I know there are certain things I'd have to pay more for owning a BMW but labor, wtf? I was quoted $500 to change 4 spark plugs. 4. Spark. Plugs. I have no problem with them being very specific NGK plugs. Parts are going to be somewhat expensive. Figure, from the dealership, 4 plugs go for $100ish. That means they want $400 for labor? Sure you have to go out and spend $6 on a thin walled spark plug socket and have to have a socket extension but damn. I jumped on youtube and found a video. Took the guy 30 minutes to complete the job. Guess how long it took me? 30 minutes. I make $40/hr. There is no way that job could have ever taken me 10 hours.

Damn stealerships!

It's what the book calls for.

So why is the NGK plug so special that there is not another brand that meets the spec?

41

quote:

Originally posted by 41:
So why is the NGK plug so special that there is not another brand that meets the spec?

41

Good question. I honestly don't know. I got mine off Amazon for $16 each. The stealership prices are usually a lot more than anywhere else.

quote:

Originally posted by Phantom229:

quote:

Originally posted by 41:
So why is the NGK plug so special that there is not another brand that meets the spec?

41

Good question. I honestly don't know. I got mine off Amazon for $16 each. The stealership prices are usually a lot more than anywhere else.

According to many in a thread I posted recently about Ford wasntimg $83 for the same EXACT same OEM part I got on Amazon for $23 it is their business model.
Make very little profit on selling the cars but then crush you on parts and labor.

Seems like a flawed business model to me as I take no issues buying parts elsewhere and doing the work myself.

But this has been the model for many decades so I guess there are enough folks willing to pay the higher dealership prices that it works.

Nashville VW dealer parts pricing is 10% (to the penny) above VW suggested pricing. They once wanted $400 to replace a part that cost me $75 & 10 minutes to replace.

I love Ford but some of the dealer not so much. Our local dealer's service department told Wendy that her rear rotors needed to be replaced ASAP. She couldn't wait so not done. The truck just went in for oil/lube and the report comes back that her breaks are above specs all the way around. I guess they needed a $800 job that day. We have switched dealers since. Chris

quote:

Originally posted by 41:
So why is the NGK plug so special that there is not another brand that meets the spec?

I don't recommend changing brands or types of spark plugs from OEM. Maybe it will run just fine, but quite often it causes poor running and/or the engine MIL lit from misfire codes. If that BMW calls for XYZ triple-unobtanium plugs, fork it over.

As for "overcharging at the 'stealership,'" this thread might be of interest, although I'm sure no minds will be changed.

I just replaced the coils and plugs with OEMs in my Z4. I bought the parts on Amazon for $200 and paid a local BMW mechanic $126 to install all 6.

The one I get from my dealer, Your cabin filter needs to be replaced.
I bring my car to the dealer because we get coupons for oil changes that are reasonable. Every time I go they tell me the cabin filter needs to be changed.
I ask How much, It is only $56.00 I say no thanks. I change my own. A filter cost around $12.00 I understand book rate but every time they service the car they pull the filter out to check it so they already have it out.
My filter is behind the glove compartment and easy to get to. It takes less than 2 minutes to change.
It is the same with the engine filter. I change that my self also.

quote:

Originally posted by 71 TRUCK:
The one I get from my dealer, Your cabin filter needs to be replaced.
I bring my car to the dealer because we get coupons for oil changes that are reasonable. Every time I go they tell me the cabin filter needs to be changed.
I ask How much, It is only $56.00 I say no thanks. I change my own. A filter cost around $12.00 I understand book rate but every time they service the car they pull the filter out to check it so they already have it out.
My filter is behind the glove compartment and easy to get to. It takes less than 2 minutes to change.
It is the same with the engine filter. I change that my self also.

Yes, it takes 2 minutes to change if you have it in your hands. But if you have to walk to the parts department, have them look up the part, find the part on the shelf, hand it to the mechanic, have the mechanic walk back to the vehicle, then install it, I can see a 30 minute labor charge as justified.

To be honest, it costs me just as much to change my own oil with free labor, as it does for me to pay the dealership to do it and they're paying someone to do it. I can see where they have to make a profit somewhere.

I stick to OEM parts and fluids. I know they meet the manufacturers requirements and what the car was built with. And, in all honesty, they're hardly anymore money than a aftermarket part or fluid usually. Where I source them from and whether or not I install them myself varies......

I generally have my Ford dealer do major stuff......spark plugs (mine has the heads where the plugs are known to break off in them), transmission flush, etc.) But I've found their prices, while a touch high possibly, have always been exactly what they quoted up front and the work was done without an issue. Some jobs just aren't worth me screwing around busting my knuckles the entire day and other jobs are easy so I do those.

quote:

Originally posted by jimmy123x:

quote:

Originally posted by 71 TRUCK:
The one I get from my dealer, Your cabin filter needs to be replaced.
I bring my car to the dealer because we get coupons for oil changes that are reasonable. Every time I go they tell me the cabin filter needs to be changed.
I ask How much, It is only $56.00 I say no thanks. I change my own. A filter cost around $12.00 I understand book rate but every time they service the car they pull the filter out to check it so they already have it out.
My filter is behind the glove compartment and easy to get to. It takes less than 2 minutes to change.
It is the same with the engine filter. I change that my self also.

Yes, it takes 2 minutes to change if you have it in your hands. But if you have to walk to the parts department, have them look up the part, find the part on the shelf, hand it to the mechanic, have the mechanic walk back to the vehicle, then install it, I can see a 30 minute labor charge as justified.

To be honest, it costs me just as much to change my own oil with free labor, as it does for me to pay the dealership to do it and they're paying someone to do it. I can see where they have to make a profit somewhere.

I stick to OEM parts and fluids. I know they meet the manufacturers requirements and what the car was built with. And, in all honesty, they're hardly anymore money than a aftermarket part or fluid usually. Where I source them from and whether or not I install them myself varies......

I generally have my Ford dealer do major stuff......spark plugs (mine has the heads where the plugs are known to break off in them), transmission flush, etc.) But I've found their prices, while a touch high possibly, have always been exactly what they quoted up front and the work was done without an issue. Some jobs just aren't worth me screwing around busting my knuckles the entire day and other jobs are easy so I do those.

if it takes a guy 28 minutes to walk to the parts dept and pu a filter and walk back the manager needs to have a talk with him.

What is the dealerships hourly rate for service and repairs? Around here the small town dealerships is around $100/hr. and the big stealerships is $125,$135/hr. Independent repair shops go for $65/hr.
Don't know what the manufacturers reimbursement rate to the shop is for warrantied service?
My most recent example was for a drive line repair, actually some mechanical unit that handles AWD/4WD to the rear axle, that had failed twice at 40,000 mile intervals. Second time manufacturer refused to warranty as the vehicle was purchased used so according to them did not come under 100,000 warranty. Stealership wanted $1700, with $1200 of that for part. Local repair shop found part with 4 miles on it for $350, and $250 for labor.
Had the spark plugs changed, $4 per plug, $65. Most of the labor was getting the plastic shields out of the way, and reinstalled. Said they checked the spark plug wires and they were fine.

quote:

Originally posted by nasig:

quote:

Originally posted by jimmy123x:

quote:

Originally posted by 71 TRUCK:
The one I get from my dealer, Your cabin filter needs to be replaced.
I bring my car to the dealer because we get coupons for oil changes that are reasonable. Every time I go they tell me the cabin filter needs to be changed.
I ask How much, It is only $56.00 I say no thanks. I change my own. A filter cost around $12.00 I understand book rate but every time they service the car they pull the filter out to check it so they already have it out.
My filter is behind the glove compartment and easy to get to. It takes less than 2 minutes to change.
It is the same with the engine filter. I change that my self also.

Yes, it takes 2 minutes to change if you have it in your hands. But if you have to walk to the parts department, have them look up the part, find the part on the shelf, hand it to the mechanic, have the mechanic walk back to the vehicle, then install it, I can see a 30 minute labor charge as justified.

To be honest, it costs me just as much to change my own oil with free labor, as it does for me to pay the dealership to do it and they're paying someone to do it. I can see where they have to make a profit somewhere.

I stick to OEM parts and fluids. I know they meet the manufacturers requirements and what the car was built with. And, in all honesty, they're hardly anymore money than a aftermarket part or fluid usually. Where I source them from and whether or not I install them myself varies......

I generally have my Ford dealer do major stuff......spark plugs (mine has the heads where the plugs are known to break off in them), transmission flush, etc.) But I've found their prices, while a touch high possibly, have always been exactly what they quoted up front and the work was done without an issue. Some jobs just aren't worth me screwing around busting my knuckles the entire day and other jobs are easy so I do those.

if it takes a guy 28 minutes to walk to the parts dept and pu a filter and walk back the manager needs to have a talk with him.

How much of that time do you suppose is for the mechanic waiting at the parts counter? He might not be the first guy in line. Parts guy might have to look up a part number. This all takes time.

Note, I generally do not go to the car dealer for service. I use a local repair shop, much closer to my home, lower cost, owned by a guy who has P-series pistols in .357 SIG, so he can't be all bad.

Best thing in my opinion about using an independent shop, and this could very well be the subject of a new rant thread: I am very detail oriented when I report a problem, on the theory that the more information the service guy has, the more likely the problem will be diagnosed and fixed properly. Example: I might report an engine hesitation that occurs 120 seconds after start-up (there is some sort of two minute timer in the computer down there in the engine room). I describe it exactly. If I'm dealing with an independent shop, I can transmit the details directly to the guy who does the work. If I'm at a big dealer, the service writer acts as an intermediary; s/he listens to what I say, then writes on the work order, "runs rough." This is the primary reason that I seek out a good competent independent shop. My experience is that I'm much more likely to have the repair done properly the first time, no need to return the next day for the same problem.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Labor rates at auto mechanics seem outrageous. Dealer's rates seem even worse. German dealers are worse still. Maybe the are outrageous, maybe they aren't. I don't know.

Parts prices at the dealer are higher than Ebay or Amazon, or even the local Hi-Lo.

But this can't surprise any adult in the United States who owns a car.

Deal with it, people.

If you can't/don't want to spin a wrench yourself, can you find a local independent German specialist mechanic? I'm in the middle of Manhattan, and I found a VW/Audi specialist a two blocks from my garage.

quote:

Originally posted by jhe888:
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Labor rates at auto mechanics seem outrageous. Dealer's rates seem even worse. German dealers are worse still. Maybe the are outrageous, maybe they aren't. I don't know.

Parts prices at the dealer are higher than Ebay or Amazon, or even the local Hi-Lo.

But this can't surprise any adult in the United States who owns a car.

Deal with it, people.

I'm not surprised that the labor prices are high but $400 to do a 30 minute job is beyond excessive.

BBMW, there are things that I just can't do because I don't have the tools and or knowledge to fix certain problems. For those I will go to an independent mechanic. For the basics like spark plugs and oil changes, I'll gladly do myself.

After getting ripped off by the local Ford dealership, I now use an independent repairman.
They put parts in my car that had just been replaced, after I told them all I wanted them to do is find the bad spark plug wire and change it period. But, they replaced a 1 day old air filter and 1 day old pcv valve and kept the ones they supposedly took out. I told the manager or the service Dept, but he did not care.

I'm SO GLAD we have a local guy who is honest as can be and his rates are really great. Last time I got front brakes done on my wife's car, I expected the bill to be $250-$300 but he was around $175 and that was with new rotors as well.

I only go to the dealer now if I HAVE TO, i.e, for a recall repair or something like that.

quote:

Originally posted by jhe888:
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Labor rates at auto mechanics seem outrageous. Dealer's rates seem even worse. German dealers are worse still. Maybe the are outrageous, maybe they aren't. I don't know.

Parts prices at the dealer are higher than Ebay or Amazon, or even the local Hi-Lo.

But this can't surprise any adult in the United States who owns a car.

Deal with it, people.

Exactly, it's a darn good thing these people don't own a boat. Annual servicing on a pair of 200hp Mercury verado outboards is just under $3000 a year whether you use the boat or not!!!!!!!!!!