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Never shoot another person's hand loads! Ruger M77 300 WM ***Hand load data on page 2*** Login/Join 
Yeah, that M14 video guy...
Picture of benny6
posted
A friend of a family member brought this rifle to me and I told him I'd see what I could do. It's a 300 Win Mag. He shot someone else's hand loads and the case head blew. Gas vented out of the pressure port on the right side of the receiver ring and the magazine floor plate was bowed out. The extractor was damaged and the extractor clip was broken. He took it to Cabela's and they gave it right back in pieces.

I punched the remaining blown case with a 30 cal cleaning rod. I have no idea what the load recipe was.

I'm thinking of checking headspace and replacing the broken parts if I can find them. It's still completely missing a floor plate hinge pin and a trigger pivot pin.

Anyone know how tough these Ruger M77's are? I've got zero experience with Ruger bolt actions. My gut tells me it's fine if headspace is okay but I'm open to suggestions or opinions.













Brass deposits from the vent hole...


Mangled extractor and broken extractor clip...




Tony.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: benny6,


Owner, TonyBen, LLC, Type-01 FFL
www.tonybenm14.com (Site under construction).
e-mail: tonyben@tonybenm14.com
 
Posts: 2594 | Location: USA | Registered: February 13, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of 280nosler
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I'd take it to a smith and let them tell you if the action is salvageable. This looks kinda sketchy, as if somebody used handgun powder in a rifle case, or used a slightly larger diameter bullet, or way too heavy a bullet.




Nut up or Shut up!
 
Posts: 7990 | Location: 1200 yards out | Registered: January 20, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of 3/4Flap
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Box it up and ship it to Ruger. Send the blown case with it.

Let them check it out and replace all necessary parts.

Do not mess around with some "gunsmith".

PS: Ever notice how these reports always include "somebody else's" reloads?


**********************
"For certainly no legislation can be supposed more wholesome and necessary in the founding of a free, self-governing commonwealth, fit to take rank as one of the coordinate States of the Union, than that which seeks to establish it on the basis of the idea of the family, as consisting in and springing from the union for life of one man and one woman in the holy estate of matrimony"; United States Supreme Court Ruling, Murphy v. Ramsey 1885.
The hardest trail leads to the highest peak.
"A liberal is a person whose immediate interests are not at stake."
 
Posts: 4778 | Location: Idaho, USA | Registered: May 20, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of JJexp
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quote:
Originally posted by 3/4Flap:

Do not mess around with some "gunsmith".



I’m pretty sure the op is that gunsmith.

Any chance of demating the barrel from the receiver and maybe doing an mpi or a dye penetrant? My biggest fear would be a fracture somewhere that’s just waiting to go off with the next hot load.
 
Posts: 236 | Location: Hatboro, PA | Registered: May 25, 2016Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Raptorman
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That bolt looks like someone pounded on it with a chisel.


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Posts: 29939 | Location: North, GA | Registered: October 09, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Not really from Vienna
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Whoever produced those swell handloads owes that guy a rifle and an apology, IMO.




 
Posts: 20802 | Location: Young American Teen Club | Registered: January 30, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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It looks to me like the damage is to be found in the mag floor plate. I don't see much else visually evident, and clearly the case vented instead of much worse damage that could have occurred.
 
Posts: 1338 | Registered: September 13, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I think there is more to the story than what has been reported so far. Perhaps the friend of the family member did not provide all the details or simply didn't understand what he or she was doing.

The Ruger rifles are immensely strong, which is a good thing in this case, I keep looking at that case head and can't help but be puzzled by its appearance.
 
Posts: 2656 | Location: Texas | Registered: June 20, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Non-Miscreant
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I think I'd want more information. Like who put together the loads. And I'd want the remaining loads from that batch. Taking each one apart and weighing the powder and at least one bullet.

Over the years we can probably identify many of the powders. Some are hard to tell apart. Another reason we want the rest of the batch is to make sure no one else gets them.


Unhappy ammo seeker
 
Posts: 15794 | Location: Kentucky, USA | Registered: February 25, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Knows too little
about too much
Picture of rduckwor
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quote:
Originally posted by Mars_Attacks:
That bolt looks like someone pounded on it with a chisel.


I'll bet some pounding was required to open that bolt.

RMD




TL Davis: “The Second Amendment is special, not because it protects guns, but because its violation signals a government with the intention to oppress its people…”
 
Posts: 18512 | Location: L.A. - Lower Alabama | Registered: April 06, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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The rear surfaces of the bolt lugs look peened, especially in the first picture of the bolt.
 
Posts: 3224 | Location: SWFL | Registered: October 10, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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77's are pretty tough actions.

Sobering reminder though


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Posts: 10350 | Location: Mid-Michigan | Registered: October 02, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Hop head
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send it to Ruger or a factory repair center,

and pull the rest of those cases



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Posts: 5941 | Location: Beach VA,not VA Beach | Registered: July 17, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Yeah, that M14 video guy...
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Thanks for the input and thoughts.

Anyone who follows me knows my area of expertise is simply M14's, Savages, and 308's. I won't claim to be something I'm not and I would not typically entertain the thought of even looking at this rifle. In this case. I spent a few days with this fellow out hunting a week ago. He brought the rifle along because my uncle told him that I would be able to give him direction on what to do.

I've never messed with belted magnums and I don't know how common it is to blow a case head. Before I posted this, I searched online and I could not find factory or aftermarket replacement bolts. My understanding is that bolt actions can handle higher pressures than my coveted M14's can. Given that assumption, I'm not quite ready to write the rifle off as unfixable

I have Ruger pistols and a 10/22 and I know they have quite a reputation for over-engineering their products. Last night I ran across a post on 24hour campfire and a member there said he had talked to the engineers at Ruger and they designed over-pressure gasses to be directed downwards into the magazine area and out the pressure relief hole on the right which is exactly what happened to this rifle.

I'll see if I can get a hold of the person who made the hand loads and get some more information. I'll also call Ruger tomorrow and see if they can help.

I have no idea how the case head got mangled so bad. I can't even make out the manufacturer on the headstamp.

Tony.


Owner, TonyBen, LLC, Type-01 FFL
www.tonybenm14.com (Site under construction).
e-mail: tonyben@tonybenm14.com
 
Posts: 2594 | Location: USA | Registered: February 13, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I have been loading since the '70's and have never experienced anything like what you have here but I have seen a few wrecked guns and have has some problem that never turned a gun into a wreck. It's not common to blow a case head even w/ belted magnums. But there are ways a guy can improve his chances at experiencing disaster, and improperly set loading dies, excessive loads, use of worn out or poorly manufactured cases are some of them.

This stuff happens for reasons and the reasons don't involve voodoo.

Right now I'm working with my old .375 H&H Magnum I bought before moving to Africa in the mid '80's and have hunted with here and there since. I have a batch of Remington brass that shows incipient head separations after a few reloads. I got a set of neck-size-only dies to address that. But it is an easy check with a wire pick to determine if the problem exists but if a guy doesn't know what to look for, the problem could manifest itself with a massive problem even with loads that are generating normal pressures. Firing a shot with a weak case and an excessive load could make real sparks fly. You could look at some of the guys other ammo and probably see the stretch line but even if you can't, you can pull the bullets and do a wire pick check to see if it's starting.

"Bolt actions" is a pretty broad term. The Garand action is very strong and certainly stronger than some bolt actions. Comparing the M14 action to the Ruger is sort of irrelevant since it isn't an M14 action you have in front of you that's damaged. By the way, Gen Julian Hatcher wrote of tests with the Garand and those actions withstood immense pressures.

I've seen blown primers, incipient case head cracks and near separations, sticky extraction and one Ruger M77 .264 Win Mag that because of some chambering anomaly {which seems to occur occasionally in .264's} excessive pressures with what should have been mild loads. This latter case is the closest thing I've ever seen to voodoo creeping in to gremlinize a rifle. Ruger actually rebarreled that rifle for free and it went on to shoot well without problems and I killed deer, coyote, elk and varmints with it. Years ago I worked at a gunshop where we sold upwards of 4,000 guns/year and did lots of business in used guns. I saw all sorts of pyrotechnic mayhem there.

Don't mess with that Ruger rifle.

Just ship the whole kit and kaboodle back to Ruger and beg for mercy.


**********************
"For certainly no legislation can be supposed more wholesome and necessary in the founding of a free, self-governing commonwealth, fit to take rank as one of the coordinate States of the Union, than that which seeks to establish it on the basis of the idea of the family, as consisting in and springing from the union for life of one man and one woman in the holy estate of matrimony"; United States Supreme Court Ruling, Murphy v. Ramsey 1885.
The hardest trail leads to the highest peak.
"A liberal is a person whose immediate interests are not at stake."
 
Posts: 4778 | Location: Idaho, USA | Registered: May 20, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Yeah, that M14 video guy...
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I just got off the phone with the rifle owner and he said he's got a whole box of the reloads. We'll meet this week so I can pull them and find out what his charge was as well as case make, weight, water capacity, headspace, etc...

Apparently, Ruger's policy is to not return, or destroy any rifle receiver that has an over pressure event. I let the owner know this.

More to come...

Tony.


Owner, TonyBen, LLC, Type-01 FFL
www.tonybenm14.com (Site under construction).
e-mail: tonyben@tonybenm14.com
 
Posts: 2594 | Location: USA | Registered: February 13, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of 3/4Flap
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quote:
Originally posted by benny6:
I just got off the phone with the rifle owner and he said he's got a whole box of the reloads. We'll meet this week so I can pull them and find out what his charge was as well as case make, weight, water capacity, headspace, etc...

Apparently, Ruger's policy is to not return, or destroy any rifle receiver that has an over pressure event. I let the owner know this.

More to come...

Tony.


It's easy to make a case pick from a paper clip. Give us some pix and find out everything you can about the ammo.

It could be a few problems wrapped into one as well. But most likely it's simple tho you will probably never know the truth of it!! LOL.

Can of the wrong powder left on the bench might do the trick.

I'd still ship the thing back to Ruger. They checked my .264 out, determined the action was sound, re-bolted it and rebarreled it and sent it back to me. Granted, I was having problems with Remington factory ammo, but still.

And truly. If the gun action is compromised, who wants it back anyhow? I'd tell them I wanted the stock back.


**********************
"For certainly no legislation can be supposed more wholesome and necessary in the founding of a free, self-governing commonwealth, fit to take rank as one of the coordinate States of the Union, than that which seeks to establish it on the basis of the idea of the family, as consisting in and springing from the union for life of one man and one woman in the holy estate of matrimony"; United States Supreme Court Ruling, Murphy v. Ramsey 1885.
The hardest trail leads to the highest peak.
"A liberal is a person whose immediate interests are not at stake."
 
Posts: 4778 | Location: Idaho, USA | Registered: May 20, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Yeah, that M14 video guy...
Picture of benny6
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by 3/4Flap:
quote:
Originally posted by benny6:
I just got off the phone with the rifle owner and he said he's got a whole box of the reloads. We'll meet this week so I can pull them and find out what his charge was as well as case make, weight, water capacity, headspace, etc...

Apparently, Ruger's policy is to not return, or destroy any rifle receiver that has an over pressure event. I let the owner know this.

More to come...

Tony.


It's easy to make a case pick from a paper clip. Give us some pix and find out everything you can about the ammo.

It could be a few problems wrapped into one as well. But most likely it's simple tho you will probably never know the truth of it!! LOL.

Can of the wrong powder left on the bench might do the trick.

I'd still ship the thing back to Ruger. They checked my .264 out, determined the action was sound, re-bolted it and rebarreled it and sent it back to me. Granted, I was having problems with Remington factory ammo, but still.

And truly. If the gun action is compromised, who wants it back anyhow? I'd tell them I wanted the stock back.


I agree 100%! It will go back to Ruger eventually. I'm sure they will appreciate having samples of the destructive ammo. I sent the owner a link to this thread so he can follow.

Tony.


Owner, TonyBen, LLC, Type-01 FFL
www.tonybenm14.com (Site under construction).
e-mail: tonyben@tonybenm14.com
 
Posts: 2594 | Location: USA | Registered: February 13, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Little ray
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I'd consider sending it to Ruger. If it is really ruined, no one wants it anyway so if they don't send it back, no harm.




The fish is mute, expressionless. The fish doesn't think because the fish knows everything.
 
Posts: 44253 | Location: Texas | Registered: February 10, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by 3/4Flap:
quote:
Originally posted by benny6:
I just got off the phone with the rifle owner and he said he's got a whole box of the reloads. We'll meet this week so I can pull them and find out what his charge was as well as case make, weight, water capacity, headspace, etc...

Apparently, Ruger's policy is to not return, or destroy any rifle receiver that has an over pressure event. I let the owner know this.

More to come...

Tony.


It's easy to make a case pick from a paper clip. Give us some pix and find out everything you can about the ammo.

It could be a few problems wrapped into one as well. But most likely it's simple tho you will probably never know the truth of it!! LOL.

Can of the wrong powder left on the bench might do the trick.

I'd still ship the thing back to Ruger. They checked my .264 out, determined the action was sound, re-bolted it and rebarreled it and sent it back to me. Granted, I was having problems with Remington factory ammo, but still.

And truly. If the gun action is compromised, who wants it back anyhow? I'd tell them I wanted the stock back.


This is not a case head separation issue. Your waterpick would have done nothing to prevent this. Something else occurred. Let's wait to see what an analysis of the unfired rounds reveals.
 
Posts: 2656 | Location: Texas | Registered: June 20, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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