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Picture of onpointgun
posted
Ok I am new to this game. I reloaded shotgun shells in the past but never rifle rounds. I have ordered a Lee Kit but its not here yet. I am heading out this weekend to buy some supplies. Once everything comes in a friend that has reloaded for years is going to come over and walk me through the setup and get me going. Here are a few questions I am doing this mainly for .308 that will be fired in a GAP-10. I am wanting to get the best accuracy I can. What are some of your favorite powders, bullets, primers or anything else I am missing.


I will be swift in my attack. My venom is packed with enough pride and gun powder to take down
any adversary that attempts to tread on my freedom. You've been warned, but if you
still want to test me, take a step forward.
 
Posts: 1670 | Location: ON THE YELLOW BRICK ROAD | Registered: February 11, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of fredj338
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First step for accuracy in any rifle is a good bullet. IMO, that is a match bullet in suitable weight for your barrel twist. Lots of good powder choices in 308. Many swear by Varget, but I always got so-so accuracy with it, but a good place to start, lots of data. Another is IMR4895. You will never get top vel but good accuracy. For a bolt gun I would neck size, but for a semi, you are pretty much forced to FL size or maybe get by with partial FL sizing if using the brass from that rifle only. Having a mentor is a huge bonus if they know what they are doing.


IF YOU AREN'T HANDLOADING, YOU AREN'T SHOOTING ENOUGH!
NRA Instruc: Basic Pistol & Met Reloading
 
Posts: 7620 | Location: ca, usa | Registered: February 17, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by onpointgun:
Ok I am new to this game. I reloaded shotgun shells in the past but never rifle rounds. I have ordered a Lee Kit


That's where I stopped reading and walked away.
 
Posts: 2529 | Location: Texas | Registered: June 20, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of Blue68f100
posted Hide Post
Go with Match grades bullets for best accuracy. I would buy a minimum of 200 to start off with. It always take more than what you think you need to find and tune your load. You did not say at what range you will be shooting at. IMR4064 is the one of the best powders for the 308W. Depending on your load you will only get around 125 rounds/lb.

You also need some good optics to correct the parallax out, helps too.


David

P229R 9mm, Nitron, Beavertail Frame, Night Sights, DA/SA, SRT & Short Reach Trigger
 
Posts: 3397 | Location: Piney Woods of East Texas | Registered: November 08, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Knows too little
about too much
Picture of rduckwor
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by NikonUser:
quote:
Originally posted by onpointgun:
Ok I am new to this game. I reloaded shotgun shells in the past but never rifle rounds. I have ordered a Lee Kit


That's where I stopped reading and walked away.


OMG! It's a 308 and he didn't say he was going benchresting. Everyone starts somewhere. Razz

OP, it's hard to tell you what dies, brass, bullets, and powder to buy as so much depends upon your rifle and what it LIKES.

Lots of folks poopoo Lee products here, but for starting out , its hard to knock them. Get your feet wet with Lee and then move up the food chain.

RMD




Some men are morally opposed to violence; they are protected by men who are not.
 
Posts: 18216 | Location: L.A. - Lower Alabama | Registered: April 06, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Alea iacta est
Picture of exx1976
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by NikonUser:
quote:
Originally posted by onpointgun:
Ok I am new to this game. I reloaded shotgun shells in the past but never rifle rounds. I have ordered a Lee Kit


That's where I stopped reading and walked away.


You made it one more word in than I did.


rduckwor - I understand your shot at Nikon about "benchresting", but really - he has a GAP - and wants to make the most accurate ammo for it that he can.

One of these things is not like the other. "Let's buy a $5k rifle and a $100 reloading setup". There's a minimum level of quality that needs to be maintained if he expects high-quality reloads. You know this.

OP - I would strongly suggest that you do some more research prior to opening the box for that Lee kit, lest you decide to return it.

Start with this youtube channel for some good equipment reviews. Yes, many of them are not *necessary*, but there are some a couple reviews of presses and techniques that will give you some ideas. Also, how to measure OAL, etc.

Ignore the competition Primer Seater and the $800 scale. You don't need to go THAT far when you're just getting started.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l14kN55y5zs




Every time you make a typo, the errorists win.
 
Posts: 15652 | Location: Location, Location  | Registered: April 09, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by rduckwor:
quote:
Originally posted by NikonUser:
quote:
Originally posted by onpointgun:
Ok I am new to this game. I reloaded shotgun shells in the past but never rifle rounds. I have ordered a Lee Kit


That's where I stopped reading and walked away.


OMG! It's a 308 and he didn't say he was going benchresting. Everyone starts somewhere. Razz

OP, it's hard to tell you what dies, brass, bullets, and powder to buy as so much depends upon your rifle and what it LIKES.

Lots of folks poopoo Lee products here, but for starting out , its hard to knock them. Get your feet wet with Lee and then move up the food chain.

RMD

Exx1976 did a great job responding to you, but I wanted to take the time to answer as well.

I did read one more word than Ex1976, because I was hoping the word after Lee was going to be "autoprime," which would have been ok, but it was kit so I stopped.

As Exx1976 so eloquently said, and I'm paraphrasing here: "I pay big bucks for a super rifle and then feed it factory seconds in ammo or worse (in this case, it's worse.)" That just does not compute.

I'm not into benchresting and I shoot a .308 exclusively, so I don't know where you were going with that, but I have the very bestest tools and I use the finest components to extract the best precision out of my rifle; the accuracy is then up to me, and is not diminished by bad handloads.

You do make a good point about "for starting out," but I'm wondering if he's just "starting out" with a GAP-10. And I will say that Lee tools will make it far more difficult to assemble excellent ammo, especially for a beginner.

ETA I now know it's GAP-10 and .308 because responses had that information.

Does he have a scope on it, maybe an NCStar?
 
Posts: 2529 | Location: Texas | Registered: June 20, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Knows too little
about too much
Picture of rduckwor
posted Hide Post
HA! I get both of you, but a guy has to start somewhere, AND, he needs to learn to shoot the rifle. His Lee kit will get him ammunition likely better than he is capable of shooting at first and give him a leg up on the whole process. Besides, he bought a Gap rifle; he CAN'T AFFORD expensive loading stuff I'll bet!

Rather than have him dive head first into a confusing morass of bushing dies, concentricity, and run out, why not let the guy get his feet wet and see if reloading is really something he like to do when it comes to precision rifle.

After, all, it isn't like loading for pistol or shotgun.

I respect your opinions, but not everybody gets to solo in a 747.

RMD




Some men are morally opposed to violence; they are protected by men who are not.
 
Posts: 18216 | Location: L.A. - Lower Alabama | Registered: April 06, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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posted Hide Post
I totally get what you're saying. The OP asked for advice about reloading; and that's what I gave him.

Solo in a 747 is probably easier than in a Piper Cub; everything is automated. The Piper Cub on the other hand is totally manual and requires expertise.

Anyway, a good RCBS kit will not cost much more than the (gasp) Lee kit, and it will be far superior. He can get good dies to begin and then go from there. But why start with a crappy foundational piece like a Lee press? I used my RCBS press for 25 years, with topnotch Redding dies. I was making excellent ammo with that. I moved to a T-7 because it was more convenient but I don't think that's it made better ammo than the RCBS.
 
Posts: 2529 | Location: Texas | Registered: June 20, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by rduckwor:
HA! I get both of you, but a guy has to start somewhere, AND, he needs to learn to shoot the rifle. His Lee kit will get him ammunition likely better than he is capable of shooting at first and give him a leg up on the whole process. Besides, he bought a Gap rifle; he CAN'T AFFORD expensive loading stuff I'll bet!

Rather than have him dive head first into a confusing morass of bushing dies, concentricity, and run out, why not let the guy get his feet wet and see if reloading is really something he like to do when it comes to precision rifle.

After, all, it isn't like loading for pistol or shotgun.

I respect your opinions, but not everybody gets to solo in a 747.

RMD


Your spot on RMD!

At my local range yesterday. Guy shooting next to me with his semi custom 308 bolt rifle. Brand spanking new to shooting LR. Asked me about reloading, what's a good group....? I "read" about different reloading techniques. What about neck turning, sorting bullets....? All that CRAP! Good thing exx1976 or NikonUser wasn't there Big Grin I suggested he buy a few boxes of FGMM, see what that does in his rifle, get close to that with his handloads. Then take a class, shoot 2000 rds, learn to read the wind, then revisit your load..... He had horrible trigger control, spent some time with him on that. Not suggesting you're that guy onpointgun!
 
Posts: 2286 | Location: 9860 ft above sea level Colorado | Registered: December 31, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Alea iacta est
Picture of exx1976
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by offgrid:
quote:
Originally posted by rduckwor:
HA! I get both of you, but a guy has to start somewhere, AND, he needs to learn to shoot the rifle. His Lee kit will get him ammunition likely better than he is capable of shooting at first and give him a leg up on the whole process. Besides, he bought a Gap rifle; he CAN'T AFFORD expensive loading stuff I'll bet!

Rather than have him dive head first into a confusing morass of bushing dies, concentricity, and run out, why not let the guy get his feet wet and see if reloading is really something he like to do when it comes to precision rifle.

After, all, it isn't like loading for pistol or shotgun.

I respect your opinions, but not everybody gets to solo in a 747.

RMD


Your spot on RMD!

At my local range yesterday. Guy shooting next to me with his semi custom 308 bolt rifle. Brand spanking new to shooting LR. Asked me about reloading, what's a good group....? I "read" about different reloading techniques. What about neck turning, sorting bullets....? All that CRAP! Good thing exx1976 or NikonUser wasn't there Big Grin I suggested he buy a few boxes of FGMM, see what that does in his rifle, get close to that with his handloads. Then take a class, shoot 2000 rds, learn to read the wind, then revisit your load..... He had horrible trigger control, spent some time with him on that. Not suggesting you're that guy onpointgun!


Neck turning?! Bullet sorting?! Who's got time for all that crap? LOL

And I love how you're lecturing us, when I know you use Whidden dies. Big Grin With the exception of annealing, I'm pretty sure my reloading regimen is about the same as your's, offgrid. Wink


In any event - I agree with what you told the other shooter - go buy 2000 rounds of FGMM and spend lots of time behind the gun.


However, y'all are making some wild assumptions at OPs skill level. For all we know, he knows how to shoot, and recently came into money.

There's just altogether way too many assumptions in here.

The only things that are known for certain at this point are that he has a really nice rifle, and a reloading press that won't deliver ammo better than he can buy off the shelf (and may or may not even produce at that level).




Every time you make a typo, the errorists win.
 
Posts: 15652 | Location: Location, Location  | Registered: April 09, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Hmmm, can't make decent ammo on Lee press. Friend has a Lee press. Load on his press, do nothing to the brass as I do now, load primers with my Lee handheld, beam scale..... If Lee makes Dasher dies, someone willing to send me a set, glad to use those. A couple friends have CO-AX presses, digital scales, Redding Comp seater/FL dies, annealers...... Load 10 on each setup, have a friend hand me a loaded mag not knowing. Shoot them at 500yds, see what we see. One thing I'm not clear about though. I see mention suppose to just seat the bullet half way, spin the case 180 then finish seating. I have a right twist barrel, do I spin the case clockwise or counter clockwise. Guessing it's important to get that right. And if I had a left twist barrel, the reverse Big Grin

Oh, went to the somewhat "smallbase" Whidden dies for my Dasher and 6.5x47 because Forster FL sizers weren't sizing the body enough after a few firings. Too many variables in reamers.

Sorry about the drift OP. Just having some fun on a Friday afternoon.
 
Posts: 2286 | Location: 9860 ft above sea level Colorado | Registered: December 31, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Imagine how much better your ammo would be if you used proper tools. You're leaving points on the loading table.
 
Posts: 2529 | Location: Texas | Registered: June 20, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
The Persian
Picture of PPGMD
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by NikonUser:
Solo in a 747 is probably easier than in a Piper Cub; everything is automated. The Piper Cub on the other hand is totally manual and requires expertise.


As someone that has been through flight tests with FAA examiners the first thing the DE would say "Your flight director is inoperative."


-------
A turbo: Exhaust gasses go into the turbocharger and spin it, witchcraft happens, and you go faster.

Mr. Doom and Gloom
"King in the north!"
"Slow is smooth... and also slow.
 
Posts: 20052 | Location: At the wall | Registered: February 13, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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posted Hide Post
I am despondent. It took SIX hours for someone to challenge that canard. What is WRONG with you people?
 
Posts: 2529 | Location: Texas | Registered: June 20, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of onpointgun
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by rduckwor:
quote:
Originally posted by NikonUser:
quote:
Originally posted by onpointgun:
Ok I am new to this game. I reloaded shotgun shells in the past but never rifle rounds. I have ordered a Lee Kit


That's where I stopped reading and walked away.


OMG! It's a 308 and he didn't say he was going benchresting. Everyone starts somewhere. Razz

OP, it's hard to tell you what dies, brass, bullets, and powder to buy as so much depends upon your rifle and what it LIKES.

Lots of folks poopoo Lee products here, but for starting out , its hard to knock them. Get your feet wet with Lee and then move up the food chain.

RMD


I honestly started with Lee because I am not sure I will continue trying to reload. If its something that I like and get into I will upgrade one piece at a time.


I will be swift in my attack. My venom is packed with enough pride and gun powder to take down
any adversary that attempts to tread on my freedom. You've been warned, but if you
still want to test me, take a step forward.
 
Posts: 1670 | Location: ON THE YELLOW BRICK ROAD | Registered: February 11, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of onpointgun
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by NikonUser:
quote:
Originally posted by rduckwor:
quote:
Originally posted by NikonUser:
quote:
Originally posted by onpointgun:
Ok I am new to this game. I reloaded shotgun shells in the past but never rifle rounds. I have ordered a Lee Kit


That's where I stopped reading and walked away.


OMG! It's a 308 and he didn't say he was going benchresting. Everyone starts somewhere. Razz

OP, it's hard to tell you what dies, brass, bullets, and powder to buy as so much depends upon your rifle and what it LIKES.

Lots of folks poopoo Lee products here, but for starting out , its hard to knock them. Get your feet wet with Lee and then move up the food chain.

RMD

Exx1976 did a great job responding to you, but I wanted to take the time to answer as well.

I did read one more word than Ex1976, because I was hoping the word after Lee was going to be "autoprime," which would have been ok, but it was kit so I stopped.

As Exx1976 so eloquently said, and I'm paraphrasing here: "I pay big bucks for a super rifle and then feed it factory seconds in ammo or worse (in this case, it's worse.)" That just does not compute.

I'm not into benchresting and I shoot a .308 exclusively, so I don't know where you were going with that, but I have the very bestest tools and I use the finest components to extract the best precision out of my rifle; the accuracy is then up to me, and is not diminished by bad handloads.

You do make a good point about "for starting out," but I'm wondering if he's just "starting out" with a GAP-10. And I will say that Lee tools will make it far more difficult to assemble excellent ammo, especially for a beginner.

ETA I now know it's GAP-10 and .308 because responses had that information.

Does he have a scope on it, maybe an NCStar?


I bought a Bushnell Elite DMR.


I will be swift in my attack. My venom is packed with enough pride and gun powder to take down
any adversary that attempts to tread on my freedom. You've been warned, but if you
still want to test me, take a step forward.
 
Posts: 1670 | Location: ON THE YELLOW BRICK ROAD | Registered: February 11, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
The Persian
Picture of PPGMD
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by NikonUser:
I am despondent. It took SIX hours for someone to challenge that canard. What is WRONG with you people?


It has been a busy day for me, in addition to all my normal stuff I had to replace the motor in my bulletfeeder.

onpointgun,

I have a Lee Challenger that I use for decapping. I like it because it is one of the few single stage presses that features spent primer chute. So I just put my spent brass bucket under the tube, and decap away.

But TBH I just use it to decap cases with live primers and other cases that are giving me trouble. As I don't want to run the cases with live primers through my Dillon.


-------
A turbo: Exhaust gasses go into the turbocharger and spin it, witchcraft happens, and you go faster.

Mr. Doom and Gloom
"King in the north!"
"Slow is smooth... and also slow.
 
Posts: 20052 | Location: At the wall | Registered: February 13, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by onpointgun:
I bought a Bushnell Elite DMR.

That's it. I'm done with this thread.
 
Posts: 2529 | Location: Texas | Registered: June 20, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Alea iacta est
Picture of exx1976
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by NikonUser:
quote:
Originally posted by onpointgun:
I bought a Bushnell Elite DMR.

That's it. I'm done with this thread.


Hey hey hey now. Sure, you'll never find one of those on one of my rifles - but that doesn't mean it's not a good choice for the type of shooting op wants to do. The GAP PRS team is sponsored by Bushnell, so of course you find Bushnell on top of all their rifles. Optics are a personal choice, and he doesn't need a 15-55x competition scope if he's trying to shoot PRS-style matches (which he hasn't even told us.

OP - don't mind Nikon. He's our resident F-class snob. He can certainly be a wealth of information on both reloading and glass, but you've got to be able to see past his frequent scorn. Big Grin It's also worth noting that I can be guilty of the same thing, though I like to think I have good info to provide, if not a wealth. Wink




Every time you make a typo, the errorists win.
 
Posts: 15652 | Location: Location, Location  | Registered: April 09, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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