Pre-2020, you could go to any new car dealer and most, if not all, would have 50-100 new cars on the lot.

Today, we drove through about 10 new car lots and we saw maybe 20 new cars between them. Dozens of used cars on the lot, but very few new cars. These were Ford, Dodge, Chevrolet, Toyota dealers etc.

Most all advertised to “order your 2025 xxxxxx today”. With that being said, a dealer does absolutely nothing that you can’t do on the internet, and a vehicle inspection once you receive the car if your state requires such.

From looking at new 4Runners, we see dealers charging $600-1000 in “processing and fees”. To me it’s horseshit. If it was their inventory, ok I get it. You’re basically paying a convenience fee. But, the new idea seems to be to order it, wait 90-120 days for it to come in and the dealer still soaks you for a grand (or more).

Are they really even needed? They don’t seem to do anything that an individual can’t do with a computer. Except the ponzi scheme of “rebates” maybe.

Whenever someone tells me they're considering buying a car, I always tell them about my experience using Cartelligent, a car broker, to find my 2013 Taurus. For $300 (it's at least twice as much nowadays), they would have searched all of California and the border areas of neighboring states. After three days, I was able to pick up the car, which came in almost $1000 under invoice. After sales tax and other bullshit California fees, I came away with the car being $3,000 under MSRP out the door.

This was before places like Carvanna and CarMax. I don't know much about them but they seem like a more straightforward way to buy/sell than a dealership.

Personally I hate what car dealerships have become and think it's time for an overhaul to the way of buying vehicles.

One would think if you have decided to spend $40k (whatever) to buy a brand new vehicle you would be a little depressed to be out the money, but euphoric over the whole experience of being treated so fairly and professionally. Not anymore, you drive off with a new car but are out the money and feel like you were cheated and misled every step of the way.

I believe next to politicians car salesmen are the most distrusted profession.

it really doesn't matter as most States have it cast in statue. Helps to shop for a good one and low cost, but no way to escape them that I know of for new.

Laws get changed every day. The question is are they necessary.

bought a new shop van last year, a 2023, new, ,bought in 2024 and had to have it brought in to the dealer,

they had nothing that suited my needs (3/4 ton 2wd standard length, low roof) on the lot,
and the few they had were either odd variants or presold,

unless I wanted an EV Van, they had about 10 of those,,,


when I bought my Rav about the same time, bought used at a Honda dealer, they had a board up with incoming, most were already sold before they got on the lot,

and even now, the lot is maybe 1/3 capacity

Where I live, every dealership is back to normal. Tons of cars on every lot. As long as there are areas where this is still going on, I doubt anything will change. In Europe dealerships are much smaller, and as I understand it, most cars are ordered. I doubt any system of car sales would do away with the nonsense though. It’s just too tempting to hold on to that shady way of making a few more dollars.

For me the answer is yes. I takes some work and most people are not interested in putting in the time and effort to achieve a good outcome with dealers. That is why dealers love those people. Where do I sign. That is not me. I will not buy if I don't establish a relationship with someone I can trust.
I do not buy cars very often. But it was finally time to get us a couple new rigs. Been decades since we actually bought an new rig.

Both rigs we got exactly what we wanted and really good deals. Traded in a few rigs as part of the purchases as well.
As I said, it took time and effort. One was and internet purchase. The other wasn't. But was worth it.
Inventories vary dramatically depending on dealer and brand.
Ymmv

Before I moved my local Toyota dealerships were basically used car lots with almost nothing new on the lots. Personally, I don't want to buy a new vehicle without test driving a current model first. I'm ok with ordering in the trim or options I want but I want to feel size, layout, and function first. Without dealerships I don't know how that could be done but the dealerships have to have inventory for that to be possible. I've talked to a lot of people the last several years that bought something other than what they wanted because "that's all they had". If I'm dropping 40, 50, 60 grand on a new vehicle I'm not taking a color or trim level that I don't want.

We bought a new Pathfinder about a month ago . Pleasant experience. No heavy handed pushy salespeople . Did they get over on me ? Of course they did .They wouldn't have sold me the vehicle unless they made money on it. There is a tremendous amount of competition in this area and I don't hear any stories of people getting man handled by dealers .
Everybody seems to have a decent inventory although maybe a little less than years gone by .

I don't think many people would buy a car if there was nobody near who got factory trained to repair it and nobody nearby stocking OEM parts to repair with.

I think one* of the reasons the car dealership requirement got codified in laws was to make sure that there was at least someone in the state who could service and support the brand being sold. As useful/cool/economical as it may be to buy through other channels these days, getting the car worked on conveniently and quickly still needs to get done.

(* Were there other reasons for those laws? Probably. Anti-competitive ones, for sure - i.e. established brands making it harder for new competitors to enter markets, etc.)

Not quite a year ago, I decided on a LYRIQ. Cadillac has, what, a half dozen or more different model lines? Escalade, CTx, etc. The local dealer had a huge lot, full of new vehicles, including 74 new LYRIQs to choose from. Of course, none of them had the combination of trim level, color, and major option package that I wanted.

As Mark60 said, "If I'm dropping 40, 50, 60 grand on a new vehicle I'm not taking a color or trim level that I don't want," I told the dealer that I would take the combination I wanted, or nothing at all. Dealer found what I wanted a couple states away and had it trucked in for me.

quote:

Originally posted by hrcjon:
it really doesn't matter as most States have it cast in statue. Helps to shop for a good one and low cost, but no way to escape them that I know of for new.

quote:

Laws get changed every day. The question is are they necessary.

No they are not absolutely necessary... but the NADA is a pretty powerful group. They will be protected for the foreseeable future.

However, as technology evolves they do have to get more competitive on sales, at least for the well-informed buyer. Of course, there will always be buyers who don't really care what it costs and can just be told to "sign here, press hard."

If you're unsure of what particular make/model you want, it's hard to get that experience other than in person.
Buying a newer version of your car or if you have friends with the car you want, it's not such a big deal to check it out close up first.

The dealership selling model may have changed, but they are still necessary. Somebody needs to service the cars while under warranty, and for some time after. There needs to be a source for parts. The aftermarket fills most of this need, but they can't stock everything, and sometimes simply don't work. Circa 2022 or '23 I had to replace the front subframe of a 2022 model that had been in an accident. Only the dealer would have parts like this.

A big one is going in , in Moline.

Twice the size of the one they tore out

Looked at a 26 Tundra yesterday. Liked the color. $63k out the door.

Nope.

quote:

Originally posted by egregore:
Somebody needs to service the cars while under warranty, and for some time after. There needs to be a source for parts.

Which would be cool.

If that’s what they actually did.

We have two Durango’s with cam shaft failures that are under warranty. The dealership estimates that we should get them back….around Christmas. The cam shaft problems are well documented but the dealerships aren’t allowed to stock them for warranty work as apparently it’s a different corporate accounting code. So basically, Dodge makes you jump through a bunch of hoops (it isn’t no questions asked warranty) and they blame something you did/failed to do for the problem, and if you don’t take no for an answer they’ll “do you a favor” and honor the warranty. The parts will get shipped by donkey and you should get your vehicle back sometime around the second coming. And is not just one dealership.

So why don’t we buy Fords? Well Ford Corporate requires us to go through one dealer. And he is mandated to sell to “first come, first serve”. Well, he gets allotted so many vehicles and he fills his large customers first. Regardless of when they order. So, we can order 10
Vehicles today, and somehow in two months when they come in they go to the state police? The really weird part is they get gray vehicles and ours are black. We get vehicles six months later, along with six months of excuses. Complain about it to Ford and they’ll just quote the rules to you.

The dealer groups have a big lobby. And state laws vary. Tesla company owned stores are they way of the future. Order your car online get exactly and only what you want you know the price going in. Wait a few weeks then drive to local corporate lot and pick it up. Same company lot should have a service and parts department.

There should be no wide discrepancy in pricing between dealers a few miles apart.

It wasn't long ago Costco, Sam's, BJ's, etc., could get a no hassle price on a new care for you and it kind of made things easier. Sometimes the deals were good and some weren't. One issue is that dealerships are privately owned and depending on volume, they have better deals/options.

The biggest thing for me, is to do your homework. Know about the location/dealer you are buying from and if they have the vehicle you want, how hungry are they for a sale and realize you can get a better deal farther away,( I have done this a few times traveling at least 2-3 hours to save thousands), find out prior what your trade-in,(if you have one) is worth on the market and if you don't get the price you are looking for, it's ok to walk away.

When I shop for cars, I go by myself and not with the wife, mostly. She gets tired at some point and will give up, thinking and saying the deal is good enough for her but I don't and usually do better. I usually have 3-4 personnel trying to pressure me into a deal but am happy to say I hold to my prices.

I recently bought a new car from my local dealer. I kind of enjoy the experience and if things do not go my way, I leave. I usually figure to spend an hour or two negotiating and if I get what I want, it is worth it. I know it is going to be like war and I am fighting for me and mine, just like they are fighting for their's. I figure if God wants me to have it, it will be in His will and I can't do anymore than that.