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posted
All,

This may be a dumb question, so be kind.

I am setting up a new AR that will be my new "go to rifle" (16" mid-length).

I am a right handed shooter and I use the "C" clamp style hold with my left hand (support hand).

In the past, I was told to put the sling on the stock or end-plate (if you have an end-plate that will accept QD mounts) and the front of the sling as far forward as possible.

I have always had issue with slings mounted this way getting in the way of my support hand, activation of my light and other issues (slowing down transitions from side to side and how quickly I could get the rifle up and on target from a "slung and hung" position... things like that).

Would it be incorrect to have the forward mounting point behind my left hand? Are there any drawbacks?

Don't want to start a pissing match... just curious what the modern perspective is as to which is "correct".

Thanks...


The "Boz"
 
Posts: 1151 | Location: Central Ohio, USA | Registered: May 29, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Bolt Thrower
Picture of Voshterkoff
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I like to mount the rear to the opposite side of the butt stock from me, and the front to be a bit behind my support hand, same side as I. Like you I have enough clutter at the front of my rifle without a sling adding to the mix. This reduces the ability to get really good support from the sling, but I will take a light over “proper” sling use any day.
 
Posts: 8876 | Location: Woodinville, WA | Registered: March 30, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Freethinker
Picture of sigfreund
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Hmm ….
I have the same slings on my training AR and on my identical “serious” carbine. The serious weapon has a light mounted at the front of the handguard and therefore the front of the sling is at the rear. The training gun has no light and the sling is attached at the front of the handguard. I guess that the latter has never bothered me because all my transitions are from carbine to handgun; hadn’t thought about the sling being in the way if going the other way. But if slipping my support hand under the sling isn’t convenient, I just C clamp over the sling.

I can’t think of a problem with attaching the front of the sling at the rear of the handguard, and haven’t noticed any issues when using that mounting point. The only thing is that it might reduce the overall length of the sling and thereby interfere with switching shoulders, or something similar. I use Magpul slings that can be lengthened easily, though, and don’t have any experience with that.

As for the rear of the sling, I have become a firm fan of attaching it to the rear of the stock on the right side (I’m right-handed). I run the sling around the butt and to a QD socket near the right rear. That pulls the stock closer to my body and keeps the gun from moving as much when it’s hanging, but doesn’t interfere with normal use.




“The most common reaction to a life-or-death situation is to do nothing.”
— Amanda Ripley, The Unthinkable: who survives when disaster strikes and why (New York: Three Rivers Press, 2008)
 
Posts: 42842 | Location: 10,150 Feet Above Sea Level in Colorado | Registered: April 04, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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In the end to me it really depends on what exactly you are trying to do with a sling and what else is on the rifle. There is no correct. For me (in a rural area) the main point of the sling is to carry the rifle while having use of both of my hands for dogs, horse riding, livestock or whatever. That really demands that you have the front forward and the rear aft (versus on a qd mount on the receiver or a QD endplate or the front shortened). I have never had an issue with the front being in the 'way'. I run the light on the right and the switch on the top. But to reiterate, get something that works for you.


“So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.”
 
Posts: 9116 | Registered: October 14, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Fighting the good fight
Picture of RogueJSK
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My ARs have the front sling attachment about 1/2 to 2/3 of the way down the handguard. This puts it behind my support hand.
 
Posts: 26264 | Location: Northwest Arkansas | Registered: January 06, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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All...

Thanks.

The rifle is set-up in the following manner:

  • 16" Mid-Length Barrell
  • 13" Geissele MK14 M-LOK rail (integrated QD mount at the rear of the rail... close to the upper receiver)
  • Surefire M600 Light on the left (non-dominant hand) side of the gun at the very front of the rail with an Arisaka Offset Scout Mount (no desire to run a tape switch, using the push button tailcap).
  • BCM Gunfighter KAG Angled Grip on the bottom of the rail near dead center of the length of the rail (used as a hand stop/position reference)
  • Arisaka QD mount on the left side of the rail, 1/2 M-Lok slot behind the position of the KAG grip
  • Aimpoint T-2 stradling the receiver/handguard transition with an ADM 1/3 co-witness mount
  • Magpul M-Bus Pro sights all the way forward/rear on the pic rail on top of the rail and receiver will allow
  • BCM QD receiver end plate
  • Magpul CTR stock with integrated QD mounts
  • Blue Force Gear padded sling

If the sling mount is all the way forward on the rail (behind the M600), it is difficult to activate the M600 tailcap while maintaining the solid grip I want on the gun (because of the sling). With it slightly behind my support hand, I have none of these issues with the light and my grip. Also, it makes it much easier/quicker to pick up the rifle from the "hung and slung" position. The only drawback I can see at this time is it is a fraction more difficult to "swim" out of the sling, but I can still easily do it.

Per your recommendations, I have moved my rear mounting location from the QD end plate to the right side of the CTR stock. This eliminates much of the "swim out" issue.

The sling, for me, is for weapon retention and to allow me to hang the gun to do light to moderate tasks. If I plan on doing something strenuous, I will sling the rifle over my back (muzzle up) and cinch-up on the sling (or put the rifle down). The rifle will only be used for some of my training and for defensive uses.

I just wanted to make sure I was not committing some offense against the "modern theory on sling positioning". I do not care what other people may think of my rifle setup, but none of us want to be that guy in a class that has a different setup than everyone else... especially if you have a bobble with the gun and they (the instructors) point to your setup as the reason.

I think all of my rifles and SBR's may be switched over to this setup.

Thanks for the validation. Like I said, some instructor, some time back, told me this is the way slings need to be setup (sling mount forward). He was right about everything else he was teaching me, so I figured he was right about this too.


The "Boz"
 
Posts: 1151 | Location: Central Ohio, USA | Registered: May 29, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Bolt Thrower
Picture of Voshterkoff
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Sling mount all the way forward allows you to wrap your arm in it, simulating a proper shooting sling for offhand support. But lights and IR lasers are more important.
 
Posts: 8876 | Location: Woodinville, WA | Registered: March 30, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Freethinker
Picture of sigfreund
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quote:
Originally posted by Voshterkoff:
Sling mount all the way forward allows you to wrap your arm in it, simulating a proper shooting sling for offhand support.


Yes, the attachment point does affect whether it’s possible to use the “hasty sling” support, but it would be interesting to know how many carbine shooters have even heard of the concept, much less been trained and have practiced it. In my 18+ years as firearms instructor for my and a neighboring agency, I know of one man who used it—not very well it always seemed, but he did use it.

And also yes, for some people and situations weapon mounted lights are absolutely necessary.




“The most common reaction to a life-or-death situation is to do nothing.”
— Amanda Ripley, The Unthinkable: who survives when disaster strikes and why (New York: Three Rivers Press, 2008)
 
Posts: 42842 | Location: 10,150 Feet Above Sea Level in Colorado | Registered: April 04, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Fighting the good fight
Picture of RogueJSK
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With a quick-adjustable 2 point sling like a VCAS, you can get similar added stability just from using the adjustment slider to add tension between the sling and your body. No need to wrap your arm in the sling to create tension.

Not quite as rapid as the traditional "hasty sling", but still helpful, and workable even with the front sling attachment positioned further back behind the support hand.
 
Posts: 26264 | Location: Northwest Arkansas | Registered: January 06, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Thanks all for the great comments...

As I have stated in some of my other recent postings (specifically about zero distance on a red dot), for an unmagnified red dot, I am lucky to be able to accurately identify a target if it is much past 350 to 400 yards. Beyond that distance, I would be shooting at shapes and colors.

Within the 350-400 yard range, I should have time to prone out and make some type of impromptu rest for my handguard (I will not be running even a light bipod on this rifle). So the sling being used in that manner is not really too much of a concern for me at this time.

You have all been a great help...


The "Boz"
 
Posts: 1151 | Location: Central Ohio, USA | Registered: May 29, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Music's over turn
out the lights
Picture of David W
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I run all mine right side on stock and a few in front of support hand and a few behind. I find reloads faster with it far forward.

I just saw a quick video with Mike Pannone talking about slings. I hope this link works.

He runs his slings opposite on stock and far forward on rail. Being farthest to front doesn't snag/get in the way of his support hand once he comes off bolt, his hand doesn't have to go around the sling but rather slide all the way down back to his regular grip.

https://www.instagram.com/tv/C...igshid=1ftz4ccpp7b8s


David W.

Rather fail with honor than succeed by fraud. -Sophocles
 
Posts: 3446 | Location: Winston Salem, N.C. | Registered: May 30, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Interesting... But he has an odd setup with his front sight set back, his light mounted in front of it and the sling forward of all of that.

Also, his reasoning was sound I guess (catching a thumb on the sling or having to dip around it), but nothing to do with the functionality of the sling to support a firing position.

Yeah... I don't think he provides enough there for me to want to change back right now. I am not a high speed guy and should be able to handle the sling in the rear position without the interference the forward position has caused me in the past.

Thanks for the link though... Always good to hear other points of view.


The "Boz"
 
Posts: 1151 | Location: Central Ohio, USA | Registered: May 29, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Freethinker
Picture of sigfreund
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quote:
Originally posted by David W:
I just saw a quick video with Mike Pannone talking about slings. I hope this link works.


A good video that shows attaching the rear of the sling on the same side as one's dominant hand and the reason why. I tried without success to find a video that showed that, so thanks.




“The most common reaction to a life-or-death situation is to do nothing.”
— Amanda Ripley, The Unthinkable: who survives when disaster strikes and why (New York: Three Rivers Press, 2008)
 
Posts: 42842 | Location: 10,150 Feet Above Sea Level in Colorado | Registered: April 04, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
semi-reformed sailor
Picture of MikeinNC
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I use my sling in prone for accuracy like I was taught in the service. When I carried a carbine as a cop, I used the sling the same way, for hasty sling while standing or kneeling. I oriented my light at the end of the free float tube at 9:00 and it could be operated by my left hand as I was supporting the carbine. So the sling swivel was set back from the end of the tube about an inch or so. Rear point was on the butt stock.

I tried a single point but got smacked in the family jewels climbing a fenc one night and quickly went back to the standard two point military sling.

The sling serves as a way to carry the weapon while walking or as a way to improve accuracy by using it to tighten up he weapon in different positions.



"Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor.”
― Robert A. Heinlein, Starship Troopers

 
Posts: 7766 | Location: Temple, Texas! | Registered: October 07, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
fugitive from reality
Picture of SgtGold
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The front sight on an AR is set back from the muzzle and it looks like his front BUIS is right about where the front sight tower would normally be. Also, it appears the way he holds the rifle he can opertate the light and pop up the front sight with out moving his his hand off the rifle. Bottom line is that rifle is set up to suit how he wants to run it.

I have my slings set up in similar style because I found the further apart the sling attachments are, the closer the rifle sits to my body and the less chance I have of catching the muzzle on something once it's slung. I used to run the front mount just in front of the receiver, but besides having the rifle flop around when slung I caught the sling several times while reloading. It's a trial and error thing and you have to go with what works for you.

quote:
Originally posted by bozman:
Interesting... But he has an odd setup with his front sight set back, his light mounted in front of it and the sling forward of all of that.


_____________________________
'I'm pretty fly for a white guy'.

 
Posts: 6752 | Location: Newyorkistan | Registered: March 28, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Sigforum K9 handler
Picture of jljones
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My rifles are set up for close quarters.

I use the BFG padded. I place the front attachment on the rear of the rail and the back on a B5 type endplate. This allows me to transition the rifle to where it is tucked under my support arm. I have a bungee on my belt that allows me to secure the rifle in place if I need to climb, or go hands on, or whatever. Being able to tuck the rifle away also allows me to put both hands on a pistol without the rifle ever getting in the way.

Even without a bungee, the rifle stays in place most of the time with the transition we teach.




www.opspectraining.com

"It's a bold strategy, Cotton. Let's see if it works out for them"



 
Posts: 34620 | Location: Logical | Registered: September 12, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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All...

Thanks. I have moved the rear attachment point from a QD end plate and have put it on the right side of the CTR stock (using the integrated QD mounting point). I am going to try it there for a little while.

As Jones said, the end plate attachment location does allow for the rifle to be used off hand much more quickly (transitioning from shoulder to shoulder).

I have run a couple of reload drills and the sling behind my support hand just seems to work better and allows my support hand to move as needed to activate the light.

Again all, thanks for the input.

Oh... found this. It reinforces what Jones has stated and what I am now "running". He even talks about using a bungee (although, he said this while using a single point sling). He is an ex-Seal. I know in the past I was challenged by some that taking information from a Seal as being gospel is small minded on my part. However, I tend to take what these guys say to heart, especially the ones that have seen combat.

Single Point Sling Vs. Dual Point Sling w/ a Navy SEAL


The "Boz"
 
Posts: 1151 | Location: Central Ohio, USA | Registered: May 29, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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