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I also shot my Rock River AR-15, which has an OK-ish 24” DSC barrel. I just installed a Wilson Combat single stage trigger in it, so I wanted to try it out.

I moved up to 440 yards and loaded up my last two boxes of Fiocchi 77 SMK. Seven rounds on the big rectangle plate, with the first round a little low. Seven rounds in 5”, although rounds 2 through 7 in only 2-3/4”. Then 5 rounds on the diamond to the right, with 3-1/4” vertical. Then 5 rounds on the circle to the far right, with 2-3/4” vertical. Finally, 4-3/4” vertical for 10 rounds on the left square – with the derp final shot being low and right. So the barrel has 2/3 to 3/4 MOA vertical capabilities with this ammo, for now. At least I don’t have to pull this barrel yet.



With only 75 rounds from prone, with driving to the targets to repaint them instead of my normal walking, I was tired and needed a quick nap. Recovering from surgery sucks.
 
Posts: 5388 | Location: Colorado | Registered: January 26, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Staring back
from the abyss
Picture of Gustofer
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Where did you get those plastic elbows for the rebar?


________________________________________________________

"How dreadful are the curses which Mohammedanism lays on its votaries! Besides the fanatical frenzy, which is as dangerous in a man as hydrophobia in a dog, there is this fearful fatalistic apathy." Winston Churchill
 
Posts: 14463 | Location: Montana | Registered: November 01, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by Gustofer:
Where did you get those plastic elbows for the rebar?

They are made by The Last Stand and cost about $40. Available on line, and from local stores. Maybe Sportsman Warehouse?

They're very functional in uneven terrain, as the legs can be adjusted for length. The welded steel target support systems are sturdier. The biggest downside to the polymer brackets is that bullet shrapnel sticks into the polymer, therefore I use a scrap of plywood near the bracket to take the shrapnel hit.

The Last Stand is great for hanging a new target and determining if I can see it from various shooting locations. For most of my target locations I prefer to sink a T-post, then put the targets on the T-post. The Last Stand has saved me from sinking T-posts in poor locations.
 
Posts: 5388 | Location: Colorado | Registered: January 26, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Freethinker
Picture of sigfreund
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quote:
Originally posted by Gustofer:
Where did you get those plastic elbows for the rebar?


JC Steel Targets makes a couple of steel brackets that work similarly.

https://jcsteeltargets.configi...ctlist&source=search

https://jcsteeltargets.configi...ctlist&source=search

I have a couple of the second kind and they’re quick and easy to set up (and to take down and secure), and of course extremely durable. Considering how chewed up the steel brackets get from rifle bullet fragments, I don’t believe plastic brackets would last long with heavy use. These don’t, however, allow easy leg height adjustment, so that might be a disadvantage some places.




“Most men … can seldom accept the simplest and most obvious truth if it … would oblige them to admit the falsity of conclusions … which they have woven, thread by thread, into the fabrics of their lives.”
— Leo Tolstoy
 
Posts: 38217 | Location: 10,150 Feet Above Sea Level in Colorado | Registered: April 04, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by sigfreund:
I have a couple of the second kind and they’re quick and easy to set up (and to take down and secure), and of course extremely durable. Considering how chewed up the steel brackets get from rifle bullet fragments, I don’t believe plastic brackets would last long with heavy use. These don’t, however, allow easy leg height adjustment, so that might be a disadvantage some places.

For permanent and high-volume use, I agree that an all-steel target support is the best way to go. It's amazing how dinged up my T-posts are from copper and lead shrapnel.

The polymer brackets work well for temporary and low-volume use, especially with the plywood triangle hanging between the target and the polymer bracket. When I forget to hang the plywood, small metal shards become embedded in the polymer. These shards are sharp, and thus can cut bare skin. So gloves are a must when working with these polymer stands. I think the polymer is very similar to that used in self-sealing targets -- the ones that take a bunch of hits, then sort-of seal the bullet holes afterwards.
 
Posts: 5388 | Location: Colorado | Registered: January 26, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Yeah, that M14 video guy...
Picture of benny6
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Well, I'm finally contributing to this thread. I took my LRB M25 (modern M14), JAE stocked rifle out to the 600yd line last night for a night shoot. I haven't had this particular rifle out to the 600yd line in about 2 years and it was in a different stock back then.

I also took my Savage out but I did not shoot it past 300yds. I wasn't all that impressed with how it was shooting. I recently mounted an SWFA used fixed 10x scope and I was shooting maybe 3" to 4" at 300. I'll have to mess with this one some more later. As a side note, it could have been the bipod that threw me off. I was using a GGG XD-S bipod and there was a LOT of bipod hop. I tightened my scope base and switched to an Atlas which tightened the groups up a little.

This was late in the afternoon at 300 and we had fog rolling in and out. After this picture was taken, it got too dark to take any more pics.


Anyways...
The fog cleared up and we all gathered for the shoot. This was the first time that I've shot this at 600 since I installed it in the JAE chassis. I was using 168 grain FGMM. I haven't had time to do any load testing at all this year so I just decided to go with factory match ammo. While I did use an Atlas bipod to get my 300 yard zeroes, I used a sandbag at the 600. I think this was a good choice as I felt my rifle did better at 600 than it did at 300.

My first sighting shot was at 6 o'clock, just off the paper. I adjusted for my second sighting shot and I hit the 10-ring. I mislabeled the shot on the picture below. It should be labeled S2 instead of S1. It took me a little while to get settled in again and I was fumbling with my cell phone (I was using the screen as alight source) to record hits in my data book. I forgot to pack a headlight which most people had on the firing line. Half way through the shoot, the RO turned on the red overhead lights and I was able to settle in better.

I made two sight corrections; the first being on shot 8 and the second being on shot 11. Both sight adjustments zeroed me in on the x-ring. My last 10 shots, I was pretty much in the zone only dropping two in the 9-ring.

I measured the spread on my last 10 shots after I made my final sight adjustment and the spread between those shots was about 7.25" wide bringing the group size within 1.15 MOA.

Also, I should note that this is an F-class target.

The last ten consecutive shots were within the green circle and no more sight adjustments were made.



Final score was a 189 7-X


I just barely squeezed in an X, but if you look closely, it did break the X-ring line...


This is new territory for me, so feedback is appreciated. I didn't see any other shooter's scores but I was the only guy shooting a semi-auto; an M14-type at that. I do know I did better than some other shooters as I did see some targets with more hits in the 7 and 8 ring than me.

I do feel that I was outclassed in the scope category. Most people had 20X scopes or something like that. Mine tops out at 14x.

Tony.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: benny6,


Owner, TonyBen, LLC, Type-01 FFL
www.tonybenm14.com (Site under construction).
e-mail: tonyben@tonybenm14.com
 
Posts: 2841 | Location: USA | Registered: February 13, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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http://www.magnetospeed.com/pr...rget-hit-indicators/

A friend bought one of these. We dubbed it the "Happy Light". Yesterday we tried it out. Mounted it on the back of a piece of steel at 600yds the furthest we can shoot at the range. It worked great, can easily see the light flash with the naked eye. Because the stand/size of steel we mounted it on the side of the rectangle piece of steel. That was mistake, put two rounds through the prism with missed wind calls. Did not hurt the flexible rubber like material. It would have been better to mount it at the bottom of the plate, next time. Had a guy at the range shoot at it with his 223/55 grain bullet, not much energy left at 600yds.... worked great. Look forward to putting it on a piece of steel well beyond 1000yds. Fun stuff!
 
Posts: 2484 | Location: 9860 ft above sea level Colorado | Registered: December 31, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Interesting new action from Bighorn. Killer price point.


https://bighornarms.com/produc...igin-action-deposit/
 
Posts: 2484 | Location: 9860 ft above sea level Colorado | Registered: December 31, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of swage
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Mausingfield came out with a similar offering and promotion.

I need a new action for a dedicated Dasher build. So far I'm liking the ARC offering.

http://www.americanrifle.com/p...-refundable-deposit/
 
Posts: 1699 | Location: Ohio | Registered: October 17, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by swage:
Mausingfield came out with a similar offering and promotion.

I need a new action for a dedicated Dasher build. So far I'm liking the ARC offering.

http://www.americanrifle.com/p...-refundable-deposit/


The dual cocking cams...should be able to ease the bolt lift.

Like to put my hands on both these actions.

These two action builders just making these with Savage threads... believe that's a sign of things to come. Quality pre-thread/chambered barrels being offered.
 
Posts: 2484 | Location: 9860 ft above sea level Colorado | Registered: December 31, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of swage
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quote:
Originally posted by offgrid:
quote:
Originally posted by swage:
Mausingfield came out with a similar offering and promotion.

I need a new action for a dedicated Dasher build. So far I'm liking the ARC offering.

http://www.americanrifle.com/p...-refundable-deposit/


The dual cocking cams...should be able to ease the bolt lift.

Like to put my hands on both these actions.

These two action builders just making these with Savage threads... believe that's a sign of things to come. Quality pre-thread/chambered barrels being offered.


I agree as well. Bugholes has been making Savage pre-fits for a while using his Bugnut design. I'm going to have to make a decision soon. I considered a TL3 because many have run it with good success using the ARC mags and conversion kits. The introductory price seems too good pass up on either offering.
 
Posts: 1699 | Location: Ohio | Registered: October 17, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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My TL3/Dasher cycles 100% with AICS mags with the feed lips slightly flared, no spacer/conversion.... Thousands of Dasher rounds in my older Bighorns also 100%. A few guys around me have tried the ARC mags, have problems in AW cut actions. Supposedly the ARC mags work better in AICS cut only actions?
 
Posts: 2484 | Location: 9860 ft above sea level Colorado | Registered: December 31, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of swage
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quote:
Originally posted by offgrid:
My TL3/Dasher cycles 100% with AICS mags with the feed lips slightly flared, no spacer/conversion.... Thousands of Dasher rounds in my older Bighorns also 100%. A few guys around me have tried the ARC mags, have problems in AW cut actions. Supposedly the ARC mags work better in AICS cut only actions?


You would certainly know better than myself. I only considered the conversion kits because Josh at PVA has had a lot of success using them with the TL3 and Dasher. I wish I could get my hands on a TL3 and the new ARC Nucleus and run them side by side.
 
Posts: 1699 | Location: Ohio | Registered: October 17, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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SF member Alpine is going to be at Shot. See if I can get him to handle those actions.... He wears his Defiance underwear proudly, should be unbiased!
 
Posts: 2484 | Location: 9860 ft above sea level Colorado | Registered: December 31, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by offgrid:
magnetospeed -- target-hit-indicators

A friend bought one of these. We dubbed it the "Happy Light". Yesterday we tried it out.

I've watched a few videos of them. Pretty cool idea -- that of a reasonably priced flasher.

I think mounting it to the bottom edge of a free-hanging rectangle makes the most sense. Upon reviewing my target setups, this won't work all that well for me. Most of my free hanging targets are diamonds and circles. Almost all of my rectangles are hook mounted to single T-posts. Which means the device would get banged up between the plate and the T-post with each high-energy impact.

I may have to consider my mounting systems.
 
Posts: 5388 | Location: Colorado | Registered: January 26, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Bolt Thrower
Picture of Voshterkoff
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quote:
Originally posted by offgrid:
Interesting new action from Bighorn. Killer price point.


https://bighornarms.com/produc...igin-action-deposit/


Looks quite a bit more affordable than most custom actions. I've had an AICS that I picked up cheap during the assault-riflelypse.
 
Posts: 8071 | Location: Woodinville, WA | Registered: March 30, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of swage
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quote:
Originally posted by offgrid:
SF member Alpine is going to be at Shot. See if I can get him to handle those actions.... He wears his Defiance underwear proudly, should be unbiased!


I have a nitrided Deviant that's pretty slick. I'd be interested in hearing his thoughts on both.
 
Posts: 1699 | Location: Ohio | Registered: October 17, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Friday was primarily a fence fixing day, but I was able to shoot the Rock River AR for bit. Unfortunately, winds were bad in advance of an approaching storm. The primary mission was to compare accuracy among my 3 primary factory rounds -- Hornady 73 ELD-M, Hornady 75 HPBT, and Federal GMM 69.

Hornady's 73 ELDM performs brilliantly in my SI Defense with a 20" Krieger barrel, which has a 223 match chamber. All my other barrels have 5.56 chambers, and the 73 ELDM ammo isn't as spectacular in them -- maybe equal or close to the 75 HPBT in accuracy. Just a wild assed guess, but I think some of the newer high-BC bullets don't do as well with a little extra jump to the lands.

I haven't completely written off the 73 ELDM in the Rock River yet, but it appears the cheaper 75s work just fine. Especially when Hornady Black ammo can be found for $.60 per round.

While confirming zero at 100 yards, 5 rounds of Hornady 75 produced a .45" group. Yee-haw. Then I moved back to 575 yards, shooting for vertical variation only, because variable winds from my right sucked. The big middle target had vertical of 3.75". Then 3.25" vertical variation on the right plate, and 4" on the left one.



I'm OK with vertical of .55 to .7 MOA at 575 yards with the OK-ish DSC barrel.

*****
Some shooters have asked me how one can hold close vertical on a pure white plate with no aim point. This can be done by holding the bottom of top edge of a square plate, then dialing elevation up or down an MOA or two. Or by holding the prominent elevation hash mark on the reticle on the top or bottom edge of the plate.
 
Posts: 5388 | Location: Colorado | Registered: January 26, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Using a tripod for rear support.

Picture of yours truly from a local match this past Saturday using a tripod for rear support. Very stable, can easily hold the reticle less then 1 MOA. We shot from a rung, move to another, used the tripod for all rungs. A few things worth noting. Front of the rifle is supported forward, more stable compared to supporting near the magwell. Doesn't matter which knee I'm on. If the the rear of the rifle was unsupported, would be on the other knee to support my strong arm. Right foot rolled over as much as possible, not on my toes. Because of the two support points, can have a fair amount of cheek pressure on the rear stock just like from prone, more likely to maintain point of aim/point of impact.

Key to building this position quickly. Get on the target then bring the tripod in for support. Don't move everything together. Could be used in a hunting scenario off of a tree branch....

Give it a try.

https://s18.postimg.org/eb1wf3zxl/IMG_2658.jpg
 
Posts: 2484 | Location: 9860 ft above sea level Colorado | Registered: December 31, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Freethinker
Picture of sigfreund
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quote:
Originally posted by offgrid:
Give it a try.


Great. Another of your suggestions I must try out now (and probably have to incorporate into my DM course). Roll Eyes

Wink

The only thing I usually do differently from what you’ve showed me before is putting both knees on the ground rather than just one. It always seems more stable for me.




“Most men … can seldom accept the simplest and most obvious truth if it … would oblige them to admit the falsity of conclusions … which they have woven, thread by thread, into the fabrics of their lives.”
— Leo Tolstoy
 
Posts: 38217 | Location: 10,150 Feet Above Sea Level in Colorado | Registered: April 04, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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