At my agency I would say less than 10% carry a backup gun. Mostly J frames with a couple of random .380 autos. Couple of guys that keep a compact gun in their patrol bag but don't carry an on-body backup.
I've carried a 642 as a backup for almost 15 years. It would be weird not having it.
They were the “NY reload” back when NYPD used .38 wheel guns and didn’t allow speed loaders. Dump pouches were a nightmare in a gun fight so a second weapon made the most sense and lot of guys, and just about everybody working rough areas, carried either the S&W Chief Special or Colt Detective Special and went straight to that when the issue weapon was out.
|That rug really tied |
the room together.
I've worked at 2 departments, and the AVERAGE street cop is not a gun person, and in Florida, the AVERAGE street cop shoots 46 rounds a year to qualify. That's it. Most don't shoot more than to qualify once per year. Its a dismal statistic.
In my observations, less than 50% of street cops carry a backup gun. Probably as low as 25%.
I did show a lot of guys my j-frame 642 and did get quite a few to buy them. Many of the younger guys have never actually held and or shot a revolver, so when they see a j-frame, they instinctively think "geezer gun", but once they have it in their hand, and shoot it at the range, many come around and find it a good backup gun.
Often times a very small man can cast a very large shadow
I am curious to see where a backup gun could be carried with all the gear uniformed officers have on.
|Fighting the good fight|
My preference is the front left pocket, in a pocket holster. I started with a S&W 642, then a Kahr PM9. (Nowadays, if I still carried one, it'd be a Sig P365 in the same spot.)
There are a few other common areas too. Like various other pants pockets. Or inside the shirt on the body armor. Or on the ankle.
And some of the uniform shirts and outer armor vests nowadays have dedicated hidden BUG pockets.
Been on the job just over 28 years(at my second department for 6- retired from the first after 22) I have had a back up on my ankle from day 1. Was a PPK at first then went to a J frame which is what I still carry. Most of my coworkers don't carry a back up but quite a few do carry off duty. Young guys look at J frame like it's an antique but I can sometimes shoot it better than my G17 duty gun. I tried a G26 for back up and off duty for a while but went back to the J frame quick. I recently bought a G43 but for some reason I still always go for the J frame.
Me and most of our people who do carry a backup do so on support side in cargo pocket. If I have on my class A with no cargo I either carry in a hip pocket or desantis Apache ankle holster.
|Needs a check up |
from the neck up
I always loved it when a new cop would show up at an idpa match. All shined up in the brand new nylon duty rig. Ram rod tall and asking only a few questions on protocol. Then they get smoked like a 15 hour brisket by old dudes in crappy jeans and ragged vests. One after another after another after another. Like clubbing a baby seal. They never ever saw it coming.
The entire reason for the Second Amendment is not for hunting, it’s not for target shooting … it’s there so that you and I can protect our homes and our children and and our families and our lives. And it’s also there as fundamental check on government tyranny. Sen Ted Cruz
If I’m in uniform I have a backup in my outer carrier- a 220C that can share mags with my duty 220 if shit were to really hit the fan. I carry off duty every single day, usually a SC 9mm. Hell, if I’m laying on the couch with the beagles, I’m armed
"Live every day as if it's going to be your last, and one day, you'll be right.”
Mostly I was in a professional uniform and carried in the left front pocket or on the left ankle. I’m right handed and figured I’d be using my right to keep my gun in its holster. One of the few times I didn’t have a backup gun on me, I was attacked and had a PCP hopped up illegal grab my duty gun. Turned into a four and a half minute fight for my life....got two broken ribs and some more cracked for my troubles....after that I added a push knife behind my mag pouches on the left side of my duty belt.
Never had another assault on me that was deadly force related where I might have needed a backup.
I know of one guy who carried a AMT 380 backup in a spare handcuff case (with a flap) on his belt.
And the guy who hired me carried a 380 auto on his ankle. Several detectives ankle carried too.
"Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor.”
― Robert A. Heinlein, Starship Troopers
|Only the strong survive|
So how many guns did Josey Wales or John Mosby carry?? Four or more.
Do you chew tobacco??
|Age Quod Agis|
I'm not a cop and I carry a 229 and a pocket 938. Just got back from Massachusetts. Feel naked without them.
Sometimes the 229 is on the hip and sometimes it's in a Maxpedition versapack, but I always have 2.
"We may consent to be governed, but we will not be ruled." - Kevin D. Williamson, 2012
"All the citizens of this land are of right freemen; they owe no allegiance to any class and should recognize no task-masters. Under the chart of their liberties, under the law of high heaven, they are free and without shackles on their limbs nor mortgages upon the fruits of their brain or muscles; they bow down before no prince, potentate, or sovereign, nor kiss the royal robes of any crowned head; they render homage only to their God and should pay tribute only to their Government. Such at least is the spirit of our institutions, the character of our written national compact."
Charles Triplett O’Ferrall of Virginia - In Congress, May 1, 1888
While on duty, I carried a BUG = always a S&W snubby (different models over the years). My duty guns were a Beretta 92FC 9mm, SIG P226 9mm or a SIG P220 .45 ACP
My agency had around 125 officers, if I remember correctly around 1/2 carried BUGs.
Tomorrow's battle is won during today's practice.
Everyone on patrol carried a second. I carried a model 36 in a ankle holster.
We were required to qualify monthly so that gave us some minor level of proficiency but still cops aren’t known for being gun proficient..
1st, your results here are going to be somewhat inaccurate. Remember, this is a gun forum, and everyone here are gun enthusiasts.
2nd, not all cops are gun enthusiasts. Some of my coworkers just look at a gun as a tool. Like a carpenter would a hammer. Not every cop is or even wants to be SWAT or a gunfighter.
- I have witnessed some weird and strange shit when it comes to some of my coworkers. Some haven't cleaned their guns in YEARS. Some don't carry one in the chamber. In that subgroup, some knowingly, some out of stupidity. Some that qualify an EASY course of fire by one or two points. Some fail. There's also some that I wouldn't trust with anything more dangerous than a fish, but carry a loaded weapon. Some just flat-out have no clue what they're doing.
(Years ago, I posted on here about one of my rocket surgeons who used "The red stuff" to lubricate his AR... Turns out it was red loc-tite.)
My department, we qualify once a year for primary weapon- 50 round course, and again for secondary or back-up- 30 round course. And they are EASY course of fire with lots of time.
My primary is a G-21. I have about 6 others that are my secondary. P-226, P-220, G-19, G-17, Ruger LCP, S&W 340PD, and a few more. So I have to qualify with each of those once a year.
Then comes the AR. Those on the job qualify twice a year with that. There's some who can't pass that qualification. (Another EASY course of fire)
Then about once a year we'll get additional training. Low light/flash light, some faster qualifying times.
Me? I try to sign up for as much weapons training I can. Get paid to play on the range, and shoot company ammo? Sign me up!!!
Me- I don't leave home without one. You catch me outside, I got a gun on me.
Some of my coworkers, not so much. Some leave the gun in the locker at work, and that's where it stays until they work the next day.
Work wise, Depending on what I'm doing- I have the G-21 on me and the AR in the car. The days I was actually out hunting, I had a G-30 as back up. Wintertime, I'll occasionally toss my 340PD in my pocket. Knife in my pocket, back up knife in my vest.
I also shoot as much as I can. This past Friday, I ran through at least 400 of 9mm, probably 100 of 45, 400 of 5.56, and a few hundred of .22 out at a friends farm. I'm at the farm about 3 to 4 times a year. I also try to hit the department range about once a month. Some of my coworkers think I'm nuts, but they probably golf, and I think wacking a lil ball as far as you can, then chasing after it with some loud pants on is the dumbest thing one can do. I also will hit a class from a good instructor about every 2 or 3 years.
"When its time to shoot, shoot. Dont talk!"
“What the government is good at is collecting taxes, taking away your freedoms and killing people. It’s not good at much else.” —Author Tom Clancy
BUG when working...........always carrying off-duty unless I'm running or riding my mountain bike.
"The Marines I have seen around the world have, the cleanest bodies, the filthiest minds, the highest morale, and the lowest morals of any group of animals I have ever seen. Thank God for the United States Marine Corps." Eleanor Roosevelt, 1945
I have a friend who is a CPD detective, she always carry off duty. I think she carried an LCP as backup before becoming a detective.
|posting without pants|
Well... since my bendable is a bit rusty (kidding my friend)
I'll start with your question. I carry a backup on my 100 percent of the time when in uniform and on duty.
Off duty or plain clothes, depends on the assignments. (I'm referring to a backup gun, as in the past 10 years, I cannot think of a single minute where I did not have a gun on my person, unless I was literally in a swimming pool or lake, in which case it was in the boat or somewhere close.
That said, you are correct. Officers at my dept are required to qualify (and it is a whole range day) twice a year. The officers who dislike shooting (who are usually the ones who also suck at it) ONLY shoot during these times, unless forced to.
The good shooters, like to shoot, and do so on their own time, and take the dept up on their 100 free rounds per month. The ones who are scared of the gun, or don't like to shoot, don't. ANd their scores show it.
Strive to live your life so when you wake up in the morning and your feet hit the floor, the devil says "Oh crap, he's up."
|Sigforum K9 handler|
If I have pants on, I have a gun. Usually nothing smaller than a G19.
When I was in uniformed services, I carried a BUG. M&P compact 9mm on inside left ankle. I carry a Gen5 G19 with a reload at work these days. Have a spare Gen5 G17 with an x300 locked up in the car. Along with a rifle.
"Make it a shooting, and not a gunfight" LSP552 02/19/2011
My agency would not allow a BUG. It was verboten.
La Dolce Vita
|Powered by Social Strata||Page 1 2 3 4|