I agree with Dead Eye. Thanks for the effort. Block chain technology is not going anywhere, it's not just for mining digital assets either, it is the future of cyber security.

Laugh at early adopters all you want. We know the volatility and the 'bubble' risks.

Don't understand it or think it's a scam? Don't trade it! Don't know anything about computers? Well you can't mine it then!

Question my intelligence all you want. Even, 'gasp' SERIOUSLY question my intelligence. Wife does it all the time, I'm used to it.

To be clear, I’m crucifying you because you claim to have had extensive conversations with very high experts in this field, even one Senator’s briefing on the matter and thus far have done nothing to demonstrate a working knowledge of the markets you claim this extreme understanding in.

In fact, you’ve added nothing that can’t be read on some cheap hack websites pushing this garbage.

If you had some original input or even detailed answers to the questions posed, fine, then this would be a discussion. But you’re regurgitating base level internet propaganda and claiming it truth.

You held yourself as having advanced knowledge in this subject and have not demonstrated even a college level understanding...so I’m crucifying you...in your words. In my words, I’m calling BS.

quote:

Originally posted by DoctorSolo:
I agree with Dead Eye. Thanks for the effort. Block chain technology is not going anywhere, it's not just for mining digital assets either, it is the future of cyber security.

Laugh at early adopters all you want. We know the volatility and the 'bubble' risks.

Don't understand it or think it's a scam? Don't trade it! Don't know anything about computers? Well you can't mine it then!

Question my intelligence all you want. Even, 'gasp' SERIOUSLY question my intelligence. Wife does it all the time, I'm used to it.

Block chain is legit and a very powerful tool. Block chain and bitcoin are not the same thing. Block chain is the engine that allows bitcoin to trade.

If you said blockchain is the future, I’d agree with you.

Also, I never said I’d laugh at anyone who bought bitcoin. There is a lot of money to be made in pump and dumps. Speculation is a legitimate investment for sure. I’m calling BS on his senator briefing.

quote:

Originally posted by JALLEN:

I’m perplexed about how, if the coin isn’t entitled to participate in the success of the operation, why it would be more valuable.

I figure that you already know this but others may not. This discussion is about "virtual coins", not those copper slugs with Bitcoin stamped on them that are often seen in articles about Bitcoin.

quote:

Originally posted by JALLEN:
Owning a coin appears to confer no rights on the owner than the envy of others who may pay more to be envied, or not.

When I discovered Bitcoin on a forum in 2010, there was a FAQ which included the question "Is Bitcoin a pyramid scheme?" The answer began, "Not exactly."

I studied the concept and even looked at the core source code written in the programming language C/C++. I thought "This is a good idea which seems to be modeled after the concept of gold, but I already have gold." Later, I exchanged $ for Bitcoin at around $400. I sold at that "top" when it broke through $1,000.

Something that should be obvious is that some people have passionate feelings about Bitcoin, et al. I'm going to respect that and not offer any positive or negative opinions on cryptocurrencies. (This is easy to do since I don't have any.)

This message has been edited. Last edited by: rh,

I posit the following:

If one put $500 each into Bitcoin, Etherium, Litecoin, and maybe XRP today, how would one expect to fair in five years?

quote:

Originally posted by rh:

quote:

Originally posted by JALLEN:

I’m perplexed about how, if the coin isn’t entitled to participate in the success of the operation, why it would be more valuable.

I figure that already know this but others may not. This discussion is about "virtual coins", not those copper slugs with Bitcoin stamped on them that are often seen in articles about Bitcoin.

quote:

Originally posted by JALLEN:
Owning a coin appears to confer no rights on the owner than the envy of others who may pay more to be envied, or not.

When I discovered Bitcoin on a forum in 2010, there was a FAQ which included the question "Is Bitcoin a pyramid scheme?" The answer began, "Not exactly."

I studied the concept and even looked at the core source code written in the programming language C/C++. I thought "This is a good idea which seems to be modeled after the concept of gold, but I already have gold." Later, I exchanged $ for Bitcoin at around $400. I sold at that "top" when it broke through $1,000.

Something that should be obvious is that some people have passionate feelings about Bitcoin, et al. I'm going to respect that and not offer any positive or negative opinions on cryptocurrencies. (This is easy to do since I don't have any.)

I know nothing about copper slugs. I just can’t figure the economics behind the “coins” being more valuable than at some time in the past.

I’m used to valuing intangible assets, investment type stuff for example, on the basis of future earning power, estimated.

Why should cryptocurrency be more valuable now than it was a few years ago, or less valuable, as the case may be?

I think the answer to the question why Bitcoin has value as a means of exchange is more closely tied to the answer to the question why gold has value as a means of exchange than people want to accept.

How many times can I tell you that you're right esdunbar? I'm a idiot who's made over $30,000 today and I still have 3 more hours to go before I take a nap then catch the evening dump in Asia.

I never said I had a meeting with a senator about this. I said I'm close with the team leader tasked with getting the senator up to speed about everything cryptocurrency/digital assets and he's the one who meets directly with the senator.

I really don't care if you call BS because you don't know a damn thing about anything in this thread other than acting like you're smarter than everyone and attacking my character. I post a few links for JALLEN so he can get a better idea as to how some tokens have different values and can actually be used within the creator's platform and you think I'm trying to convince people to buy BAT, REP or ZEC when I was simply making a point.

Want to know how ignorant you are? You called BAT a Ponzi scheme. BAT is the token for Brave browser... invented by some nobody named Brendan Eich who also invented Netscape, Java and Firefox. He was forced out of Mozilla because he donated $1,000 to oppose gay marriage in California. After getting torpedoed he created one of the most successful ICOs in history and is trying to change the way the internet will advertise through his browser while preserving your privacy. I love what he's doing but don't own a single BAT token because I don't invest in darlings. But go ahead and keep calling him and his company a Ponzi scheme because you're so smart you figured it out in a Sigforum thread.

How about you share some of your expertise on this? You just said blockchain is the future and that's what allows bitcoin to trade. You must have missed the part about how the blockchain needs a massive network of millions of computers to work. How do you think one gets accepted on a blockchain? What about building your own blockchain? Just call a million of your buddies with a PC and tell them to be your miner, right? Who's paying for their upkeep and are they fast enough to solve the encryption? You're so smart, tell me how much electricity it takes to process a bitcoin transaction. Then tell me what country has the cheapest electricity rates in the world and if there's a correlation of the number of miners located there. Then maybe we'll chat about the 51% rule or why the fork that was supposed to occur on the 16th of this month was cancelled. I'm the idiot here but surely you've taken all this into consideration when you boldly stated that Bitcoin is going to implode (oh and you forgot to give us a timeframe genius) If you need help in figuring it out just read up on Quantum processors and how they'll be able to crack the blockchain encryption within 10 minutes. Then you can act like you know it all and Bitcoin will be finished within 10 years. Then I'll ask you what a fork is and is it possible to upgrade the code at a fork to take advantage of the Quantum processing the blockchain will have have too. Spoiler alert: I won't wait or care to hear your reply because you're playing checkers when I'm playing chess.

Dead_Eye, I don’t see an email listed on your profile. Will you email me (email in profile) if you had a chance? I’ve got a question for you.

quote:

Originally posted by apprentice:
I posit the following:

If one put $500 each into Bitcoin, Etherium, Litecoin, and maybe XRP today, how would one expect to fair in five years?

I don't waste my time on Litecoin and XRP. For buy and hold right now bitcoin is the place to be because that's what people have heard about, that's what they're signing up to buy and when futures trading is approved and ETFs and institutional money comes in, it's going to explode. The alts will benefit but not like BTC will in my opinion. Moreover, as a buy and hold you'll be taxed at long term capital gains. If you're in a 10% or 15% tax bracket, no capital gains tax. If you start exchanging currencies then you better keep track because let's say you change Ether for Bitcoin because Ether wasn't keeping up. Well, whatever gain (or loss) you made on Ether has to be reported as income and depending on how long you held it determines if it's long term or short term gains. Then when you go to cash out Bitcoin you need to be able to prove the value of Bitcoin at the time you paid taxes on the Ether to get a step up in basis, while factoring in whatever long and short term capital gain taxes are due.

I've advised family members who were interested to buy and hold Bitcoin and recommend the same for you. Also, don't buy them using Coinbase, their fees are high and unnecessary. GDAX and Coinbase are the same company and I'd signup at coinbase, make the USD deposit then transfer it to the GDAX account where you can buy bitcoin at market price for 25 basis as a taker or without any fees if you're a maker (buy limit purchase).

Can't tell you what it'll be worth in 5 years. You'll hear a lot of crazy numbers like $50,000 or $100,000. I don't worry about the value that far out because my technical analysis is focused on the next few days, weeks and months. Just a wild ass guess as to how much Bitcoin will be worth in 18 months... I'd say between $17,000 - $25,000.

quote:

Originally posted by JALLEN:

I know nothing about copper slugs.

Those are "visual aids" such at this:



(Or search for "bitcoin image".) Bitcoins are not exactly tangible objects. They are proof of a cryptographic puzzle being solved. (I edited out "intangible" since they can be written on paper.)

quote:

Originally posted by JALLEN:

Why should cryptocurrency be more valuable now than it was a few years ago, or less valuable, as the case may be?

That is due to subjective perception of value. Would you rather have an ounce of gold, government created fiat currency, or proof of a solved cryptographic puzzle in your wallet? Opinions vary.

Copefree, I don't know if Sherman will return to the Seahawks after this injury, he's got a high cap hit next year if he's on the roster. If you had a different question you can reach me here: cl54np@comcast.net

quote:

Originally posted by Dead_Eye:
Bitcoin is many things, a store of value is one of them. Ethereum allows for

"store of value" about Bitcoin is an opinionated assertion. Gold is the only time tested store of value, with silver still around.

(OT in a way: Your stylography indicates that you are not a Millennial.)

quote:

Originally posted by Dead_Eye:
Top analysts project the cap to double or triple within the next year.

There is no known method of analyzing cryptocurrencies other than technical analysis, which is an art, not a science.

quote:

Originally posted by Dead_Eye:
Guess who's stock doubled in the last 2 months?

The very reputable https://www.goldmoney.com/ perked up when it added cryptocurrencies as a diversification option to metals.

quote:

Originally posted by Dead_Eye:
Copefree, I don't know if Sherman will return to the Seahawks after this injury, he's got a high cap hit next year if he's on the roster. If you had a different question you can reach me here: cl54np@comcast.net

Email inbound

quote:

Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:
Cold hard cash will never go away.

Other references are available, but cash mostly went away in India: https://www.npr.org/sections/m...disappeared-part-one

This allows monitoring and control by governments. And a cashless society is what this topic is really about.

quote:

Originally posted by jstex56:

quote:

Originally posted by radioman:
forget Bitcoin, Ethereum is where it's at

$300m in cryptocurrency' accidentally lost forever due to bug

Whoopsies! Undo Undo Undo!

quote:

Originally posted by Dead_Eye:

quote:

Originally posted by apprentice:
I posit the following:

If one put $500 each into Bitcoin, Etherium, Litecoin, and maybe XRP today, how would one expect to fair in five years?

I don't waste my time on Litecoin and XRP. For buy and hold right now bitcoin is the place to be because that's what people have heard about, that's what they're signing up to buy and when futures trading is approved and ETFs and institutional money comes in, it's going to explode. The alts will benefit but not like BTC will in my opinion. Moreover, as a buy and hold you'll be taxed at long term capital gains. If you're in a 10% or 15% tax bracket, no capital gains tax. If you start exchanging currencies then you better keep track because let's say you change Ether for Bitcoin because Ether wasn't keeping up. Well, whatever gain (or loss) you made on Ether has to be reported as income and depending on how long you held it determines if it's long term or short term gains. Then when you go to cash out Bitcoin you need to be able to prove the value of Bitcoin at the time you paid taxes on the Ether to get a step up in basis, while factoring in whatever long and short term capital gain taxes are due.

I've advised family members who were interested to buy and hold Bitcoin and recommend the same for you. Also, don't buy them using Coinbase, their fees are high and unnecessary. GDAX and Coinbase are the same company and I'd signup at coinbase, make the USD deposit then transfer it to the GDAX account where you can buy bitcoin at market price for 25 basis as a taker or without any fees if you're a maker (buy limit purchase).

Can't tell you what it'll be worth in 5 years. You'll hear a lot of crazy numbers like $50,000 or $100,000. I don't worry about the value that far out because my technical analysis is focused on the next few days, weeks and months. Just a wild ass guess as to how much Bitcoin will be worth in 18 months... I'd say between $17,000 - $25,000.

You made $30k today! Nice job! I totally believe you....no really, I do.


Like I said my man, you’ve not demonstrated a working knowledge of markets. What you’ve done is parroted back internet BS.

You’re not the first person to do this. You’re part of the rabid followers who are fueling this bubble. I’m just trying to help point that out.

You’ve been asked questions like how the tokens increase in value, who is the redeeming clearing house, what happens when there’s a massive net trend to sell...etc. you’ve given no answers to these questions. Anyone who actually had the understand you proclaim to have would be able to give detailed answers to these questions based on market economics. The internet doesn’t have answers to these questions...hence why I call BS on your resume.

Like I said before, tell me how a tolken ain’t some one trying to find someone dumber than him to buy it for more than he paid for it?

Rich folks investing in these things is not proof of their economic/investment viability. It’s merely proof that they are smarter than the dummy there will sell to. Like I said, this is a legitimate way to make money right now. I’m not saying don’t do it, I’m saying the economics behind it are garbage.

Blockchain good...not sure what that has to do with computer power though you seem to think it’s important. <shrug>

quote:

Originally posted by Dead_Eye:
There's simply too much information about BTC that isn't going to be summed up in one post. All I have to say is that cryptocurrencies are the future. Period. Remember this thing called the "personal computer" or "the internet?" Cryptocurrency is the next thing that will change the world and how we look back on it.

It's bigger than Bitcoin. Research ICOs and understand that Bitcoin is the standard by which every other token is valued for trading purposes. Oppressed people in Asia use it to store wealth because Governments can't take it from them the way they can when it's in a bank account or hidden under the mattress. Google the price of Bitcoin in Zimbabwe. When people can't use a 55 gallon drum filled with their own country's currency to buy a loaf of bread, the people turn to something that'll actually hold value. Many have tried to kill off Bitcoin... Governments, other currencies and it's still reigning supreme. It may not be that way forever (quite unlikely actually) but less than 0.5% of the world buys/trades BTC. Imagine what it'll be worth when 1% or 5% of the world gets into it and it's going to happen.

People get all excited when their portfolio makes double digits a year. I made that this week and with the price correction today I'm well positioned to double my money once it recovers (should be well before the end of November). Anyone who dismisses this (especially without understanding what it's capable of) is going to watch those who didn't reap all the benefits.

I sold off most of my guns to finance my trading. I could buy almost 3 times my prior collection if I cash out at $7,000.

So many times I wish I had invested just $100 in something and waited. Bitcoin is another of those regrets.

The discussion here with the passion and vagueness show it's a bubble and only works if new people step up- like a pyramid scheme.

quote:

Originally posted by braillediver:
The discussion here with the passion and vagueness show it's a bubble and only works if new people step up- like a pyramid scheme.

For me, that’s what I believe. Based on everything I see.

So the question is, when does it topple? Like the dot com bubble. A lot of people rode that wave for a long time and made a lot of money.

No one has been able to articulate, based on economics, how this is anything other than a bubble.

But, what also hasn’t been able to be articulated is how long the bubble will last. I’m not convinced we’re close to a pop actually. I think there is still money to be made.

Especially in the secondary coins out there given the lack of economic understanding by the fan base.

When bitcoin eventually pops, I think the internet hype will simply name a new king of coins and the folks will jump on that looking to recreate the bitcoin millionaires that were made.

If you notice, a lot of power players simply throw small amounts of money into new coins and hope. That’s essentially what are fueling these tolken ico’s...hope that it’s bitcoin 2.0 and it explodes.

If I had to guess, I’d say this happens a time or two before it gets regulated because good people keep losing.

I’m more heavily psorioned in the secondary coins than bitcoin. To be clear, my bet isn’t on economics, my bet is that there are a lot of idiots out there who will chase the dragon and give me their money as a result. IMO, that’s what this whole thing is. Eyes wide open folks.