I came back to the house from cleaning up a tree across a trail and there was a hang tag on my door from the assessor. "Sorry I missed you, I was by for property valuation which must be done every 3 years, please answer the questions on the reverse and mail back in a timely manor."

It was the typical crap to increase taxable value. "Have you made any improvements?" "Any additions or new structures added?" But this one got me; "Do you have a whole house generator system?" (I don't). But with power interruptions seemingly more frequent they're now wanting you to pay property tax on your power generator. So if you have $20,000 in the bank and you're struggling to stay warm when the power goes off; no property tax on that. But if you spend your $20,000 on a generator system so you'll have heat, refrigerator, and lights, that becomes taxable property! There was no mention of disclosing solar panel generation. I hate property tax with a passion.

Yup. That right there is why I hope that Florida quits talking about it and just does away with primary/homestead property tax.

Not surprising. Any significant capital improvement to the home raises property value, and thus the assessed value. That does include permanently installed whole home generators, alongside the more traditional improvements like additions, interior remodeling, swimming pools, etc.

As for solar panels, they are a capital improvement that can increase the property value, but in AR at least they are specifically excluded from property tax assessment via a special solar exemption. WV may be the same way, hence why they didn't ask about those.


And even if your assessed value goes up, your state may be like AR in that it caps the property tax increase. For example, my house gained ~70% in value as of my most recent assessment, but real estate tax increases in AR are capped at 5% annually for primary residences and 10% annually for all other real estate. So it would take 14 years for my tax bill to match the most recent newly assessed value, and that's without any additional increase from the future reassessments every 3 years.

So realistically, my property tax rate will likely never match the assessed value of my home in my lifetime.

quote:

Originally posted by pedropcola:
Yup. That right there is why I hope that Florida quits talking about it and just does away with primary/homestead property tax.

Property tax seems high in Florida, Barb's brother in Fort Lauderdale pays about $30K a year on his house. Where will the money come from to make up the shortfall?


WV reassesses all property every 3 years and you can't really argue about the value they're pretty accurate. I think they can increase up to 10% annually. They typically raise it 3-5% each of the two years between reassessments.

Ok, not an expert but here goes. My understanding is that Florida has been running surpluses for a few years now. The property proposals have varied from no property tax to only school tax or somewhere in between.

It doesn’t apply to vacation, investment, commercial, second homes, etc. if there was a shortfall that needed to be covered I certainly think bumping those rates is preferable to taxing home owners. If they tax too much those people will liquidate and the market would balance that out.

Bottom line I have read it wouldn’t actually hurt the state much if at all in good times. Either way, put me in the camp of I don’t care because taxing property you own is BS, if they increase taxes elsewhere there is a likelihood I can avoid those taxes by choices I make as a consumer. Ie, gas tax, usage fees, buying a second home, etc.

OK that makes sense to offer tax relief if they're running a surplus.

In my county in TX they do not even send someone by. They automatically and magically raise it the max allowable by law, every fucking year, which is 10%. The day I get to flee this state will be the happiest day of my fucking life. I won’t even get started on homeowners insurance here.

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:
Not surprising. Any significant capital improvement to the home raises property value, and thus the assessed value.

Therein lies the giant, systematic flaw and what makes it so damn immoral. They're taxing based on some theoretical assessed value not actual sales price. Other items with varying values such as stocks are taxed when sold not some theoretical value every February.

It's bad enough for retirees and others on a fixed income that we have an inflation based economy (i.e. the fed targets 2%), the fed's inflation calculation itself is intentionally flawed to minimize raising social security payments (i.e. double whammy), and it's a triple whammy that the house they've lived in for decades has its property taxes increase every year.

quote:

Originally posted by tatortodd:
It's bad enough for retirees and others on a fixed income that we have an inflation based economy (i.e. the fed targets 2%), the fed's inflation calculation itself is intentionally flawed to minimize raising social security payments (i.e. double whammy), and it's a triple whammy that the house they've lived in for decades has its property taxes increase every year.

To help this some states, including AR, freeze your primary home's assessed value at age 65.

It can still go up if the millage increases, but your taxes will no longer increase from increased assessed value.

But you have to request it. It isn't automatic. If that is available in TX and you haven't done that already, you should look into it.

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:
To help this some states, including AR, freeze your primary home's assessed value at age 65.

It can still go up if the millage increases, but your taxes will no longer increase from increased assessed value.

But you have to request it. It isn't automatic. If that is available in TX and you haven't done that already, you should look into it.

Yep. TX passed some 65 and older property tax provisions last year (automatic $60k exemption, tax ceiling on school taxes, and optional tax deferrals until sold) but I'm not 65. I just think it's an immoral system and even more so for those on a fixed income.

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:

To help this some states, including AR, freeze your primary home's assessed value at age 65.

It can still go up if the millage increases, but your taxes will no longer increase from increased assessed value.

But you have to request it. It isn't automatic. If that is available in TX and you haven't done that already, you should look into it.

Not here unfortunately, they set it up to their advantage both ways. The tax they take from home owners every year automatically goes up with home values and inflation. However the $40,000 homestead exemption enacted many years ago for seniors was a fixed figure. Back then when the average price of homes was $40K, the $40K homestead exemption offset the property tax for the average homeowner. Today the same $40K home back then is owned by the same class retired people but the current value might be 200,000 in some areas but $400,000 in others where housing has risen disproportionally. They've allowed the homestead exemption to become almost worthless.

quote:

Originally posted by pedropcola:


It doesn’t apply to vacation, investment, commercial, second homes, etc. if there was a shortfall that needed to be covered I certainly think bumping those rates is preferable to taxing home owners. If they tax too much those people will liquidate and the market would balance that out.

That sounds good, but it may not be.

Here, about half the homes in our neighborhood are seasonally occupied. They would be 2nd homes. In the main central part of the resort, something like 1/3rd are 2nd homes, 1/3rd full-time residences, and 1/3rd short term vacation rentals.

In the resort, those 2nd homes are the big dollar properties. The owners occupy them maybe 8 weeks of the year. Those are the $5M to $50M+ homes.

Second homes pay 2X the tax rate that a primary residence pays. We are certainly grateful that those uber-wealthy are funding most of our city and county expenses!

Both here in the rural burbs and in Old Town, second homes soak up a significant part of the supply of single family homes. If those owners start selling because of onerous taxes, everyone's values will start falling.

The real problem for full-time and part-time residents is the proliferation of short-term rentals. Nightly, weekly, and monthly. We love tourist dollars, but not the increasing number of a-hole tourists who treat our town like a rental car. (Most tourists are great and we love them coming here).

quote:

Originally posted by ridewv:
....... There was no mention of disclosing solar panel generation.

I stopped at the court house this morning, specifically the assessor's office, to clarify a few things and get a copy of the PF11 which is the size, description, and classification of the property, house, other structures. They confirmed that a whole house generation system increases the house value. When I asked if solar generation increases the value as well she said "oh yes solar adds more value than a regular house generator". So at least they're screwing both not one over the other.

quote:

Originally posted by ridewv:

quote:

Originally posted by pedropcola:
Yup. That right there is why I hope that Florida quits talking about it and just does away with primary/homestead property tax.

Property tax seems high in Florida, Barb's brother in Fort Lauderdale pays about $30K a year on his house. Where will the money come from to make up the shortfall?

School taxes won't be eliminated, and that's a big piece of FL property taxes, expect the local jurisdictions will mess with increasing them after.

We need a 65+ rule here for peoples primary residence, there are seniors who have to sell their homes once you find out you owe $1000 a month for taxes and top that with $5000 in insurance, plus utilities that are going through the roof.

Thank the influx of northerners with excessive cash from high property sales who come here and since covid have driven up home values significantly. If your BIL is paying $30K in taxes, well he's got one heck of a valuable property in Ft Lauderdale must be about a $3 Million home.

Rentals, Commercial, second/third homes would pay the taxes.

The state of Florida makes no money off property taxes, they are all local, and Pedropcola is correct local governments have been getting windfalls of cash off new property sales where the base for taxes shifts from grandma and grandpas house they bought at $40K now being worth $600K.

Some places saw 80%+ increase in Tax revenue and were still raising the millage, DeSantis saw that and started the property tax reform plan in motion. Broward county (Ft Lauderdale) is also under investigation with a $450 million increase in tax revenue....

Read up if you'd like to learn more...

https://www.flgov.com/eog/news...e-and-broward-county

quote:

Originally posted by HRK:
If your BIL is paying $30K in taxes, well he's got one heck of a valuable property in Ft Lauderdale must be about a $3 Million home.

Some years back he bought a house for the lot and scraped it to build on. It probably would bring that. It's not huge or anything but it's right on the waterway so he just steps from his back yard into his boat.

quote:

"Have you made any improvements?"

Leeches. It's bad enough that this tax exists at all, but for them to pull this shit...

"Just say no."

I made improvements, or I didn't... it's none of the county's business.

I'm about to pull up carpet and put down some hardwood. Am I going to tell the county about it? Nuh-uh. I might tell my insurance guy. Maybe.

But that's just my opinion.

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:

quote:

"Have you made any improvements?"

Leeches. It's bad enough that this tax exists at all, but for them to pull this shit...

I agree, it's the worst of taxes IMO.

quote:

Originally posted by vthoky:
"Just say no."

I made improvements, or I didn't... it's none of the county's business.

I'm about to pull up carpet and put down some hardwood. Am I going to tell the county about it? Nuh-uh. I might tell my insurance guy....

Correct I just say no improvements but you can't really hide an addition or new building. In my case I had built another a garage to house a tractor, implements, and a couple SXS's, all of which iare supposed to be reported on my personal property tax form which I never have done. The note mentioned "if the filled out form isn't received in a timely manor we'll have to return and then also look inside". So I went to the assessor's office and added the new garage.

I have a friend who works in the assessor office, in a neighboring county, and he says they catch new structures, mobil homes, and additions all the time just using Google Earth images. When people come in outraged that their property value increased they say "well you must have added something".
Of course they say "no I haven't".
"OK then let's have a look" as they bring up Google Earth. "There's now a mobil home with porches that wasn't there last year".
Now red faced he says "but that's my daughter's not mine".
"It's on your property so you're responsible for the tax."

quote:

Originally posted by ridewv:
Correct I just say no improvements but you can't really hide an addition or new building.

No doubt... those things are certainly hard to hide. Gotta be fair about that.

quote:

Originally posted by ridewv:
"if the filled out form isn't received in a timely manor we'll have to return and then also look inside".

And also look inside? Holy smokes, that's the point where I'd become very impolite.

I believe their procedure is they leave the inside or hidden personal property up to the individual to declare. We're also to declare outside additions but if they find we haven't, they have the right to inspect, measure, and no doubt when there they will look inside through windows to see if it's finished or not, with electricity, plumbing, heat, finished attic, basement, etc. My friend (who works for the assessors) says if people dig their heels in to deny access they simply rate the structure as completely finished inside and tax it accordingly. If it's not finished you have to prove it by permitting them to inspect.
So best to report additions and structures filling out the form just to keep them from digging further. As it is the house and all the buildings are accurately reported but I have not given them my SXS's or tractor. FFS they even want me to declare my dogs and pay 5-$10 for each of them! Haven't done that either.