I have a Sig 220. I would like to cast some bullets for it. I'm thinking of either a 200 grain SWC or 225-230 grain truncated flatpoint.
The Lee 6 cavity molds in each of those configurations intrigue me. I would like to try the tumble lube groove design. I don't know why, except that it appears to be a good design.
I do have a SAECO lube/size press.
So, that's my starting position.
Can you provide some insight? I guess some semi autos don't handle (feed) SWC bullets well, due to ramp design or ramp polishing. Does the Sig 220 handle 200 grain SWC?
Does anyone currently cast 200-230 grain plain base bullets for their 45 acp (sig 220 shooters preferred, but all are welcome to input)?
What bullet mold,design do you prefer in the 200-230 grain range in .45 acp?
I started casting for my 245 this spring. I am currently using the Lee 230gr RN tumble lube bullet as shown in ScreamingCockatoo's post and it seems to work well. I also bought some locally cast 200gr SWC bullets and had absolutely no trouble with feeding those.
What I have noticed is the 200gr SWCs that were a conventional lube leaded my barrel pretty bad in the first inch or so of the barrel. Those bullets were fairly hard, around 20 BHN (with the Lee hardness tester). My 230gr tumble lube bullets are about 14 hardness (cast from wheel weights). After crudding up the barrel with 22 rounds of the 200gr bullets I shot another 22 rounds of the Lee tumble lube bullets and the barrel was much cleaner. I had read this on other forums, that the Lee tumble lube design can clean out leading, but I didn't really believe it until I tried.
Some other notes: I just picked up a chronograph and my handloads are middle to low on the velocity scale. This may contribute to leading because there isn't enough pressure to swell the base of the bullet and seal the bore. Shooting this winter into snowbanks revealed that the harder lead bullets I had bought were definitely seeing gas cutting up the sides. I think this is a big reason the softer bullets I cast myself helped clean my barrel (although the snow melted before I could test the bullets I cast). Next, the tumble lube bullets are messy to work with. Maybe I am putting it on too thick (2 coats), but my fingers get covered in it while loading and the cases get some on them while the bullet is getting seated. It also leaves some build up on the feed ramp of the barrel, but I haven't seen any issue in my gun from this. I guess the mess is a relatively minor annoyance.
I've heard P220 don;t always like the 200grLSWC. The 230grTC or RN 6cav. molds form Lee are great for the money. I am not a fan of Alox lubes, like mnz, too messy, so the tumble bullets are out. You already have a lube/sizer. so I would go w/ either of those 230gr w/ a lube groove.
IF YOU AREN'T HANDLOADING, YOU AREN'T SHOOTING ENOUGH! If you could make your own gas, wouldn't you???
Posts: 1284 | Location: ca, usa | Registered: February 17, 2004
buttstock, The Lee push through sizers work well and are quicker to size if you are using liquid alox to lube. They are used on a standard reloading press.
I had a small problem with the Lee TL452-230-2R in my 220.
It shoots the Lee TL452-230-SWC excellent.
Them 6 cav moulds are schweet.
mnzrxer: The commercial cast bullets are harder and probably sized .452" Your Lee TL bullets being softer will seal much easier. You didn't mention if you sized or not. The TL bullets are designed to be shot as cast. I size mine .454". Zero leading.
__________________________________________________________ Better to remain silent and be thought a fool,(coma'ed) than speak and remove all doubt.
Posts: 1092 | Location: Wyldoming | Registered: January 01, 2004
XR650's picture illustrates what my first P220 did with SWCs. What happens is that as the barrel cams down, the rim of the empty hangs below the breechface and as the extractor pulls it back it strikes the shoulder of the bullet and mouth of the case of the next round in the magazine. The gun ran fine on roundnose or truncated cone bullets. I sold it because it would not shoot the ammo I loaded for my 1911. I don't ask my present P220 to make the attempt.
Posts: 1542 | Location: Florence, Alabama, USA | Registered: July 05, 2001
mnzrxer: The commercial cast bullets are harder and probably sized .452" Your Lee TL bullets being softer will seal much easier. You didn't mention if you sized or not. The TL bullets are designed to be shot as cast. I size mine .454". Zero leading.
True the commercial bullets are harder and measured .452". The ones I cast also measured .452" (although not perfectly round) and after pushing a couple through my Lee sizer I decided it wasn't worth the time since they didn't really change dimensions. It may help with the mess to run the bullets through the sizer and scrape the tumble lube off the ridges on the bullet though.
mnzrxer mentioned a couple of points that few casters/lead bullet shooters seem to be aware of......the bullet must be soft enough to OBTURATE at the base, thereby sealing the bore. And GAS CUTTING is the culprit with most leading NOT shooting a too soft slug.
It's surprising just how SOFT a slug You can shoot if it's properly sized to the pistol and have zero leading problems. Read the old Elmer Keith articles regarding cast bullets and he used a relatively soft alloy for all of his shooting.
Since the 45 ACP is a pretty low pressure round (as is the 45 Colt I also load for) I am planning on doing some experiments with bullet hardness. As I mentioned earlier the boolits I am casting now from wheel weights are around 14 BHN. I want to try to go softer and see what happens. I would like to get to the point where leading isn't an issue and I can cut back on the amount of lube I have been applying to the projectiles. Even with the 14 BHN bullets I get some lead in the first 1/4" of the barrel.
Any recommendations for the softest alloy for the 45's?
I use straight WW, about 12BHN. They will need to be at least .452" & maybe .454" w/ a all lube grooves filled. A good, soft bullet lube is your friend.
IF YOU AREN'T HANDLOADING, YOU AREN'T SHOOTING ENOUGH! If you could make your own gas, wouldn't you???
Posts: 1284 | Location: ca, usa | Registered: February 17, 2004
xr650, would you have a solution to that extraction problem? I have the same problem but it does not happen often. I'm wondering if it could be related to how a particular magazine presents the next round? Maybe the loaded cartidge is higher or too high in some instances as to cause the interference being that it happens only some of the time...
The more I think about it, the more I believe it is a problem related to my extractor. When I get a ejecton failure like the pic, I find that the rim is knicked like the extractor slipped and find that some rounds that ejected also have the knicked rim. Also noticed that my shells no longer are landing in a group. Some eject Lf and some even land on my head like a weak ejection... Any thoughts or comments?
I just got into casting myself. I cast using a .45 Lyman Devastator hollowpoint mold. My alloy consists of 50/50 wheelweights to range lead with enough tin for good fill out. I have not had to size these from this mold as they shoot just fine with no leading whatsoever. Casting is alot of fun when everything goes right.
Fast is fine, but accuracy is final!
Posts: 139 | Location: Knoxville | Registered: July 26, 2005
Originally posted by schags: Anyone try the Lee 200gr round nose flat point? Whats the going amount of bullets most of you can cast with the six cavity mold?
I bought that mold for 45colt use but they shoot fine in my 1911s & XD. A 6cav mold w/ a 20# bottom pour pot yields you about 600 bullets an hour at a steady rate.
IF YOU AREN'T HANDLOADING, YOU AREN'T SHOOTING ENOUGH! If you could make your own gas, wouldn't you???
Posts: 1284 | Location: ca, usa | Registered: February 17, 2004
