Most of the ammo down the pipe of my 6.5 Creedmoor has been Hornady factory 140 AMax, but I finally had a moment to compare it to factory 120 AMax head-to-head at 470 yards.

First, MV -- on my 26" Bartlein tube, 70 degrees F, Magneto speed V3:
- 2775 fps Amax 140
- 2950 fps Amax 120
both showed SD of 12
Actually, the Magneto speed showed slightly higher MVs, but the above data works backwards so that actual dope pretty much is dead on with JBM.

Elevation to 470 yards
- 8.25 MOA Amax 140
- 7.25 MOA Amax 120

Windage at 470 yards, estimated at 10 mph:
- I was able to hold just off the plate edge with 140, which appeared to be 2.00 MOA on my reticle, which corresponds with 10mph per JBM
- With 120, I was holding 2.75-3.00 MOA to get the same impact (holding a little further off plate)

JBM predicts a 2.4 MOA drift with the 120 bullet at 10 mph, so it's possible the down range wind increased slightly when I switched from 140 to 120. But it didn't seem to me that the wind had changed all that much during the short time it took to change single loading ammo from the 140 box to the 120 box.

Accuracy doesn't seem to be any different between the two loads -- both are great, holding vertical to the 1.50-1.75 inch range for 8 rounds each. The 120s obviously shoot flatter, but the efficiency of the 140s in crosswinds is the winner for me.

jelrod1,

congrats on shooting the match. Sounds like a blast.

Bummer on the hostage stage! Hostage stages are tough. Be less/more aggressive with the wind call? Error away from the hostage? Certainly adds an element to the shot. I did the same thing in a match last year, perfectly centered hit on the hostage head, RO barked out "pregnant lady down".

Hitting so fast on the drop down stage had to put some pressure on those other two shooters. Nicely done!

Do you feel it hurt you not having a brake/supressor? Watch all your impacts?

quote:

Originally posted by offgrid:

Do you feel it hurt you not having a brake/supressor? Watch all your impacts?

Yes I feel it hurt me. Spotted impacts/misses on all stages except one. Had to shoot off the third rung of an open farm gate that moved when you put pressure on it. Targets were close (475), but small and I had no clue if I hit or missed. Hit the first two but moved to the last and missed and couldn't make a follow up. I started out sitting slung and just touching the gate and felt pretty good. Looked through the scope and all I could see was the next rung. Had to totally reposition and that cost time and I rushed it. Brake would've helped I think. Better time management and position would have too though.

Yeah hostage stage sucked. The RO sounded like James Earl Jones and said " You're done!". I caught the direction change but misjudged the magnitude. Wind died and the next person cleaned shooting targets heads up. That's part of it though and could have just as easily been the other way around.

jelrod1,

I know these 2015 matches are a long ways from you.

I'll plan on shooting 3, 4, 12, 14 and 17.

http://forum.snipershide.com/p...2015-prs-season.html

That's awesome. I'm hoping to make 10 and 11 on that list. Really no excuse not to make Woody's since it's the same state, and wanting to get down to K&M to check it out. Not sure if I can make any of the others. Will probably do several in VA.

Hey fritz,

glad you were able to make the T3 match, good shooting with you. Fun wind for sure! You shot well for a FNG

quote:

Originally posted by offgrid:
Hey fritz,

glad you were able to make the T3 match, good shooting with you. Fun wind for sure! You shot well for a FNG

Hey, I enjoyed the shoot. Thanks again for the conveyor belts. The wind definitely added to the challenge -- but I think I over held wind more than under. Thanks, but I personally thought I shot like dog doo. Anyway, I learned a lot, and learned that I have a lot to learn.

<<Arnold voice>> --- I'll be back.

But....Mr. Big Swinging Offgrid was top banana. Well done, homie.

As a consolation for the weekend, I won the 20 gauge event on Sunday. If I correctly understand the national sporting clays class system, it looks like I now get to stay in Master Class for another year. Woohoo -- somebody has to be at the back of the first bus, even if it is a short bus.

quote:

Originally posted by fritz:

but I think I over held wind more than under.

Ya, shooting along that ridge wind ramps up a giving us false info on what's happening on the valley floor/across the valley. Easy to hold too much.

Wind speed on Saturday wasn't all that bad. I believe I held from 0-12mph for a L-R wind, except on the last stage when the wind shifted 180. Shows us even in light-moderate wind, it's tough with the one shot hit or miss at each target format. That pesky wind!

See you next month former FNG.

Congrats on the Clay win!

Nice shooting offgrid. You seem to have that place figured out. Congrats on the clay win fritz. One day maybe I'll quit being middle melon and pick up top banana.

fritz, I believe this is the wrist band/dope board Steve was using.

http://3gungear.corecommerce.c...ta-Card-Set-p33.html

For those of us who use factory Hornady 6.5 Creedmoor 140 Amax ammo, there have been numerous reports of ammo with lots in the 313xxx range which were inconsistent in muzzle velocity, standard deviation for MV, accuracy, and point of impact. I had a little time today to run chrono and accuracy for a few 312xxx, 313xxx, and 314xxx rounds. (Magnetospeed V3)

MV -- I saw a little difference. 312xxx and 314xxx were in the 2840-ish range, 313xxx was in the 2815-ish range. I have seen posts of the 313xxx lots which were very hot and popped primers, but mine were on the slow side.

SD -- 312xxx in the 20-ish range (today was little higher than normal). 313xxx in the 25-ish range (definitely higher than normal. 314xxx in the 9-ish range (Mongo like).

POI -- no difference at 100 yards.

Accuracy -- 312xxx and 314xxx were great. 313xxx was OK, but nothing special. At 100 yards from bench rest (I actually don't feel that comfy anymore on a bench), twice I had my stunning groups going through four rounds(.1s and .2s), then yanked the fifth round. Going prone on concrete was more comfy and I had all five rounds back in the .2s again.

FWIW, accuracy from factory 120 AMax from a 313xxx lot was not good -- groups of .7 to .9.

One obvious difference of the 313xxx ammo was the smell of the powder -- substantially different than that of lots 312xxx and 314xxx.

Bottom line -- I agree with others who state Hornady let their 6.5CM quality slip for awhile. But they're back now. So...who's willing to trade some boxes of 313xxx lot for 312xxx or 314xxx?

Got to work on a few things today. Still need to do the Cerakote and have a lot of brass to work up before I can shoot. Probably be next weekend before I can get out with it. Coming together though. Surgeon action, Surgeon WSM Bolt, Bartlein 8.5 twist, KMW Sentinel stock, Jewell HVR, APA LB Gen2 brake, Accurate 300 WSM mags. A few pics along the way.

Fritz - does Hornady still put the reloading recipe on the packaging for the 140 AMAX load? I went out looking for one today, and think I will be making a foray into the Creedmoor in the next 6 months, so I'l like to start finding powder for it. IF you don't want to put it out there, you can email me directly.

Jonathan - That is a sweet looking stick you got there. I'd like to swing up and see you in action the next time you plan on putting time in on a saturday.

quote:

Originally posted by 280nosler:
Fritz - does Hornady still put the reloading recipe on the packaging for the 140 AMAX load?

Lots 314xxx don't have the details. Lots 312xxx and 313xxx show the following:
H-4350 41.5 grains
Fed 210M primer
COL 2.810"

FWIW, the 120 grain AMAX
Varget 39.0 grains
Fed 210M primer
COL 2.715"

quote:

Originally posted by 280nosler:

I'd like to swing up and see you in action the next time you plan on putting time in on a saturday.

Have a Tikka/XLR carbon/6.5x47 to do next. I'll holler at you when I get it going.

I've grown tired of constantly hanging paper so I bought myself a present

quote:

Originally posted by jlemmy:
I've grown tired of constantly hanging paper so I bought myself a present

I don't know if I would use that in your garage, you know bullet splatter and everything.

Got the Cerakote done today. Lots of necking down and neck turning this week and I'll be ready. Probably start with 130 Berger vld hunting at 62 grains or so of H1000 since it is hunting season. I'll also work up a load with 140 Hybrids that will hopefully end up my match load.

These past four days have been our state sporting clays tournament. I have not exactly been lighting up the leader board, due to a number of cranial-rectal inversions. So Friday afternoon I took the short drive to the family ranch, did some healthy prairie grass weed whacking to get a prone shooting position at 580 yards, and set up a couple of pieces of steel (with conveyor belts courtesy of sir offgrid):



The hit on the 12" square plate was cold bore, with a 1.5 MOA wind hold left of center. The hit on the 12" circle plate was shot number two, and with increasing wind I wild-assed a guess of 2.0 MOA wind left of center. As I've seen in other instances, most rifles don't have cold (fouled) bore accuracy issues, but I do see cold shooter accuracy issues.

Due a combination of the late hour of the day and the cattle wandering over to investigate two loud "tings", I got only two rifle shots in for the day.

quote:

Originally posted by jelrod1:
Got the Cerakote done today. Lots of necking down and neck turning this week and I'll be ready. Probably start with 130 Berger vld hunting at 62 grains or so of H1000 since it is hunting season. I'll also work up a load with 140 Hybrids that will hopefully end up my match load.

Looks great!

Look forward to your range report.

Barrel contour/length?