway with management given the money I contribute to their till. And two, I've always had a corporate sponsor (or two) that paid my team costs. So if I had to pay a fine, it damn sure wouldn't have come out of my pocket.

Both good points.

In rec league we don't get sponsors so it would have been on me. In the leagues I get sponsers in I’d never ask them to pay for my violations of the rules I agreed to. I always put that money towards the team and never thought of it as money that I should use. I’ve paid fines before and it never even occurred to me to use sponser money for that.

You are right that maybe could have gone in front of the board and fought it successfully but I don't know the board he plays for and you don't either. I don’t coach pay for play travel teams so our win loss record doesn’t make money for our league. It’s not about the money in any league I’ve coached in so I don’t have the sway of someone who makes money for a league that exists mainly for profit.

Again in this case the losing team doesn't seem to care so I don't think there was any damage done.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Pale Horse,

They were hitting balls 300 feet at stopping at first huh? They shouldn't have been hitting any balls, they shouldn't have been swinging at all. Or swinging and intentionally missing if they really wanted to end the game.

There's no honor in that win or loss.

He did everything he could? The coach is full of shit.

If there is no forfeit rule, I don't have a problem with running up the score. It's a game and the losers will soon come to understand that it is only 1 loss.

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Originally posted by bdylan:
If there is no forfeit rule, I don't have a problem with running up the score. It's a game and the losers will soon come to understand that it is only 1 loss.

There’s running up the score, and then there is just being an asshole.

82-0 would be the rough equivalent of a 574-0 football game. At some point, you realize that the teams, while occupying the same field, are not on the same universe in terms of ability.

The concept of honor is sadly absent in today’s society.

Ethics in sports involves following the rules. I'm probably just dead wrong, but how the opponent is feeling is not my concern.

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Originally posted by bdylan:
Ethics in sports involves following the rules. I'm probably just dead wrong, but how the opponent is feeling is not my concern.

I’d say sportsmanship is more than just rule following, in my opinion.

Rule following is the minimum, there is more to it than that.

Can't believe I missed this thread. Had I been coaching the winning team I would have put my 9 least accomplished players in the game and after about the first inning would have had them go up there hitting opposite handed and offering a bunt (but missing) at the first three pitches. Get the 5 innings out of the way so the mercy rule could take effect.

I'd tell the kids that the stats wouldn't count, just like I'd not count the good stats either. And I would definitely try to schedule a different team for the other game they had scheduled.

For what is worth, I played baseball in college, if you can call the CG Academy "college" . I have played Men's Senior Baseball since I was 28, and am now 57. I currently coach and play in the Mid South MSBL 40+ wooden bat league, so I'm what you could call a fan of the game. I can't imagine letting a score get that out of hand in ANY amateur league. Fortunately the losing team handled it with great grace and sportsmanship and so did the winning team, although I personally would have gone further to throttle back my guys had I been coaching the winning team.

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Originally posted by Pale Horse:
You can't stand there and take three strikes if they can't throw three strikes.

If you swing at it and don't hit it, it's a strike, no matter where the ball is, right?

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Originally posted by maladat:

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Originally posted by Pale Horse:
You can't stand there and take three strikes if they can't throw three strikes.

If you swing at it and don't hit it, it's a strike, no matter where the ball is, right?

I feel like I addressed that. Let me see if I can find where I said something about not swinging at garbage. Oh! There it is! Literally the next sentence after the one you quoted.

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Personally if I was a player and saw the opposing team swing at total garbage I'd be a lot more humiliated than if they beat me by 82 points.

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Originally posted by bdylan:
If there is no forfeit rule, I don't have a problem with running up the score. It's a game and the losers will soon come to understand that it is only 1 loss.

The tournament directors across Florida whose tournaments we play in know I am rigid in my adherence to league/tournament rules, right up to the point where they (from my perspective) might harm my team or players. Everything, and I do mean everything I do is always focused on developing all aspects of my players. My guys would learn nothing and might very well suffer setbacks from a game like that noted in this story. Forfeit rule or not, I'd pull my team off the field and end such a game, then deal with any consequences afterward. My focus has and will always be the development of my players. Winning or losing games is only a piece of that overall equation.

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Originally posted by bigdeal:

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Originally posted by bdylan:
If there is no forfeit rule, I don't have a problem with running up the score. It's a game and the losers will soon come to understand that it is only 1 loss.

The tournament directors across Florida whose tournaments we play in know I am rigid in my adherence to league/tournament rules, right up to the point where they (from my perspective) might harm my team or players. Everything, and I do mean everything I do is always focused on developing all aspects of my players. My guys would learn nothing and might very well suffer setbacks from a game like that noted in this story. Forfeit rule or not, I'd pull my team off the field and end such a game, then deal with any consequences afterward. My focus has and will always be the development of my players. Winning or losing games is only a piece of that overall equation.

Agreed.

The original quote is literally the embodiment of poor sportsmanship. It's only one loss, right?