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Fire begets Fire
Picture of SIGnified
posted January 03, 2023 10:55 AMHide Post
quote:
Originally posted by jhe888:
One pedal I really would like is a real spring reverb. I've thought about building one from a kit, but I have almost no experience with that sort of thing, and I would hate to spend that much and totally screw it up.


As in a real spring reverb tank?

Or an emulation thereof?





"Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty."
~Robert A. Heinlein
 
Posts: 26758 | Location: dughouse | Registered: February 04, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of maladat
posted January 03, 2023 11:28 AMHide Post
quote:
Originally posted by jhe888:
One pedal I really would like is a real spring reverb. I've thought about building one from a kit, but I have almost no experience with that sort of thing, and I would hate to spend that much and totally screw it up.


There are a number of actual analog spring reverb pedals (with real springs) on the market.

Most are much larger than the majority of pedals and have a much smaller spring tank inside than a traditional in-amp or offboard spring reverb. Some are huge and have a more normal-size spring tank.

The one I ended up with is by a French company called Anasounds. The pedal is the Element.

Instead of cramming a spring tank into the pedal, they use a normal size pedal with a jack for an external spring tank that you can stick somewhere out of the way. I have a small spring tank mounted under my pedalboard and a huge one I can just set next to it if that’s the sound I want.
 
Posts: 6320 | Location: CA | Registered: January 24, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Little ray
of sunshine
Picture of jhe888
posted January 03, 2023 01:28 PMHide Post
quote:
Originally posted by SIGnified:
quote:
Originally posted by jhe888:
One pedal I really would like is a real spring reverb. I've thought about building one from a kit, but I have almost no experience with that sort of thing, and I would hate to spend that much and totally screw it up.


As in a real spring reverb tank?

Or an emulation thereof?


No a real spring reverb, with springs in a tank, driven by tubes. There are at least two kits out there. I'd like a real, Fender-style spring reverb. Of course, I could just buy a Fender reverb unit.

I didn't know there were smaller versions with actual springs.




The fish is mute, expressionless. The fish doesn't think because the fish knows everything.
 
Posts: 53447 | Location: Texas | Registered: February 10, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Fire begets Fire
Picture of SIGnified
posted January 03, 2023 04:34 PMHide Post
Waiting for my modeler to add a feature where when you bang on the box, the reverb tank goes off….

Big Grin





"Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty."
~Robert A. Heinlein
 
Posts: 26758 | Location: dughouse | Registered: February 04, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Seeker of Clarity
Picture of r0gue
posted January 03, 2023 05:58 PMHide Post
quote:
Originally posted by jhe888:
One pedal I really would like is a real spring reverb. I've thought about building one from a kit, but I have almost no experience with that sort of thing, and I would hate to spend that much and totally screw it up.


I think the reverb in my Fender Custom Deluxe Reverb is a real spring reverb. I think...?




 
Posts: 11495 | Registered: August 02, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of maladat
posted January 03, 2023 06:28 PMHide Post
quote:
Originally posted by jhe888:
quote:
Originally posted by SIGnified:
quote:
Originally posted by jhe888:
One pedal I really would like is a real spring reverb. I've thought about building one from a kit, but I have almost no experience with that sort of thing, and I would hate to spend that much and totally screw it up.


As in a real spring reverb tank?

Or an emulation thereof?


No a real spring reverb, with springs in a tank, driven by tubes. There are at least two kits out there. I'd like a real, Fender-style spring reverb. Of course, I could just buy a Fender reverb unit.

I didn't know there were smaller versions with actual springs.


Tubes cut out a lot of the options. It is possible to run tubes at normal tube voltages in a small box off a pedalboard power supply, but it is complicated and expensive. Most of the anywhere-close-to-pedal-sized units are transistor-based.

The solid state ones generally don’t try to produce the distortion you can get by driving the tubes hard in a Fender offboard reverb unit - they just do the reverb part and if you want the tube saturation sound you can get out of a cranked Fender offboard reverb you get it somewhere else. That’s not really a “reverb” thing at all, just something you happen to also be able to do with the Fender unit.
 
Posts: 6320 | Location: CA | Registered: January 24, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Go Vols!
Picture of Oz_Shadow
posted January 03, 2023 08:23 PMHide Post
quote:
Originally posted by r0gue:
quote:
Originally posted by jhe888:
One pedal I really would like is a real spring reverb. I've thought about building one from a kit, but I have almost no experience with that sort of thing, and I would hate to spend that much and totally screw it up.


I think the reverb in my Fender Custom Deluxe Reverb is a real spring reverb. I think...?


Yes, in the black box mounted in the very bottom are springs that stretch across the inside of the box.

There are numerous types of reverb but that is the traditional Fender spring type.
 
Posts: 17944 | Location: SE Michigan | Registered: February 10, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of maladat
posted January 03, 2023 08:41 PMHide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Oz_Shadow:
quote:
Originally posted by r0gue:
quote:
Originally posted by jhe888:
One pedal I really would like is a real spring reverb. I've thought about building one from a kit, but I have almost no experience with that sort of thing, and I would hate to spend that much and totally screw it up.


I think the reverb in my Fender Custom Deluxe Reverb is a real spring reverb. I think...?


Yes, in the black box mounted in the very bottom are springs that stretch across the inside of the box.

There are numerous types of reverb but that is the traditional Fender spring type.


Before digital effects, spring reverb was really the only reverb mechanism REMOTELY feasible to build into a practical guitar amplifier.

A spring reverb, effectively, has a speaker attached to the springs that vibrates them with the input signal and a microphone attached to the springs that picks up the echoes of the input signal bouncing back and forth between the ends of the springs.

There were two other common reverb effects in use.

Plate reverb functions similarly to spring reverb, but the springs are replaced with a large hanging metal plate. The common plate reverb units were/are the size of a large desk (the plate was around 3 feet x 6 feet).

Chamber reverb is literally a room with a speaker and a microphone in it, the speaker plays the input signal and the microphone picks up the echoes and reverberations as the sound bounces off the walls.

Any guitar amplifier with built-in reverb is either using analog spring reverb or using a digital reverb effect (which will probably include a spring reverb emulation, but may include other types as well).

Fender makes some amps with digital reverb, but I don’t think any of them are Custom Shop-badged.
 
Posts: 6320 | Location: CA | Registered: January 24, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Seeker of Clarity
Picture of r0gue
posted January 04, 2023 06:33 AMHide Post
Now I understand why my early 1990s Peavey Exploded with sound when you bumped the Amp. Spring reverb for sure! Used to scare the hell out of me.




 
Posts: 11495 | Registered: August 02, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Fire begets Fire
Picture of SIGnified
posted January 04, 2023 08:26 AMHide Post
For some, reverb is about the spring…

Spring reverbs are their own thing, however they’re just that; a very particular effect. Originally developed to emulate poorly, “reverb”.


Real reverb is about reverberations in a live room. You either go into a real space and get the real thing or are you whip out your Lexicon, Eventide, Briscatti ($$$ - convolution reverb), or in my case Fractal Audio (so well known for their reverb that they publish a plug-in), and pull up an algorithm that is beautiful to the human ear.

Studios invest heavily in this kind of outboard processing for a reason.

It’s a really complex, real-time CPU intensive calculation, but I think the results of digital far out match any stupid spring in a box put there by fender.

Digital reverbs excel significantly in my 40 years of working with music hands-on. from tiny rooms to huge auditoriums to caves to imaginary spaces with big cloud reverbs. Strymon is an excellent example.

And for my own personal taste, I almost never gravitate to Spring verbs because I’d much rather use a plate, or a real room model.

Hands down… And if you’re playing/gigging live, reverb, is it really useful when you’re in a space already?


There’s a difference between playing for yourself, which is what a lot of us do, versus making sure you fit in a mix.





"Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty."
~Robert A. Heinlein
 
Posts: 26758 | Location: dughouse | Registered: February 04, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Little ray
of sunshine
Picture of jhe888
posted January 04, 2023 01:07 PMHide Post
quote:
Originally posted by r0gue:
quote:
Originally posted by jhe888:
One pedal I really would like is a real spring reverb. I've thought about building one from a kit, but I have almost no experience with that sort of thing, and I would hate to spend that much and totally screw it up.


I think the reverb in my Fender Custom Deluxe Reverb is a real spring reverb. I think...?


It sure is, and it sounds delicious.

(Your old Peavy may have been making noise for lots of reasons. Maybe a microphonic tube, or some other electromechanical fault.)

A spring reverb doesn't sound like "real" reverb in a room, but it it its own thing and has become an iconic guitar sound.

The best reverb I ever heard was when I was in a brass sextet and we went to the Oregon capital building and played in the capital rotunda, under the dome. Lord, that reverb made us 15 to 19 year old amateurs sound good.

But it still didn't sound like a Fender reverb unit. So it is a matter of what you are looking for.




The fish is mute, expressionless. The fish doesn't think because the fish knows everything.
 
Posts: 53447 | Location: Texas | Registered: February 10, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Fire begets Fire
Picture of SIGnified
posted January 04, 2023 01:12 PMHide Post
Some people really enjoy sweetbreads, chickenfeet, trotters and other offal … ymmv. Cool





"Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty."
~Robert A. Heinlein
 
Posts: 26758 | Location: dughouse | Registered: February 04, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Seeker of Clarity
Picture of r0gue
posted January 04, 2023 01:40 PMHide Post
I have a few digital reverbs now too. They're fun. The Nightsky is basically a synthesizer for guitar (and/or other instruments too I suppose). Super funky fun. Great for wasting time ad not practicing useful material.




 
Posts: 11495 | Registered: August 02, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Fire begets Fire
Picture of SIGnified
posted January 04, 2023 01:43 PMHide Post
quote:
Originally posted by r0gue:
I have a few digital reverbs now too. They're fun. The Nightsky is basically a synthesizer for guitar (and/or other instruments too I suppose). Super funky fun. Great for wasting time ad not practicing useful material.


It may not be running scales or improving your sweep picking… But it’s all practice.

Experience is your weapon. Wink

Enjoying playing your instrument is the reward.


Just don’t grow up to be a Corksniffer…





"Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty."
~Robert A. Heinlein
 
Posts: 26758 | Location: dughouse | Registered: February 04, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Go Vols!
Picture of Oz_Shadow
posted January 04, 2023 03:23 PMHide Post
quote:
Originally posted by jhe888:
quote:
Originally posted by r0gue:
quote:
Originally posted by jhe888:
One pedal I really would like is a real spring reverb. I've thought about building one from a kit, but I have almost no experience with that sort of thing, and I would hate to spend that much and totally screw it up.


I think the reverb in my Fender Custom Deluxe Reverb is a real spring reverb. I think...?


It sure is, and it sounds delicious.

(Your old Peavy may have been making noise for lots of reasons. Maybe a microphonic tube, or some other electromechanical fault.)

A spring reverb doesn't sound like "real" reverb in a room, but it it its own thing and has become an iconic guitar sound.

The best reverb I ever heard was when I was in a brass sextet and we went to the Oregon capital building and played in the capital rotunda, under the dome. Lord, that reverb made us 15 to 19 year old amateurs sound good.

But it still didn't sound like a Fender reverb unit. So it is a matter of what you are looking for.


I also have an old Peavey that has a spring reverb tank. It jangles quite a bit when bumped. Reminds me of the sound the attic ladder makes when moved.
 
Posts: 17944 | Location: SE Michigan | Registered: February 10, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
No More
Mr. Nice Guy
posted January 04, 2023 03:50 PMHide Post
Best reverb ever. A nuclear power plant that was never fueled. Incredible!

You can download the impulse response that they sampled there and plug it into your digital emulation.

https://youtu.be/zHOsPXcPVPA
 
Posts: 9890 | Location: On the mountain off the grid | Registered: February 25, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Frangas non Flectes
Picture of P220 Smudge
posted January 04, 2023 04:24 PMHide Post
quote:
Originally posted by jhe888:
(Your old Peavy may have been making noise for lots of reasons. Maybe a microphonic tube, or some other electromechanical fault.)


The simplest reason is that it was a correctly functioning spring reverb tank and did what they all do when you bump them, and that's make a horrible noise.

quote:
Originally posted by Fly-Sig:
Best reverb ever. A nuclear power plant that was never fueled. Incredible!


Just... wow.


______________________________________________
“There are plenty of good reasons for fighting, but no good reason ever to hate without reservation, to imagine that God Almighty Himself hates with you, too.”
 
Posts: 17910 | Location: Sonoran Desert | Registered: February 10, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Still finding my way
Picture of Ryanp225
posted January 04, 2023 05:55 PMHide Post
Dang! I've played is a couple warehouses and other interesting places and I've never heard ambience like that.
Yeah...Just...wow!
 
Posts: 10851 | Registered: January 04, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Fire begets Fire
Picture of SIGnified
posted January 04, 2023 06:20 PMHide Post
Big badda room … 50 sec decay! Thanks fly-sig.





"Pacifism is a shifty doctrine under which a man accepts the benefits of the social group without being willing to pay - and claims a halo for his dishonesty."
~Robert A. Heinlein
 
Posts: 26758 | Location: dughouse | Registered: February 04, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Seeker of Clarity
Picture of r0gue
posted January 04, 2023 07:04 PMHide Post
Honestly, my Strymon Big Sky has a very similar sound on the cloud setting. Massively ethereal space.




 
Posts: 11495 | Registered: August 02, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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