I understand the value of having a realtor however I'm considering taking on that role given that I have the time, spent a decade on the financing side so I'm not completely oblivious and the market here is still hot. In my area single family residences get their asking price within 30-90 days, sometimes sooner. I'm not looking to be out of my place till later summer/early autumn but if the price is right I'll pack my shit and leave.

I know that having a knowledgeable, experienced real estate attorney who understands contracts inside and out is key. I'm going to start my search for that tomorrow and I'm sure I'll get some great advice if I end up going that route. In the meantime, have any of you sold your house without a realtor and what was your experience like?

We sold our previous house without a realtor several years ago. It was pretty simple. Full disclosure, we had leased the property to a couple whom we had known for years. Started out with a lease with an option buy. Several years in to the lease/rental, the couple called and said they wanted to buy. They secured financing, we met at the attorneys office for closing, signed a bunch of paperwork, and left with a check…easy.

I've done it, years ago. You will want to list in MLS, so you can likely find a realtor online that will do that for a small fee. You will also want to provide a commission to the buyer's broker. You should see what is common in your area. Usually 2-3%.

If you choose to not pay a buyer's broker, and you choose to not list in MLS, you won't get the buyer pool you want and you will not sell your house for what it's worth.

Keep in mind many realtors won't bring their client to a listing they aren't getting paid for.

Oh yeah. It was a while back. I was out walking the dog and a neighbor chased me down. I wasn't in a hurry, but he was insistent. We negotiated for a few minutes, so I gave him a bottom line. It was lower but then I didn't want to go lower and he realized he'd hit bottom dollar. We parted ways and the dog and I were out walking. Out he came and still wanted to go lower. So I told him no way and he agreed. Took a total of a few minutes, both times. So I sold. Couldn't have been easier.

But we were neighbors. He went back inside and we met the next evening.

I would get a realtor. Ask yourself "what are the unknowns that I don't know about"... when you understand that question and apply it to the largest asset a typical person has, you'll understand why realtors exist. There is so much in the background that they do, you just don't know. Plus the more experienced ones know how to handle the negotiations with the other (buyers) realtor to get you the max $$$.

Do yourself a favor and get a realtor. Saving yourself 1% or 2% is not worth the hassle.

No way I'd pay someone to sell the house that I know more about than anyone.

I’ve always used a realtor because, up until my sale last year, the fee has been reimbursed by my employer. On my last sale, I negotiated a 4% commission. Good results.
Mike

Sibling has sold four in fifteen years w/o a realtor.

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Bean:
Ask yourself "what are the unknowns that I don't know about"

Honestly I don't know what "unknowns" a realtor can advise me about that a competent real estate lawyer couldn't. Especially when I'm not the one at risk. House will be sold as-is with full disclosure and either the buyers agree and come up with the funds or they don't. I'm very experienced in qualifying borrowers for loans, I did it for 10 years. I'm also selling a house that checks every box that matters. It might not have granite/quartz countertops or have the latest <insert bullshit trend here> but it has everything that matters. No expense was spared on the essentials and everything has been maintained meticulously and I have the records to prove it. Simply put, when people come to my home they can't believe I'm selling it. I'm exactly 30 minutes to Boston (without traffic), 20 minutes to Manchester, 40 minutes to Concord and 30-45 minutes to the seacoast depending if you want to goto Hampton or Portsmouth. The location is a commuter's dream. 3 bedrooms (could technically argue a 4th that is a home office in the extension), 2 full bathrooms, 2 kitchens, living room, dining room, kitchen, with a screened in 3 season porch, outdoor deck and patio with a fenced in yard. Is it a McMansion? Hell no. It's about 1800 sq ft not including the 90% finished walk out basement where the 2nd kitchen is. I've shared my plans with friends who still work in real estate/financing and they assured me this house will sell itself and that I should ask 10-20% over the going market because if ask for the appraised value it'll sell in no time and money would definitely be left on the table.


As for the buyer's realtor I need to discuss with the lawyer to confirm how I want to handle that. My first impression is if the buyer's agent wants to get paid the buyers can pay them out of pocket (or fire them, I don't care) or I increase the sale price and the buyer's agent can be compensated with the difference at close. I have friends who are selling 2 streets over. Their house hasn't been on the market for a month and they've already gotten buyers coming in with cash offers, no financing required. Basic principles of supply and demand apply and the demand here is the highest I've ever seen in 30+ years. There's a local guy by the name of Joe Faro who bought the old Rockingham racetrack and put in this Godly "Tuscan Village" complete with boutique stores and condos/apartments/duplexes. He can't build housing fast enough and I know tenants who are renting for $3k-4k a month for a 1200sq foot 2 bed 2 bath condo/apt with thin walls. My house offers a lot more and for under $3k/month with 20% down even with the higher interest rates. Anyone who has the down payment and can secure a loan would be stupid not to buy this vs. rent. See for yourself: Tuscan Village Rentals.


I'll pay for an appraisal out of pocket. Building inspector too. My main concern is how to I get maximum exposure and deal with the buyer's agents. Worst case scenario if it doesn't work out the way I thought I'll just use a realtor in 2-3 months.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Hildur,

quote:

Originally posted by ridewv:
No way I'd pay someone to sell the house that I know more about than anyone.

But that’s not the point.

The Realtor gets their cut because they’re doing a lot of behind the scenes work that you don’t really see or want to be involved with. Lots of paperwork too and dealing with all the buyers and buyers agents as well.

If you think they’re just showing up and doing nothing yet taking that commission, you don’t really know how any of this works.

I’ve sold two properties and would never try doing it all myself.

quote:

Originally posted by ridewv:
No way I'd pay someone to sell the house that I know more about than anyone.

That's what inspired this whole thing. I know EVERYTHING about this house and have receipts for all major renovations (and some minor) dating back 30 years. I have the full service history and can even provide electric and heating bills for the last 20+ years. I have no doubt I'll sell it a hell of a lot better than any realtor so long as I have a lawyer to watch my back and to cross the Ts and dot the Is when it comes down to the contracts. IMO paying $35-40k to realtor commissions for a house that will sell itself is foolish. This is a turnkey home that any family can move into tomorrow and be proud of the home they're living in. If they want to redo the kitchen, bathrooms, tear down the "1 bedroom/home office" extension and put a 2 car garage with more bedrooms/bathrooms above it so be it. They could easily add another 2 bedrooms and a full bath over the 2 car garage and have it connect to the top of the main staircase so it's all connected at the second level. I never felt the need since this has always been too much house for me and my roomate but there's a lot of potential to upgrade/expand the home if need be.

The buyer realtor (assuming they have one, which 90% will) is getting their 2-3% one way or another. Sure you can take the stance of they can pay them or screw 'em, but that money will impact their offer and decision process. Basically, you're putting up another hurdle to an easy transaction.

That's before you consider that buyers working with someone will be steered away from your home to even look at in most cases, all over 2-3%. That part's not worth it.

So that leaves the real decision, IMHO, as a 2-3% cost on the seller side of the overall listing/sale fee. On a $600K house, any cumulative loss in negotiation success or asking/selling price of $15K or so is breakeven, and that's before considering the ease of not having to deal with any other parts if you are, just maybe, wrong in how easy it will be to sell your personal home.

There's a reason experienced realtors don't want the sellers involved in the details and communication of the sale transaction. It's not just because we are overbearing self-righteous assholes, it's because it's easier to close deals without having the overbearing self-righteous assholes out in front of the transaction.

Pay the freight, make it easy and profitable. Buyer's don't give a shit about the details that you and I care about in every single element of our home.

I've done it a couple of times. There is work involved in selling. Have to decide if there is anything the realtor will do for you to match the cost. Its not hard, it just needs some attention and hours.

Indeed you know everything about your house and even this "Tuscan Village" development. What about all the other houses in the area? Houses are valued with Inspections and Appraisals. You have those lined up. The Appraiser and Real Estate agent will have the broadest knowledge of the market around you and compare it to yours. They will know what's been sold over the last 6 months, what the trends are and they have the pulse of mortgage people.

It also depends on the market. South NH maybe simple compare to Boston... or NY where I was originally from. NY was a f****** nightmare. I had an irregular back fence line that was not straight but diagonal and it ran across an actual fence that my back neighbor put up. My buyer balked. My agent found out the back house was not even a person but a "trust".. even more complications. The trust didnt want to move the fence. My 25 years experienced agent saved the day, that's all I will say in public.

In PA... I was shocked that RE agents did the close without attorneys. In NY, that would never fly.

quote:

Originally posted by hrcjon:
I've done it a couple of times. There is work involved in selling. Have to decide if there is anything the realtor will do for you to match the cost. Its not hard, it just needs some attention and hours.

I’ve done it too but this is right.
If you can negotiate a 2% buyers agent fee and add that to what you would ask selling it yourself, I bet it would be a win- win.

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Bean:
Indeed you know everything about your house and even this "Tuscan Village" development. What about all the other houses in the area? Houses are valued with Inspections and Appraisals.

Which is why I would pay out of pocket for the appraisal and building inspector to get ahead of any potential issues that may hold up the financing. Why do I need a realtor to tell me what they think my property is worth when I can pay $500 and have a licensed appraiser give me a value that is accurate enough that a lender would accept it based upon recent comparable sales within X distance of my home?


I've researched comparable properties that have sold in my town and I'm ok with the current market value range. Where my house stands out vs. others that have sold are the extras: fenced in yard, 3 season porch that goes the length of the house, outdoor deck that goes the same. 2 kitchens. At the very least it should make my home a more attractive value with all these extras that the others didn't have. At the very most it should increase the value because the outdoor deck was $15k. The walkout patio was $10k. That's $25k of extras (without adjusting for inflation) that other comparable sales didn't have. I power washed the deck and patio and they both look like they were just installed.

The property has been surveyed and the fenced in yard is perfectly square (or rectangular) with me owning some property 2-6 feet beyond my perimeter fence. That's where I dump my grass clippings and leaves so I don't have to look at it. About 20 years ago I had some issues with the abutting neighbors with regard to the property line and we got it all sorted out legally so there is no risk to the buyer. What they see is what they get (and even a little more beyond the fence).

Ok, I don't know what is standard practice in NH but in NY, a mortgage company will run their own appraisal, not accept the sellers paid appraisal. A seller can "manipulate" their appraisal to get more money for the home. It's the same for the survey, I went thru hell with my survey. The were 3 separate surveys done because of that rear property line.

In my case, it was hell, no way I could have sold my property without my realtor. But mine was an extreme case, yours may not have all these circumstances.

^^^^ My appraisal is for my own use to know the valuation, not for the buyer's financing. 20 years ago when I was a loan officer sometimes wholesale lenders would allow existing appraisals to be used but after the real estate collapse in 2008 most banks have their own appraiser or a roster of approved appraisers.

Hildur my youngest sister just closed on a house near Chester that was not listed with MLS. Yes she had a realtor who knew of a house that was going on the market and had her make an offer directly to the Seller so the Owner didn’t have to pay that portion out of their pocket and kept the price lower. I think she paid the agent 2% for finding the house. It is a recently remodeled 7 bedroom, 4 bath home originally built in 1802!

What town are you in if I may ask? I grew up there.

quote:

Yes she had a realtor who knew of a house that was going on the market and had her make an offer directly to the Seller so the Owner didn’t have to pay that portion out of their pocket and kept the price lower. I think she paid the agent 2% for finding the house.

And that's a perfectly reasonable fee...

Hildur, if you already have your best offer all lined up, then it's just a matter of paying a lawyer and a title company to document the transaction.

If you haven't found the buyer, or if there might be a better buyer out there, it would make sense to offer a 2% buyers agent fee.

It would be a good middle ground solution between the 6-7% commission you feel would not be justified and being too clever or stubborn and only hurting yourself.