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The Army’s SAW and M4 replacements will both fire this more accurate and deadly 6.8mm round Login/Join 
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Picture of kimberkid
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quote:
Originally posted by fritz:
"The Army’s SAW and M4 replacements will both fire this more accurate and deadly round"

I have no issues with a new caliber and new ammo for the military. Certainly there are caliber designs which can be more effective than the 5.56, but yet without a whole lot of weight or other penalties in the tradeoff.

When one adds more boiler room to the round, the projectile has more kinetic energy. Nothing new here. Think 6.8 SPC, 6.5 Grendel, 22 Nosler, 224 Valkyrie. Plus some 6mm wildcat chamberings.

I find it tiring that new cartridges always seem to be "more accurate" than the 223. Sometimes there's no data to back up the accuracy claims. Or even flight and energy ballistics. When data is shown, it tends to be with the newest whiz-bang wonder bullet in the new chambering versus a 55 grain FMJ in 5.56.

AAC was notorious for this with the 300blk that "they invented". I've shot enough 300blk to know that yes it does put more energy on target at reasonable distances, but its accuracy is wanting.

I have less experience behind a 6.8 SPC, but I still don't see its accuracy even equal to that of a quality 5.56/223 rifle with good ammo. The 6.8 SPC in its current form is definitely not more accurate than its 5.56/223 counterpart. Maybe new developments will change that.

It will be interesting to see what becomes of the Army's tests.

More than likely, after millions ... or billions of dollars spent, they will come to the same conclusion as you ... I find it amazing that people like this Brig. Gen. Anthony Potts can't talk to actual shooters before starting starting such ventures.


If you really want something you'll find a way ...
... if you don't you'll find an excuse.

I'm really not a "kid" anymore ... but I haven't grown up yet either Wink
 
Posts: 4773 | Registered: January 11, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of ed308
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quote:

I have less experience behind a 6.8 SPC, but I still don't see its accuracy even equal to that of a quality 5.56/223 rifle with good ammo. The 6.8 SPC in its current form is definitely not more accurate than its 5.56/223 counterpart. Maybe new developments will change that.

It will be interesting to see what becomes of the Army's tests.


All of my 6.8 (5) are as accurate as my .223 and more accurate than my 5.56 ARs. I think this will be a larger case, maybe the .277 USA which is between 5.56 and .308 in OAL. I think it's around 2.4".

This message has been edited. Last edited by: ed308,
 
Posts: 549 | Location: DFW Area | Registered: January 12, 2015Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of ed308
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quote:
I know some shooters have 6.8s that shoot around 1 MOA at 100 yards. In this day and age with decent ARs and good ammo, that's not all that difficult to accomplish. Building an AR that consistently shoots better than 1 MOA, at distance, is the challenge. I have three AR-15s that have produced a considerable number of 100 yard 5-round groups in the .5" to .7" range, with machine-like consistency in the .7" to .9" range. My best one has produced groups in the .3s. I don't know of shooters doing that with 6.8s.

That said, the 6.8 SPC -- or something like it -- may eventually end up being a more effective military cartridge than 5.56/223.


.5 MOA with ARP barrels. PSA and LWRC barrels are slightly larger with my 6.8s. My reloads of course. But Federal's FMJ is .75. And S&B's is slightly smaller.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: ed308,
 
Posts: 549 | Location: DFW Area | Registered: January 12, 2015Reply With QuoteReport This Post
my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, saves lives
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That’s the same reason that they switched the MHS from 9mm. Oh, wait, never mind.


quote:
One of the major goals of the MHS effort is to adopt a pistol chambered for a more potent round than the current 9mm, weapons officials said. The U.S. military replaced the .45 caliber 1911 pistol with the M9 in 1985 and began using the 9mm NATO round at that time.

Soldiers who have served in Iraq and Afghanistan have complained that the 9mm round is not powerful enough to be effective in combat.

“The 9mm doesn’t score high with soldier feedback,” said Easlick, explaining that the Army, and the other services, want a round that will have better terminal effects — or cause more damage — when it hits enemy combatants. “We have to do better than our current 9mm.”

The MHS will be an open-caliber competition that will evaluate larger rounds such as .357 Sig, .40 S&W and .45 ACP.
from 2014....

https://fishgame.com/2014/07/u...place-m9-9mm-pistol/


*****************************
"I don't own the night, I only operate a small franchise" - Author unknown
 
Posts: 2224 | Location: Texas | Registered: September 27, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of dwd1985
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quote:
Originally posted by car541:
That’s the same reason that they switched the MHS from 9mm. Oh, wait, never mind.


quote:
One of the major goals of the MHS effort is to adopt a pistol chambered for a more potent round than the current 9mm, weapons officials said. The U.S. military replaced the .45 caliber 1911 pistol with the M9 in 1985 and began using the 9mm NATO round at that time.

Soldiers who have served in Iraq and Afghanistan have complained that the 9mm round is not powerful enough to be effective in combat.

“The 9mm doesn’t score high with soldier feedback,” said Easlick, explaining that the Army, and the other services, want a round that will have better terminal effects — or cause more damage — when it hits enemy combatants. “We have to do better than our current 9mm.”

The MHS will be an open-caliber competition that will evaluate larger rounds such as .357 Sig, .40 S&W and .45 ACP.
from 2014....

https://fishgame.com/2014/07/u...place-m9-9mm-pistol/


Shit like this bugs the hell out of me. "The 9mm doesn't score high with soldier feedback." Yeah, because they asked Sgt Bucktooth from Lubbock, TX who never unholstered his pistol once in combat, and in his civilian life, only owns .45's because that's "a real mans boolit"!

Its the same deal with the 5.56, people who have no clue what they're talking about spouting off "facts" that they've heard as though they have personal experience. In my years as a Marine, I cannot count the number of times I have heard "5.56 is too tiny of a bullet for combat!", "The M9 is a terrible pistol!", and "9mm is a weak round, we should have .45s!".
 
Posts: 3694 | Registered: October 28, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of ed308
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Posts: 549 | Location: DFW Area | Registered: January 12, 2015Reply With QuoteReport This Post
semi-reformed sailor
Picture of MikeinNC
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another waste of taxpayers money....

stick with NATO ammo

spend money on more live fire training



"Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor.”
― Robert A. Heinlein, Starship Troopers

 
Posts: 5337 | Location: Texas! | Registered: October 07, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Despite all the daysayers, the benefit of much lighter ammo is a big plus. Also the enemy will not have spent brass cases to rework.


-c1steve
 
Posts: 2284 | Location: West coast | Registered: March 31, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
We gonna get some
oojima in this house!
Picture of smithnsig
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I think the only thing they could really improve would be range. Military ball is military ball. I would think a heavy long .25 caliber would be better.


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TCB all the time...
 
Posts: 5800 | Location: Cantonment/Perdido Key, Florida | Registered: September 28, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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