quote:

Originally posted by LegacyVetsMC Bob:

quote:

Originally posted by LittleGun:
I had my CHL class today and it was an education in Texas gun law. One interesting fact is that Texas CHL holders are not allowed to touch alcoholic drinks while carrying. It doesn't matter how much or how little the amount, drinking any amount of alcohol is an offense that means jail time and suspended license.

When did the law change? It used to be legal to carry unless you were "intoxicated".

Legacy you are correct.
Little, I am sorry, but you were misinformed.

The law states that if you are intoxicated, you may not carry although the statute does not define intoxicated, so it is basically at the officers discrestion at point of arrest.

I haven't researched any case law, but I would imagine that a judge would probably apply the same 0.8 here in TX, but they could just as easily say that you were intoxicated after one sip since it is not defined.

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

I see no problem with a 200 lb man consuming 2 glass of wine over a long dinner, or two beers over a bunch of tacos. I would guess that the BAC would be undetectable before leaving the dining establishment.

Well I put it to test. I drank 1 beer and 1 glass of wine with a light dinner, and 3 hours later was on a ride along with a buddy of mine. We used their expensive tester from his truck...and I came up with a .000

I'm 6' 210 lbs.

We've decided that we're going to plan a night sometime in the next month or two.....and do some experimenting to see just where our limits are according to the alcohol tester.

quote:

Originally posted by LegacyVetsMC Bob:

quote:

Originally posted by LittleGun:
I had my CHL class today and it was an education in Texas gun law. One interesting fact is that Texas CHL holders are not allowed to touch alcoholic drinks while carrying. It doesn't matter how much or how little the amount, drinking any amount of alcohol is an offense that means jail time and suspended license.

When did the law change? It used to be legal to carry unless you were "intoxicated".

Intoxicated is at the discretion of the officer. If so inclined, he can consider you intoxicated if he smells alcohol on your breath.

I think the 0% law is with drinking, not buying. Sorry for the misinformation. I think the 0% thing sets a higher standard of conduct for CHL holders.

A recent news story about a NYPD officer (off-duty and who had consumed a few drinks) who shot some mugger tells me the NYPD needs to revisit its policy about its off-duty officers drinking while carrying a gun.

Gents,

Whether by personal preference or departmental policy it's a bad idea to consume alcohol while carrying. If for no other reason than it leaves one more thing that can be questioned in a self-defense shooting or lawsuit.
To me it just makes good sense not to drink and carry.

Wes

quote:

Originally posted by LittleGun:
I had my CHL class today and it was an education in Texas gun law. One interesting fact is that Texas CHL holders are not allowed to touch alcoholic drinks while carrying. It doesn't matter how much or how little the amount, drinking any amount of alcohol is an offense that means jail time and suspended license.

Seems like a good rule to me.

quote:

Originally posted by Weshowe:
Gents,

Whether by personal preference or departmental policy it's a bad idea to consume alcohol while carrying. If for no other reason than it leaves one more thing that can be questioned in a self-defense shooting or lawsuit.
To me it just makes good sense not to drink and carry.

Wes

Let's hope that none of the ccw permit holders get a cold and need to take a dose of cough syrup.

Zero tolerance = zero intelligence

quote:

Originally posted by modiecast:

quote:

Originally posted by LittleGun:
I had my CHL class today and it was an education in Texas gun law. One interesting fact is that Texas CHL holders are not allowed to touch alcoholic drinks while carrying. It doesn't matter how much or how little the amount, drinking any amount of alcohol is an offense that means jail time and suspended license.

Seems like a good rule to me.

Now if you could get the bad guys to comply too then all is well in La-La Land.

quote:

Originally posted by SgtGold:
In CT the law states it's illegal to carry while intoxicated. I think they use the DUI standard for enforcement.

Believe it or not, I think it is .1 for carrying and .08 for DUI.

quote:

Originally posted by AKSuperDually:
Well I put it to test. I drank 1 beer and 1 glass of wine with a light dinner, and 3 hours later was on a ride along with a buddy of mine. We used their expensive tester from his truck...and I came up with a .000

I'm 6' 210 lbs.

We've decided that we're going to plan a night sometime in the next month or two.....and do some experimenting to see just where our limits are according to the alcohol tester.

I commend you on taking on this task.
You are an honorable man willing to subject himself to such rigors in the name of research.
You are a hero.

quote:

Originally posted by joshrunkle35:
CCW or not, in Ohio you cannot have any alcohol while having a loaded firearm in your possession.

THAT IS CORRECT! I stand corrected I thought it had been corrected but I was wrong. You cannot be under the influence of alcohol and in possession of a firearm. The problem is that Ohio does not define what 'under the influence of alcohol' is!

A little know fact in Ohio is that you can be arrested for possession of a loaded firearm under the influence, or DUI if you have any amount of alcohol in your system.

Let me give you an example..

4511.19 Operating vehicle under the influence of alcohol or drugs - OVI.

(A)(1) No person shall operate any vehicle, streetcar, or trackless trolley within this state, if, at the time of the operation, ANY of the following apply:

(a) The person is under the influence of alcohol, a drug of abuse, or a combination of them.

(b) The person has a concentration of eight-hundredths of one per cent or more but less than seventeen-hundredths of one per cent by weight per unit volume of alcohol in the person’s whole blood.

(c) The person has a concentration of ninety-six-thousandths of one per cent or more but less than two hundred four-thousandths of one per cent by weight per unit volume of alcohol in the person’s blood serum or plasma.

(d) The person has a concentration of eight-hundredths of one gram or more but less than seventeen-hundredths of one gram by weight of alcohol per two hundred ten liters of the person’s breath.

(e) The person has a concentration of eleven-hundredths of one gram or more but less than two hundred thirty-eight-thousandths of one gram by weight of alcohol per one hundred milliliters of the person’s urine.

(f) The person has a concentration of seventeen-hundredths of one per cent or more by weight per unit volume of alcohol in the person’s whole blood.

(g) The person has a concentration of two hundred four-thousandths of one per cent or more by weight per unit volume of alcohol in the person’s blood serum or plasma.

(h) The person has a concentration of seventeen-hundredths of one gram or more by weight of alcohol per two hundred ten liters of the person’s breath.

(i) The person has a concentration of two hundred thirty-eight-thousandths of one gram or more by weight of alcohol per one hundred milliliters of the person’s urine.

So you can be 'under the influence of alcohol' (a) but not violate (b) through (i) and the .08 everyone assumes is the legal limit and still be arrested and convicted!

Many people in Ohio have been convicted of DUI and have blown UNDER .08! So in theory if you consume any alcohol in Ohio and you are in possession of a firearm even in your house and a police officer determines you are 'under the influence of alcohol' you can be arrested. And their is no mandate to be tested if it's not a DUI.

The same goes for disorderly conduct.. If a police officers smells an alcoholic beverage on your breath and MAGICALLY determines you are 'under the influence of alcohol' you can be arrested because...

OHIO DOES NOT DEFINE UNDER THE INFLUENCE IS!

Welcome to the Ohio catch all law... I lived in the free state of Nevada too long and assumed Ohio had fixed that issue.

quote:

Originally posted by AKSuperDually:
Well I put it to test. I drank 1 beer and 1 glass of wine with a light dinner, and 3 hours later was on a ride along with a buddy of mine. We used their expensive tester from his truck...and I came up with a .000

I'm 6' 210 lbs.

We've decided that we're going to plan a night sometime in the next month or two.....and do some experimenting to see just where our limits are according to the alcohol tester.

I have always heard that a normal guy metabolizes about one "drink" (12oz beer, 3oz glass of wine, 1oz shot) per hour, so it makes sense you'd be at .000.

The Ohio Revised Code is pretty impenetrable on this, but the gist is:
Don't drink and drive
Don't drink and carry a gun
Don't go someplace that serves alcohol and carry a gun.
You will be hung out to dry in any Muni Court in the state for any of those, and say goodbye to your CCW

A good lawyer and about 12 bazillion dollars could get these laws off the books.
I can carry a firearm.but am guilty of a crime if i am under the influence??
When one thinks about the constitution .This is being guilty until proven innocent.Again it is different operating a vehicle. That is a given.
Having a gun in your possession is no different than having a baseball bat in your possession.
If i am under the influence and commit a crime
Then i should be arrested.
But this law assumes I am going to commit a crime because i have a firearm in my possession
.. Perposterous

quote:

Originally posted by smschulz:

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Originally posted by SigM4:

quote:

Originally posted by LittleGun:
Another rule we have in Texas is the 51% rule. If a business makes 51% or more from sales of alcoholic beverages, we can carry in that business. However, a 51% sign must be posted. If a sign is not posted, it is not an offense - just bad manners and warrants a verbal reprimand. If a 51% sign is posted, it means jail time.

Sorry to burst your bubble LittleGun, but unless the law has just recently changed, you can still be arrested for having a concealed handgun in a 51% establishment even if its not posted. The law states that the establishment must post the 51% sign, but is up to the CHL holder to know whether or not it qualifies as an establishment under the 51% law.

Kind of messed up that we should know these things even if the establishment isn't posted, but then again its usually pretty easy to figure it out.

I would like to see documentation that this a law. Sure, anyone can be arrested for any reason anywhere any time.

Here you go:

quote:

Sec. 46.035. UNLAWFUL CARRYING OF HANDGUN BY LICENSE HOLDER.

...

(b) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries a handgun under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code, regardless of whether the handgun is concealed, on or about the license holder's person:
(1) on the premises of a business that has a permit or license issued under Chapter 25, 28, 32, 69, or 74, Alcoholic Beverage Code, if the business derives 51 percent or more of its income from the sale or service of alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption, as determined by the Texas Alcoholic Beverage Commission under Section 104.06, Alcoholic Beverage Code;

...

There's an exception for historical reenactments sanctioned by the TABC.

Those of you who got wrong information from your CHL insructors, please do their future students a favor and call and tell them.

It's my personal opinion that anyone who drinks alcohol and carries a firearm is behaving irresponsible and unsafe. Being even slightly impaired could have very detrimental legal ramifications if involved in a shooting. It's a risk I wouldn't want to test.

http://www.ou.edu/oupd/bac.htm

quote:

Originally posted by Ship A'Hoy:
Being even slightly impaired could have very detrimental legal ramifications if involved in a shooting.

That's the point... For many people (a 200lb. male) a serving of alcohol, with dinner, does not even slightly impair them.

quote:

Originally posted by Ship A'Hoy:
It's my personal opinion that anyone who drinks alcohol and carries a firearm is behaving irresponsible and unsafe.

If you drink a single beer with your steak dinner, at your home, do you lock all of your firearms in your safe until morning?

If not, then your statement is hypocritical. And you are self admittedly "behaving irresponsible and unsafe".

If you should be afforded the right to protect yourself in your own home, after consuming an scientifically insignificant amount of alcohol; then why knock someone that would do the same thing at a family restaurant?


I do not think that anyone should ever carry while they are impaired. Someone that would carry in that state would be acting irresponsibly.
But you can consume adult beverages in a responsible manner, without impairment.

quote:

Originally posted by American Pit Bull:

quote:

Originally posted by Ship A'Hoy:
Being even slightly impaired could have very detrimental legal ramifications if involved in a shooting.

That's the point... For many people (a 200lb. male) a serving of alcohol, with dinner, does not even slightly impair them.

quote:

Originally posted by Ship A'Hoy:
It's my personal opinion that anyone who drinks alcohol and carries a firearm is behaving irresponsible and unsafe.

If you drink a single beer with your steak dinner, at your home, do you lock all of your firearms in your safe until morning?

If not, then your statement is hypocritical. And you are self admittedly "behaving irresponsible and unsafe".

If you should be afforded the right to protect yourself in your own home, after consuming an scientifically insignificant amount of alcohol; then why knock someone that would do the same thing at a family restaurant?


I do not think that anyone should ever carry while they are impaired. Someone that would carry in that state would be acting irresponsibly.
But you can consume adult beverages in a responsible manner, without impairment.

Before you start with the personal attacks and name calling, you should know I don't drink and haven't for many years. So stick to the topic and please don't try to discredit my argument with your incorrect hypothesis.

Impairment begins with the first drink and in a civil court one would be taking a big gamble. It's not black and white, lawyers would argue both sides of having even one drink and then shooting someone for self defense.

But hey I'm not trying to sway your decision either way. Drink all you want and carry.

Did you have a gun on your person while drinking an alcoholic Beverage? Pretty much all the prosecutor needs to say in Ohio if you answer yes.. Good enough for me. I will lock you up for it.