A large portion of police calls are due to the fact that people are inept at life and can't solve problems on their own, so they try to dump them on the police.

Suck at being a parent and can't control your kids? Call the cops. (Your 16 year-old beating up your husband in the living room is a legitimate call. The 5 year-old throwing a tantrum is not).

Suck at checking out the noise the racoons made against the side of your house in the night, or the broom that fell in the kitchen closet? Call the cops.

Suck at reading your gas gauge or changing a tire? Call the cops. (Especially when you're a healthy, grown-ass man).

Suck at picking a boyfriend/girlfriend/spouse/significant other and now you fight all the time? Call the cops, make them deal with them tonight, so you can let them back in next weekend and start the cycle all over. Again and again and again.

Suck at chosing who you had kids with so you now can't get along or behave like adults long enough to conduct a simple custody exchange? Call the cops. Every damn weekend. And what do those poor kids learn from watching this?

Suck at getting along with your neighbor to the point that you can't agree who mows or rakes that six-inch stretch of yard by the tree, or who parks in what spot on the (public) street? Call the cops.

Suck at not leaving unsecured loose items like balloons or papers near heat vents in your office? Let the alarm call the cops when the furnace kicks on in the middle of the night. Night after night after night.

I personally would never dream of calling the cops on a six year old kid...but it happens all the time, because adults don't have the balls to be adults anymore. It's an individual problem, but society is rapidly mainstreaming it. And the lawyers don't help. With all the litigation and liability, nobody wants to risk dealing with anything themselves anymore, especially when it's easier to just dump the problem on the cops, because they have to respond to the calls, even if it's not a police issue.

Oh, and when the officer tells you he can't solve your problem for you in the way you would like, because it's not a criminal matter and he has no authority to take action, be sure to ask for his "name and badge number" and call his boss to complain.

Well said!

quote:

Originally posted by 92fstech:
...be sure to ask for his "name and badge number" and call his boss to complain.

But, but... The suspect was gray and wearing a mask. I wanted the officer to arrest the raccoon with itty bitty handcuffs.

Hence the prevalence of CCTV cameras everywhere in schools. A good friend is the Dean of Girls in a local high school and several times a week it's necessary to show parents how guilty their child is.

Daughter in law is teacher. She had a boy in her class a couple years ago that kept punching her. She told her bosses and they said there is nothing they can do about it. He was a crack baby.
that makes it OK? Yeah, he was a third grader but still. I told her to take her husband to school with her one day. The boys mom(no dad) wanted to punch her just for telling her about her son.

I made the transition from the high school classroom to administrator about 3 years ago. I can tell you that students acting out is one of the most frustrating components of the job. The only time we are allowed to go hands-on with students is if they are engaged in a fight or attacking another person.

Administrators are always the first folks on the scene when we get a call about something physical. If the student(s) refuse to stop for us, our SRO's come in and it becomes a police matter.

At our school, we have a very good relationship with our SRO's and we all understand where the line is between where the school stops and the police start. But this has come as the result of working closely together, debriefing affter each incident to determine how we can do it better next time, and building a great deal of trust. Heck, we even hang out together after work. But I'm sure that we are in the minority when it comes to that relationship.

92fstech stated it perfectly.

quote:

Originally posted by Ronin101:
The problem is that no one in society to allowed to correct behavior. Not parents, teachers, principals, police!!!! no one!! I am actually surprised that society hasn't collapsed even more.

If this had happened when I was a kid. the teacher and principal would have slapped me silly. If that didn't have the desired effect your father would have been called and he would have apologized and then whipped your ass again!.

^^^^

Corporal punishment was alive and well in my school as a kid. In junior high, a favorite of the teachers was to make “bum bats.” Teachers would take a ping pong paddle to the wood shop and drill holes in it so they could get a faster swing on a kid’s bum. It was quite effective from what I heard. We also had the hot box (a small closet a kid had to stand in) to the hair treatment.

Probably the two most inventive forms of corporal punishment were the “belts” and the “hooks.” The belts were simple, the shop teacher, typically, would have the class line up in two rows and then the offending student would have to run through the line with every student taking a wack at the back lower side of the kid. No buckles allowed. I went through the belts twice in one day during shop. I still don’t know what I did to deserve the first one but the second time, a kid was driving me nuts, wouldn’t leave me alone, and I finally had had it. So, I grabbed an oil can and proceeded to empty it up and down his shirt. I thought Mr. H’s eyes were going to pop out when he saw that.

The hooks, I never personally experienced, but that involved two teachers taking the boy (never girls as they didn’t have belts) out to the hallway and hanging them from the back of their belt from a coat hook on the wall. Our junior high was a former high school, and it had coat hooks like six feet off the ground so even the tallest kid was kicking in the wind. The PIA student was left hanging until class got out as a teaching moment.

Needless to say, I survived, learned and we had, when I think back on it, a really well run school.

Wonder how it's going for all of these shit parents who now have to homeschool their little treasures. A friend of mine who is a teacher has been getting constant calls from parents that his students wouldn't do their required classwork at home. They don't like his response of "Well, they wouldn't do the work while in the actual classroom, why would you expect it to be different at home?"

quote:

Originally posted by Maestro:
I made the transition from the high school classroom to administrator about 3 years ago. I can tell you that students acting out is one of the most frustrating components of the job. The only time we are allowed to go hands-on with students is if they are engaged in a fight or attacking another person.

Administrators are always the first folks on the scene when we get a call about something physical. If the student(s) refuse to stop for us, our SRO's come in and it becomes a police matter.

At our school, we have a very good relationship with our SRO's and we all understand where the line is between where the school stops and the police start. But this has come as the result of working closely together, debriefing affter each incident to determine how we can do it better next time, and building a great deal of trust. Heck, we even hang out together after work. But I'm sure that we are in the minority when it comes to that relationship.

Why have you abdicated your authority over classroom discipline and handed it over to the police?

YOU are the problem. YOU are shirking your responsibility! The continuing proliferation of more and more do-nothing administrators is the cancer in our school systems. Grow a pair do DO YOUR JOB or redesign and STOP making excuses for your failures.

quote:

Originally posted by Lefty Sig:

Why have you abdicated your authority over classroom discipline and handed it over to the police?

YOU are the problem..........

I don't think he is. Even using force to break up a fight walks a fine line with simple assault. Physical altercations in school can lead to a whirlwind of legal issues ...... for the participants, school staff and county. Also, the U.S. is a VERY litigious society. All it takes is a broke attorney and parents looking for a payday and it can cost the school district a bundle in defense fees. It's just the smart play to CYA by involving the local authorities.

Y'all know by this time that I am not a L.E.O. , I always respected them ,but never wanted to be one. Here's a question for you.

Would you prefer to be called out to a school to handle a teacher / student hassle with some non consensual "battery" ?

Where both parties might learn / benefit from your professional experienced interaction ,Or, would you rather be intervening in an altercation in a methville ,drunken stupor, domestic dispute between a married drunk,his drunk wife and the drunk side piece

( all w/ numerous priors) from two trailers down ?
That you were at last Thursday, twice. ?

This message has been edited. Last edited by: bendable,

quote:

Originally posted by bendable:
Y'all know by this time that I am not a L.E.O. , I always respected them ,but never wanted to be one. Here's a question for you. Would you prefer to be called out to a school to handle a teacher / student hassle with some non consensual "battery" ? Where both parties might learn / benefit from your professional experianced interaction ,Or, would you rather be intervening in an altercation in a methville ,drunken stuper, domestic dispute between a married drunk,his drunk wife and the drunk side piece ( all w/ numerous priors) from two trailers down ? That you were at last Thursday, twice. ?

Both calls are the result of people not using common sense to solve their issues and dumping their problems on "the man". To me, both are equally frustrating.

Cops are not social workers. Simple as that. Growing up in the inner city people called the cops on misbehaving kids. After the visit the cops told them they better not call again. That approach worked for awhile. As kids we would turn on the fire hydrants when it got real hot. Cops generally let that go.

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:
What he wrote ^^^^^

Indeed!

Is there any way possible that a visit from the police , to a school can in any way be a learning experience for all involved?

make it an opportunity for a positive instead of a scary , force on force on force problem?

perhaps both scenarios that I posted above are just no win situations for all involved.

quote:

Are there some circumstances where an arrest would be appropriate? Sure, but this was obviously not one of them!

In Colorado nobody under age 10 can be held criminally liable for a crime. At best you can summons their parents.

A really out of control 6 year old MIGHT warrant restraint, but could not actually be arrested.

I might physically restrain a 6 year old, move them to an office, etc... but I can’t imagine having to cuff one.

quote:

Originally posted by Lefty Sig:

Why have you abdicated your authority over classroom discipline and handed it over to the police?

YOU are the problem. YOU are shirking your responsibility! The continuing proliferation of more and more do-nothing administrators is the cancer in our school systems. Grow a pair do DO YOUR JOB or redesign and STOP making excuses for your failures.

I’m surprised that you think he had any choice in the matter. It’s society’s problem, not his.

As mentioned, this country has become so litigious that in school you cannot lay
hands on a child without a very, very good reason. His hands were tied by US, the citizens of this country.

I’ve seen it; I, too was shocked, but thems the facts. Times were different when we were kids.

Just like I want pilots flying the aircraft, when I am on a plane, I think we need the teachers to do the educating, in the schools. Social interaction is a huge part of a productive society . As our society continually changes , it's important the population to keep adjusting with what evolutionary directions that may be take place.

quote:

Originally posted by tanksoldier:

I might physically restrain a 6 year old, move them to an office, etc... but I can’t imagine having to cuff one.

It starts early.

My wife has owned a pre-school for almost 30 years. For about the past 10 years she has had to terminate the attendance of at least one child per year due to consistent violent behavior towards herself, other children or both. We're talking 4 and 5 year olds. Some might say that in her position she should handle it but handling it would be all she would be doing with time that should be spent teaching all the other children.