quote:

Originally posted by Black92LX:
Work smarter not harder.
Shark bites just flat work and generally take less time then soldering.

Yep, and they make really crappy plumbers like me into pretty decent plumbers.

quote:

Originally posted by SgtGold:

So is the space shuttle and we all know what happened with that.

My point is all of this non soldered stuff looks like it's a good time and money saver, but I am wondering if we're going to see a rash of plumbing failures as these instalations age. I know plenty of people with 50+ year old houses that were plumed with copper, are there any out there witb the plastic stuff?

And I've repaired several copper lines due to leaks. It's not the end all be all of plumbing.

quote:

Originally posted by MattW:

quote:

Originally posted by ugeesta:
Well, we recently developed a 270 unit, 16 story apartment building and the plumber used the ProPress compression system. Just after the building was completed and before we started moving in tenants 1” branch line separated from the 2” Main sometime over a weekend.

The end result was over 100 units flooded which equated to about $3.5 million in damaged and a million or so in lost rent while the repair work was completed.

Yeah, we are not real fans of the ProPress system. That being said, it’s more common than not and problems like what we experienced are rare.

It could have happened with a soldered joint as well. Its more the installer that the product.

Man, would have loved to be on that mitigation job. Who did the work?

I was not involved with the clean up but it was a Belfor or Servpro type company. It wasn’t cheap from what I was told.

Pex, and sharkbites have been used in industrial pipefitting for a long time, They are becoming common in residential now but have a track record in industrial uses

So do lots of bad things.

^^^ Dat True!

I have dealt with PEX installed since the beginning and would never trust it in my own home and never behind walls. All of my professional licensed plumber friends feel the same way about it here in South Florida and will not use it. Chlorinated water does a real number on it.

Shark bites on copper pipe seem to do ok. But when they fail they tend to blow completely off, it is usually rare that they fail when installed on copper. My preference over shark bites would be compression fittings on/near a hot water heater if you're looking to get away from braising. I have had one old compression one almost fail on a hot water heater though. I went to install a new water heater and noticed the old compression fitting turned a little and I went to tighten it and it fell off in my hand, the compression ring was totally rotted out. I was very lucky to catch it.

Personally, I feel braised copper fittings are the way to go. It's rare that they fail. If they do fail usually it's a small stream that you catch in time. All of the 52 year old braised copper in my house is fine and no issues. So it generally lasts the longest and is proven.

Sharkbite fittings are not to code around here. Soldered or bust. Of course, it's also against code for a homeowner to do things like replace his own water heater around here.

I'm not sure I'd put one in a wall, but I don't have a problem with them personally.

My neighbor told me that PEX is a bad idea because it allows bacteria to build up in the lines?

Has anyone ever heard this one? He's a fan of Sharkbite on copper (if installed properly) but says he would never put any PEX in his own house.

Copper is naturally anti microbial. Anything iron, steel, or plastic can allow organic material growth and has to rely on active chemical treatment and consfant flow to keep organics in check.

quote:

Originally posted by PASig:
My neighbor told me that PEX is a bad idea because it allows bacteria to build up in the lines?

Has anyone ever heard this one? He's a fan of Sharkbite on copper (if installed properly) but says he would never put any PEX in his own house.

Yeah, I wouldn't be considering his advice in the future.

quote:

Originally posted by whanson_wi:
I think it would be like rubber washers in a valve - inside the house, 30 years with no problem.

In the walls, I'd be concerned with a 30-year life. A lot of houses are in use for longer than that.

flashguy

quote:

Originally posted by PASig:
My neighbor told me that PEX is a bad idea because it allows bacteria to build up in the lines?

Has anyone ever heard this one? He's a fan of Sharkbite on copper (if installed properly) but says he would never put any PEX in his own house.

Yes, bacteria and algae can grow inside of it. If you have well water and it sits for weeks and weeks with no use. You usually don't have a bacteria issue with city water.

Id use shark bites for a temp fix, nothing else.

There are a few projects I know of that have suffered greatly from the
“Exclusive Use”, of shark bites fittings.

There is nothing permanent about a compression fitting.

Not just for this reason, but including it, I wonder what all the houses built since the '90's or so are going to be like when they get to the 40-50 YO range?

quote:

Originally posted by flashguy:

quote:

Originally posted by whanson_wi:
I think it would be like rubber washers in a valve - inside the house, 30 years with no problem.

In the walls, I'd be concerned with a 30-year life. A lot of houses are in use for longer than that.

flashguy

I redid the kitchen at my old house 8+ years ago. I had one joint no matter how many times I soldered it. Would have a slow leak. After blowing the lines and soldering the joint 12+ times. A slew of cuss words later. I hit the Home depot. On shark bite later the joint was leak free. Still is to this day.

I only know because my brother in law is living there now.

I had this plumber come today and replace my main cold water shut off valve in the basement as I had put in a new powder room sink and had the water off to change out supply valves and the crusty old gate valve (most likely 66 years old along with the house) on the main shut off wouldn't stop leaking on me after I turned the water back on.

He put on a new ball valve and also used one of these couplers, another Nibco pressure fitting. I looked up how they actually go on and was impressed to see that they crimp these on with what looks like a small Jaws of Life looking type tool, pneumatic and battery powered. Looks like it crimps the shit out of those fittings which are rated up to 200 psi:

^^^ Yes, GTG. ProPress system.

Burnham boiler sections are pressed together with push nipples, metal to metal contact with no O-rings.

I pulled out an old, coal fired Weil McLain boiler this Summer. Was still in use heating the home. Was converted to natural gas many years ago. The sections where put together using push nipples. Mot a one was leaking after all the years of use. All the expanding/contracting/corrosion/etc. it was still water tight.