Groan. I have a rental home in a very passive agreasive part of the nation. I how ever live in the part of the nation where "Bless your heart" is a both truthful and a way to say you are a fookin moron.

Our rental home value gone up considerably. Comprerable homes have similar sqft, amenities, but fewer beds, baths or garage space. They are renting for 4200 a month.

We had several homes just built smaller than ours with less sqft, rooms, baths, and garage space sell for into the 600k. If we sold ours we could reinvest that to something closer for me to manage. So after long talks with our realtor, lawyer, ect, we decide to sell.

Enter the renters. They are coming up on 3 years. They had a lease agreement for the first year. They took 3 months to sign the agreement for the second, and never retuened the agreement for the third. They are currently month to month. They pay 2375. Now we do not really want the rental there. Our prefference is to sell and move it over to some commercial realestate with 4 shops i have my eyes on.

We notify the renter our intent to sell at the end of what would be her 3rd year. All shit hits the fan. Our son is graduating next year. No homes that can accomadate our 5 kids in this area come up. We have to be in this school district for our special needs brother. My mother just died, the service is this week.

Funny because her died in december also. They have been good renters pay every month on time never fail. They lost their million dollar home with the beach view, moved up the hill to my house. Beach view only if someone holds your legs while you lean out the 2nd story window.

We are not heartless. So, what would it take for us to keep them as renters another year. Well taxes have trippled, insurance has trippled, and our vairiable rate will go up. So, we would need to refi to a fixed. Which means a investment loan. Well what will that bring our payment to. With all the increases 3200.

So we walk them through this. Explain what it would take for us to be willing to keep the house till the son graduates. They counter that it is 10k a year in our pocket (we begin to realize why they lost their home) and that is to much would we take a more reasonable 2700. We respond no, 3200 is what makes financial sense for us to keep it another year.

They respond 3k, we say we could do 3k starting the rent increase in may 1st and lease from may 1 2017 to april30 2018, with short term least option till july 15 2018. Their normal lease renewal was supposed to be july 1, they never renewed the lease. So, this we can live with. This gives us a couple extra months to stash away the increase and cover what will be a 3200 dollar mortgage for the year, while they pay 3k.

We would rather sell. This whole thing has been dragging on since december in our minds first of march for them. Yet we are not heartless.

So they say, sure we can do that but the increase happens in july.

I lost my shit. Fuck this dicking around pansy ass bullshit. We had explained if we did not have a deal by friday, we would sell. Here it is thursday, and they are fucking around.

I responded.
You have no signed lease agreement, under state law we are required to give you 30 days notice for rent increase, 20 days to vacate. So here are the options as i see it.

1, you take this as your vacate notice and vacate by may 15th. I will be there to walk through the home and inspect.

2 you accept my wifes above agreement, it will be fed exed to you overnight signed and returned by the 6th.

3 we agree to the rent increase starting in july, the rent though will be 3200. <keep in mind comps are 4200>the lease agreement will be fed exed to you overnight signed and returned by april 6th.

If we fail to have a verbal agreement by the end of the day, we will fed ex the vacate notice of may the 15th overnight. If we fail to have a signed lease by april 6th we will send the vacate notice by fedex.

It is 10:35 my time. No response. Tomorrow it I go to fed ex for one reason or another.

Sorry, i typed this on my phone forgive the spelling and other errors.

You've been more than fair. Cut your losses and sell.

Well bless your heart. You have been very patient to put up with their passive aggressive behavior. I guess an attorney will be around shortly to advise you on lease arrangements in Virginia. Cannot help with the legal aspects, other than to say it depends what the lease says and what the law has to say about eviction if it comes to that. With the rent being what it is you probably wont have to have law enforcement accompany you to toss them out.

I have heard these sorts of excuses before from people, I run a small business. Keep it professional with a simple letter dictating your wishes.

In the meantime watch Pacific Heights again. {just joking}

quote:

Originally posted by ZSMICHAEL:
Well bless your heart. You have been very patient to put up with their passive aggressive behavior. I guess an attorney will be around shortly to advise you on lease arrangements in Virginia. Cannot help with the legal aspects, other than to say it depends what the lease says and what the law has to say about eviction if it comes to that. With the rent being what it is you probably wont have to have law enforcement accompany you to toss them out.

I have heard these sorts of excuses before from people, I run a small business. Keep it professional with a simple letter dictating your wishes.

In the meantime watch Pacific Heights again. {just joking}

The rental is 3k miles away.

quote:

The rental is 3k miles away

May I ask where? Sorry assumed Virginia Coast. Not crazy California I hope. God knows what might happen there.

It rains more than cali. I purposly left out the correct family number, genders and place.

I understand. I think a letter thanking them for being good tenants with a simple statement that you are selling the property and need them to move by a specific date would be more than fair. In my limited real estate knowledge since you do not have a written agreement the required notice is dictated by state law. I would run the letter by a real estate attorney who practices in the state where the rental is located.

These kinds of folks wear you down. I have lots of experience with that. Good luck

It is your house, do what makes the most sense to YOU. It sounds like YOU want to sell it, so sell it. I would tell them you have 2 options. 1. is to buy it for X price. Or 2. move out in 30 days and the realtors sign goes in the front yard. PERIOD

Sell it. If they want to buy it, they are welcome to.
This is business, and it sounds like you've been more than fair in timing, notification, and looking at options with them.

You gave her multiple chances/options. Sounds like she has decided to find a new place during trying times. I bet she wishes she returned that renewal right now. Is she really that stupid to not realize that a comparable home is going to cost her $1,000 more than your offer? Fuck her she can deal with her bad decisions and double the boys up in a room or whatever she needs to in order to make ends meet, not your problem. A lease agreement is there to protect both parties, she gave up her ability to whine and complain when she failed to sign it.

Eating two hundred a month plus the cost to refi may or may not be offset at the end. 600,000 @ 3% = 18,000. If the market is trending up the only thing you might be out is the ability to reinvest closer to home. You've said houses in the area have appreciated a lot, think the trend will continue?

Also since both her parents have passed, isn't it likely she received some kind of inheritance? The parents were not paupers were they?

Good luck. I don't deal well with irrational people.

Head 'em up, move 'em out.

You have been far more accomodating than anybody could reasonably expect. Worse, I would be concerned that the eventual ending to this is only going to be more complicated/difficult the further down the road you are, and you should stick to the plan you have that is best for you.

IOW:

I'm a real estate lawyer which you can love or hate, but I'll give it to you straight.

Sorry, sell the house. Rates are going to go up, values are going to go down and you will lose money fucking with these people who will stop paying at the end of next year because they know you will sell then. So they will slow drag their feet and late pay and all the bullshit that will cost you 90 days of rent next year roughly $9,000, plus you'll have to get a lawyer to get them out because they are long distance, so that is another $2500, and then you run market risk of decrease in value, say another $20,000-30,000.

So low side your going to lose $10,000 high side it's $40,000. Put that back into the budget calculator and let me know how you make out.

So really the choice is screw their family or yours.

If you can't get them to sign a lease, how do you intend to get them out?? Bite the bullet and get these people out now.

quote:

Originally posted by Timdogg6:
I'm a real estate lawyer which you can love or hate, but I'll give it to you straight.

Sorry, sell the house. Rates are going to go up, values are going to go down and you will lose money fucking with these people who will stop paying at the end of next year because they know you will sell then. So they will slow drag their feet and late pay and all the bullshit that will cost you 90 days of rent next year roughly $9,000, plus you'll have to get a lawyer to get them out because they are long distance, so that is another $2500, and then you run market risk of decrease in value, say another $20,000-30,000.

So low side your going to lose $10,000 high side it's $40,000. Put that back into the budget calculator and let me know how you make out.

So really the choice is screw their family or yours.

If you can't get them to sign a lease, how do you intend to get them out?? Bite the bullet and get these people out now.

We have been talking about this all morning. They responded at exactly 12 am last night with more passive agressive bullshit.

quote:

So really the choice is screw their family or yours.

Very well said.

This is business so you have to treat it that way.
The place will sell better without renters in place and cleaned up with a fresh coat of paint.
If you leave them there, they will make it a miserable experience for anybody to show the place.
Remember, no good dead goes unpunished.

you own the house. You want to sell? Sell it.

Law requires 20 days? Cool. We're selling the house and here's your 20 days. If the people were cool about it I might have tried to talk to any potential buyer about letting them stay, but screw that at this point.

quote:

Originally posted by DSgrouse:

We have been talking about this all morning. They responded at exactly 12 am last night with more passive agressive bullshit.

They literally waited until the last minute? That goes beyond "passive" and they are purposefully and intentionally screwing with you. You've done your best to be a decent person, but they've crossed the line. Cut them loose and get on with your life.

quote:

Originally posted by DSgrouse:

quote:

Originally posted by Timdogg6:
I'm a real estate lawyer which you can love or hate, but I'll give it to you straight.

Sorry, sell the house. Rates are going to go up, values are going to go down and you will lose money fucking with these people who will stop paying at the end of next year because they know you will sell then. So they will slow drag their feet and late pay and all the bullshit that will cost you 90 days of rent next year roughly $9,000, plus you'll have to get a lawyer to get them out because they are long distance, so that is another $2500, and then you run market risk of decrease in value, say another $20,000-30,000.

So low side your going to lose $10,000 high side it's $40,000. Put that back into the budget calculator and let me know how you make out.

So really the choice is screw their family or yours.

If you can't get them to sign a lease, how do you intend to get them out?? Bite the bullet and get these people out now.

We have been talking about this all morning. They responded at exactly 12 am last night with more passive agressive bullshit.

Scorched earth, fuck them, it's war and you better fight to win. When nice fails because the other party won't play then it's time to be ruthless.

engage a local real estate attorney that specializes in this sort of thing. tell him that you want them out asap and let him handle it.