Chicago shooting has me thinking about what I would have done
I've been reading the reports of the shooting in Chicago and it has me thinking about what I would /should do in a particular scenario. You are CCW. Man and woman in a heated argument in parking lot. You approach and ask if everything is OK? Man lifts shirt exposing firearm and tells you to get lost. My instinct tells me the best thing to do is walk away and call police. The knowledge of what happened to the woman in the Chicago episode has me wondering if that is the right / best response. I'd be interested in other's thoughtsThis message has been edited. Last edited by: nasig,
November 20, 2018, 11:38 AM
radioman
why approach a man and woman arguing in a parking lot? You're not the police. Call 911 if you feel you need to become involved.
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November 20, 2018, 11:40 AM
220-9er
I would not approach. Listen and call police if needed, but from a distance and behind cover.
I keep my distance if I see a heated argument. I either get lost, or if I think it might turn violent, I keep my distance, observe, and call police when necessary. Only when I see a direct threat do I consider intervening.
November 20, 2018, 11:41 AM
ARMT Guy
quote:
Originally posted by nasig: I've been reading the reports of the shooting in Chicago and it has me thinking about what I would /should do in a particular scenario. You are CCW. Man and woman in a heated argument in parking lot. You approach and ask if everything is OK? Man lifts shirt exposing firearm and tells you to get lost. My instinct tells me the best thing to do is walk away and call police. The knowledge of what happened to the woman in the Chicago episode has me wondering if that is the right / best response. I'd be interested in other's thoughts
Are you a police officer? I'm not.
Basically this is what it comes down to. You back off and call in the Cavalry. Unless your individual state law says you can intervene in the case of imminent bodily harm/death/etc, your options are a bit limited.
"Also I heard the voice of the Lord saying who shall I send, and who will go for us? Then said I, here am I, send me."
November 20, 2018, 11:42 AM
FenderBender
quote:
Originally posted by zipriderson: I keep my distance if I see a heated argument. I either get lost, or if I think it might turn violent, I keep my distance, observe, and call police when necessary. Only when I see a direct threat do I consider intervening.
That about sums it up for me
_____________________________________________ Proverbs 3:31 "Envy thou not the oppressor, and choose none of his ways."
November 20, 2018, 11:43 AM
Rightwire
If you're CCW,don't put yourself in a situation that could escalate that you aren't directly involved in to begin with
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November 20, 2018, 11:43 AM
radioman
quote:
What do you think is the best thing to do
I'd start by a change of thread title
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November 20, 2018, 11:51 AM
a1abdj
The first thing I would do is apply a bit of common sense.
I'm not a firefighter. If I see a high rise on fire I'm not going to pull up in my fire truck, pull out the hose, and start spraying water on it. But if I see a car on fire I may use my fire extinguisher on it despite my not being a firefighter.
I'm not a hot air balloon pilot. I'm not going to get in a balloon and take off in it. But if I'm in a hot air balloon and the pilot falls out I'm going to fly it despite me not being a pilot.
I'm not many things, but that's not going to stop me from doing what others sometimes do when it comes to saving a life. Common sense should dictate when it's better to leave it up to somebody else and when it's time to step up because you're the only other option at that exact moment and time.
Originally posted by a1abdj: The first thing I would do is apply a bit of common sense.
I'm not a firefighter. If I see a high rise on fire I'm not going to pull up in my fire truck, pull out the hose, and start spraying water on it. But if I see a car on fire I may use my fire extinguisher on it despite my not being a firefighter.
I'm not a hot air balloon pilot. I'm not going to get in a balloon and take off in it. But if I'm in a hot air balloon and the pilot falls out I'm going to fly it despite me not being a pilot.
I'm not many things, but that's not going to stop me from doing what others sometimes do when it comes to saving a life. Common sense should dictate when it's better to leave it up to somebody else and when it's time to step up because you're the only other option at that exact moment and time.
Think about it this way. in essence everyone on the plane IS a pilot, just ranked in order from the real pilot down to the last guy willing to take his chances of landing a burning plane.
If you take the talent pool of 150 people randomly selected to be on a plane together, how many are better non-professional pilots than you. That's your real number. In reality if you are reasonably coordinated, able to follow instructions, good under pressure and WILLING to try, there may really only be 1 or 2 people better suited to fly a crashing plane than you.
As for the OP's question, I am thinking retreat and call 911.
__________________________
November 20, 2018, 12:03 PM
smlsig
I agree with most of the comments here but let’s take this a step further..
He pulls out his gun and shoots the woman. Now what do you, as a ccw holder, do? Me, I would draw and tell him to drop the gun if I was in a defensive position and sure of what was behind him. Other than that call 911.This message has been edited. Last edited by: smlsig,
------------------ Eddie
Our Founding Fathers were men who understood that the right thing is not necessarily the written thing. -kkina
November 20, 2018, 12:13 PM
Voshterkoff
I leave. I want zero involvement in a domestic situation, much less that of strangers. Your assumption that the woman is innocent is naive.
November 20, 2018, 12:14 PM
GWbiker
quote:
Originally posted by 220-9er: I would not approach. Listen and call police if needed, but from a distance and behind cover.
+1.
If you get physically involved, both parties might turn on you. From a distance, watch and listen and call 911 if necessary.
********* "Some people are alive today because it's against the law to kill them".
November 20, 2018, 12:26 PM
Sig209
quote:
Originally posted by nasig: My instinct tells me the best thing to do is walk away and call police.
if you are not badged LE - this is the only thing you can do...
plus maybe observe from a 'safe' distance while on the phone with 911
ETA -- after he starts shooting people all bets are off
-----------------------------------------
Proverbs 27:17 - As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another.
November 20, 2018, 12:30 PM
Leemur
If the situation seemed that volatile I would not get involved beyond contacting police or security.
November 20, 2018, 12:33 PM
grumpy1
I CCW to protect myself and loved ones from imminent grave danger, not to get involved with other peoples personal business which I know absolutely nothing about and once you get involved you have made it your business and could be held liable for whatever happens. At best I would have let police or local security know about a potential situation.
Walk through any Walmart parking lot on a busy weekend and chances are good you will hear some heated arguments going on.
November 20, 2018, 12:35 PM
nasig
Thank you all. appreciate the input / collective knowledge
November 20, 2018, 12:36 PM
chongosuerte
How is getting involved even a consideration?
Seriously?
Hell to the naw, naw, naw. Call 911 and give location/description, and get the hell out of there.
Let some poor bastard with civil service protection and qualified immunity deal with two grown assed adults that can't get along in public...and sometimes we still get shot/sued/fired/locked up.
Absolutely nuts to interject, short of him head-stomping her in the parking lot or becoming an active shooter.
Knowing what one is talking about is widely admired but not strictly required here.
Although sometimes distracting, there is often a certain entertainment value to this easy standard. -JALLEN
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November 20, 2018, 12:39 PM
fpuhan
Last year, as the first half of a day of active shooter training, I attended a course, "The Dynamics of Violence." It was eye-opening, to say the least.
The major take-aways for me were, (1) Always walk away if and when you think a situation may turn violent, and (2) You can only resort to deadly force when you think your life (or the life of a loved one) is in jeopardy.
I am not a professional troubleshooter. I leave that to the pros.
You can't truly call yourself "peaceful" unless you are capable of great violence. If you're not capable of great violence, you're not peaceful, you're harmless.
NRA Benefactor/Patriot Member
November 20, 2018, 12:42 PM
ASKSmith
You need to think of the “after the fact” information, that you won’t get until afterwards. Walking into an argument, that doesn’t concern you, how do you know the situation?
Purely hypothetical, but say you stumble upon 2 grown men arguing. Guy #1 punches Guy #2. #2 pulls out a knife, and guy #1 pulls out a gun. You pull out your firearm, and guy #1 shoots at you. You return fire, killing him.
Afterwards you find out guy #2 had raped guy #1’s teenage daughter.
Observe and document, from a safe distance. Once you pull that trigger, your life will change. Emotionally, physically, and financially. Not worth it to me.
