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OP, I have no clue about current MA laws, but assuming you can buy new lowers without restriction, those prices are BANANAS. If there is a ban on any new lowers, then I suppose you pay your money and build up your rifle.

quote:
Originally posted by Anubismp:
I'm an Aug man myself, hard to argue with 16" ballistics in a 10.5" sized gun that has years of R&D and takes 42 rd mags. I'm sure someone will try though. Youre also not beating on your components nearly as hard as a 10.5 gun.


Agreed. The AUG is fantastic.


quote:
Originally posted by FrozenIceman:
MDRx in FDE meets your requirements. However the waiting list for a new one is long.


The MDR has been a complete sh!tshow. How on earth could you recommend it? That’s worse than recommending one buy a MSAR.


---------------------------------------------
"AND YEA THOUGH THE HINDUS SPEAK OF KARMA, I IMPLORE YOU...GIVE HER A BREAK, LORD". - Clark W. Griswald
 
Posts: 2094 | Location: The South | Registered: September 12, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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M16 and SA80A1 was a shit show when they first came out. MDRx is 2 generations after the MDR and half the parts are not interchangeable. It has overwhelming support from established reviewers. The MDRx is virtually brand new internals save for the barrels and maybe magazine release. Heck even the polymer in the body is different.

From an MDR early adopter perspective all the gen 1 guys have free warranty upgrade and repair upgrading them to gen 2. Sure it isn't as reliable as the gen 3 MDRx but once you figure out what ammo it doesn't like it seems to operate just fine.

So the reason I recommend it is because it is the most advanced, accurate, and reliable rifle designed as a battle rifle on the planet right now.

Grande Thumb, In range TV, and Forgotten weapons put them through their paces.

Also the trigger on the MDRx is amazing out of the box. Puts it on the same realm as a decent AR trigger which is light years ahead of all other stock bullpups.
 
Posts: 30 | Registered: September 17, 2020Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Frangas non Flectes
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Your enthusiasm for that platform is noted. Are you still on the waiting list for yours, or did you get it and run thousands of rounds through it to the point where you're comfortable recommending it out of your own personal experience?

Objectively speaking, JoshNC is right. I looked into the MDR a few years back and read seemingly nothing but horror stories about it. It would take a lot more than one guy suddenly popping up on this forum cheerleading for Desert Tech to even make me consider looking into them again. I'm not even motivated enough to watch the youtuber reviews because of the shit reputation Desert Tech earned for themselves, rightly or wrongly.

When it comes to a lengthy proven track record, MDR-anything isn't a blip on the radar compared to the Tavor, and not even in the same hemisphere as the AUG. You can make all the claims you want, but you're literally the first guy I've seen recommending them, anywhere. Logic tells me that if it was quite what you say it is, there would be more conversation about it. I say all this having initially been really impressed with and interested in the design. I love bullpups and am starting to build a little collection of them, but there's no way in hell I would even consider buying an MDRXwhatever it is this year over an AUG, let alone recommend them to anyone else.
 
Posts: 12254 | Location: Seattle-ish | Registered: February 10, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
So the reason I recommend it is because it is the most advanced, accurate, and reliable rifle designed as a battle rifle on the planet right now

Show me somewhere, anywhere, someone in the 'battle rifle' business issuing thisto people who would use it in the sense of the word?


“So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.”
 
Posts: 9049 | Registered: October 14, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Charmingly unsophisticated
Picture of AllenInWV
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Not gonna lie, I have a serious chubby for the X95 in FDE.


_______________________________

"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose."
- Jim Elliot
 
Posts: 15703 | Location: Cross Lanes, WV | Registered: February 05, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Yep, I received my MDRx last week (I was in line for about 9 weeks) and they even added some free Pmags (at my request) due to how long I waited. However thousands of rounds definitely take time (currently using M80 Ball from American Marksman). But from what I understand most of the people who don't like the original MDR stopped after a few dozen rounds (usually due to stoppages and got fed up for good reason). If that is your requirement I think you will have to disregard nearly everyone talking about it on this forum (and will need to go to some of the reviews I post below).

Also the DT warranty guys are amazing, My rifle had a scuffed up takedown screws. With all the horror stories we heard I figured I would try my luck and see how bad it was. I sent an email to them about it and 24 hours later they responded and sent me a whole new screw set as well as a bunch of swag.

As far as my recommendations goes, my use of said rifle, overall design and reviews made by professionals. There was definitely a lot of deserved vitriol for the first MDR's that came out, however I am impressed with what they did with the criticism (they actually released multiple engineering level presentations on their findings and action items post criticism I attached the two that impressed me the most below).

But ya I am not surprised that you haven't seen many of proponents of the MDRx (outside of the MDR forums on bullpups forums), the positive reviews for the gen 2 MDR came out last year and unless you look for them (which is what I did when I realized the platform existed earlier this year) you probably won't find them. Lots of MDRx written reviews are popping up now too, just do a google search for them and you should find them.

For me, these are the videos that really made me buy this thing sight unseen. But ya, I definitely wouldn't have touched the original MDR. In range has also run it through a few competitions in Tuscon in 6.5 Creedmore magtech if you want to see where he placed with it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFxw1d6z8dk <First gen Review
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hq2Jzn6qCHQ <Second Gen Review

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DabLcqavXJ0< First Gen Review
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZnGFA5uaNM<Second Gen Review

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ed01kq20dM<DT Response to In Range criticism
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xVlsS23TDAA<DT Test video of gen 2 with different ammo brands

For the last two videos, if you can point to any arms manufacturer who has been this publicly transparent on how much their gun sucked and committed to fixing it I would be impressed.

@AllenInWV Yep X95 was definitely on my short list and if I pulled the trigger last year I probably would have bought that one before I realized the MDR/MDRx was a thing.

What gave me pause was the 'questionable' accuracy of it (Apparently it isn't exactly free floated and has a front trunion spacer that warps the barrel a bit). The first gen X95's also had some accuracy issues due to some parts making contact with the barrel assembly when they shouldn't have resulting in between 2 and 5 MOA, but from what I understand those have been fixed and it has been stabilized around 2 MOA. Their Tavor 7 is supposed to be better but apparently the delays were due to accuracy issues as well but they weren't able to get it below 1.5 MOA or so.

@Hrcjon, the Battle Rifle reference is in most of the above reviews, but Garand Thumb meets your requirements for in the business.
 
Posts: 30 | Registered: September 17, 2020Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by FrozenIceman:
M16 and SA80A1 was a shit show when they first came out. MDRx is 2 generations after the MDR and half the parts are not interchangeable. It has overwhelming support from established reviewers. The MDRx is virtually brand new internals save for the barrels and maybe magazine release. Heck even the polymer in the body is different.

From an MDR early adopter perspective all the gen 1 guys have free warranty upgrade and repair upgrading them to gen 2. Sure it isn't as reliable as the gen 3 MDRx but once you figure out what ammo it doesn't like it seems to operate just fine.

So the reason I recommend it is because it is the most advanced, accurate, and reliable rifle designed as a battle rifle on the planet right now.

Grande Thumb, In range TV, and Forgotten weapons put them through their paces.

Also the trigger on the MDRx is amazing out of the box. Puts it on the same realm as a decent AR trigger which is light years ahead of all other stock bullpups.



The issues with the M16 were due to incorrect powder, not the design, manufacturing, and QC/QA. The SA80 is still a turd despite multiple attempts to unf&&k it.

YouTube personality videos are for entertainment only. Drawing conclusions based on their “tests” is silly.

How many MDX are in the wild? And of those, how many have multiple thousands of trouble free rounds through them? Outside of the factory and its shills. I am willing to bet either none or less than five.

The MDR fiasco was a total sh$tshow. There was a very very lengthy thread on arfcom with owner’s experiences and mind numbing posts by cheerleaders with total turds that kept going back to DT.

What professional users are shooting an MDX? And I don’t mean YouTube personalities who are posting reviews.


---------------------------------------------
"AND YEA THOUGH THE HINDUS SPEAK OF KARMA, I IMPLORE YOU...GIVE HER A BREAK, LORD". - Clark W. Griswald
 
Posts: 2094 | Location: The South | Registered: September 12, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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My serial is in the 5000 range, so assuming they didn't renumber with the MDRx I would assume about that many.

From what I understand it was a lot of different things for the original M16, powder was one, the not issuing cleaning kits, corrosion resistance (everywhere) wasn't great, magazine issues, etc. My point is that the first gen of anything novel is usually bad and requires tweaking.

I recommend you look into Forgotten Weapons and Grande Thumb a bit more. The former is a weapon specialist which includes his day job of auctioning and authenticating rare weapons. The later is current military as a SERE instructor that does Garand thumb as a hobby (and with approval of his command).

Here are other written MDRx Reviews if you like, but they usually skip over the shit show that was the original MDR and exactly what was changed in the MDRx and why (unlike the gen 1 reviews I linked above). Seriously watch the Gen 1 videos I linked above and it will show exactly how bad the MDR was at release.

https://www.guns.com/news/2020...srt-tech-mdrx-review
https://www.gunsamerica.com/di...-creedmoor-reviewed/
https://www.snipershide.com/sh...drx-mdrx-se.6984092/
http://bullpupforum.com/index....drfqs4&topic=14398.0
https://www.americanrifleman.o...20-desert-tech-mdrx/
http://bullpupforum.com/index....drfqs4&topic=14623.0

Garand Thumb guy is a professional user in the sense that he was paid to kill people with guns if that is what you are asking or are you asking why a gun that has only been on the market for 9 month's hasn't been adopted by the military?

Desert Tech also claims 2 Michigan Police agencies were equipped with MDRx rifles (with collab from vortex and magpul) but I have not been able to confirmed anything from a gov source on it.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: FrozenIceman,
 
Posts: 30 | Registered: September 17, 2020Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by FrozenIceman:
My serial is in the 5000 range, so assuming they didn't renumber with the MDRx I would assume about that many.

From what I understand it was a lot of different things for the original M16, powder was one, the not issuing cleaning kits, corrosion resistance wasn't great etc. My point is that the first gen of anything novel is usually bad and requires tweaking.

I recommend you look into Forgotten Weapons and Grande Thumb a bit more. The former is a weapon specialist which includes his day job of auctioning and authenticating rare weapons. The later is current military as a SERE instructor that does Garand thumb as a hobby (and with approval of his command).

Here are other written MDRx Reviews if you like, but they usually skip over the shit show that was the original MDR and exactly what was changed in the MDRx and why (unlike the gen 1 reviews I linked above).

https://www.guns.com/news/2020...srt-tech-mdrx-review
https://www.gunsamerica.com/di...-creedmoor-reviewed/
https://www.snipershide.com/sh...drx-mdrx-se.6984092/
http://bullpupforum.com/index....drfqs4&topic=14398.0
https://www.americanrifleman.o...20-desert-tech-mdrx/

Garand Thumb guy is a professional user in the sense that he was paid to kill people with guns if that is what you are asking or are you asking why a gun that has only been on the market for 9 month's hasn't been adopted by the military?

Desert Tech also claims 2 Michigan Police agencies were equipped with MDRx rifles (with collab from vortex and magpul) but I have not been able to confirmed anything from a gov source on it.


I’m completely familiar with both FW and Garand Thumb. Interesting guys. I don’t make messiahs out of any personality. Is Garand Thumb shooting an MDX exclusively? Or is he saying it’s a novel design?

Kudos to you for picking up an MDX. I hope yours is reliable and look forward to an update when you have a few thousand rounds through it.


---------------------------------------------
"AND YEA THOUGH THE HINDUS SPEAK OF KARMA, I IMPLORE YOU...GIVE HER A BREAK, LORD". - Clark W. Griswald
 
Posts: 2094 | Location: The South | Registered: September 12, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I am not saying they are gun messiah's I am saying that there are positive reviews of the gen 2 MDR's and they are decently reliable. You wanted positive reviews (as well as the gen 1 negative reviews from them). They exist but you have to do some digging.

Right now we have the word of people who had terrible experiences with the original MDR and word of people have reviewed the later model stuff.

Matter of fact, I haven't actually found any negative reviews (forum or otherwise) on the MDRx rifle. I have seen people complaining about the older MDR, the lack of reverse compatibility of MDRx parts into their MDR, and people complaining about the wait.

And thank you, on the kudos. I will definitely report back periodically on how it performs. However I can say this definitively: the MDRx trigger is amazing. Way, way better than the X95 and most AR triggers I have shot. At the very least whatever they did there on it was fantastic.
 
Posts: 30 | Registered: September 17, 2020Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I am currently mulling over a MDRx myself. I have been playing around with the idea of pulling the trigger on one for a while.
 
Posts: 2381 | Location: Pnw | Registered: March 21, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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From my experience it seems to be a solid rifle, but you probably won't be able to find one sitting on the shelves in your favorite gun store. It seems the MDRx is being scooped up within a day of hitting the shelves where I am at. Best chance is Xtreme Guns and Ammo (where I ordered mine). You can custom order it how you want and they claim they are the largest supplier of DT gear so can leverage that to make sure you get your stuff (but it is a long wait probably 8 weeks minimum at this point).
 
Posts: 30 | Registered: September 17, 2020Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I have decided to add a Tavor X95 to my small collection if I can find one.

My FFL was sold out in two days before I could get back there and buy it.

If someone has one to sell please reach out, email is in my profile.

I also listed my WTB in the classifieds.
 
Posts: 3664 | Registered: February 15, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
LIBERTATEM DEFENDIMUS
Picture of Belgian Blue
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quote:
Originally posted by sig2392:
I have decided to add a Tavor X95 to my small collection if I can find one.

My FFL was sold out in two days before I could get back there and buy it.

If someone has one to sell please reach out, email is in my profile.

I also listed my WTB in the classifieds.


I've seen a good number of them on GB for reasonable prices. I think that would be a great choice and I wouldn't rule out a Tavor SAR if you find a good price on one.
 
Posts: 5272 | Registered: October 18, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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