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Picture of bobtheelf
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You are way too invested in this.

It's silly to think that something demonstrated to happen in one firearm could not or does not happen in another. All I've said that is opinion is that for some people that may be acceptable in trade for the lower cost of ammunition, and for others unacceptable.
 
Posts: 3261 | Location: Nashville | Registered: July 23, 2012Report This Post
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If you can’t see the difference here, the you are completely correct that we won’t see things the same. So one last time for you I will rephrase. AR’s demonstrate issues with steel cased ammo. It’s been documented photographed experienced first hand by many. Most advocate if you shoot steel in an AR make sure you clean the chamber well for @ny serious use.

Now on to handguns. Totally different animal. You don’t find documented cases of guns or parts failing due to steel cased ammo. You just don’t. 4 pages here and nobody can even provide a first hand experience of failure yet you guys are just positive. Funny thing is, the more positive you are the less likely you’ve even shot much if any. So you just believe it 8n your heart so it must be true. You guys have a hypothesis but you stopped there.

I could give a shit what you shoot or what you believe. What I do care about is soouting bullshit that many then pass along as fact. If you can’t support it with data is just an opinion. One that isn’t supported by any data. Or the experiences of the multitudes of guts on this board who shoot it a ton. Yet somehow you clowns who don’t shoot it are spewing out absolutes like you actually know what you are talking about. You literally read someone say it’s bad and you are repeating it. How fucking dumb is that.

I like truth. Not your truth or my truth nonsense but real truth. Facts. Repeatable experiments.

Simple. Don’t claim something as fact that you can’t support with any actual proof. If you guys ever present science, fact, reality, to back up your opinions I will change my stance. Your opinions stated as facts are just silly. It is that simple.

I’m not overly invested. I’ve got plenty of t8me on my hands right now and you are presenting your opinion as a fact. Without anything to back it up. Like I’ve said half a dozen times in this thread. Shoot whatever you want but if you say an opinion and state it as a fact that dumb. It’s childish. It’s beneath all of us. I have lots of opinions. If I start stating my opinion is now fact and can’t even begin to back it up with evidence, feel free to jump my case.

Stop spreading internet fable as facts. It’s your opinion until you can prove it. Which should be easy. American’s literally shoot over a billion steel cased ammo rounds a year. If the data exists, it out there.
 
Posts: 2834 | Registered: June 18, 2005Report This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by bobtheelf:
You are way too invested in this.

It's silly to think that something demonstrated to happen in one firearm could not or does not happen in another. All I've said that is opinion is that for some people that may be acceptable in trade for the lower cost of ammunition, and for others unacceptable.


It's pointless. You can't reason with an illogical person who is so confirmation biased on a topic. It's the sheer definition of insanity.
 
Posts: 19844 | Registered: June 12, 2005Report This Post
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Picture of bobtheelf
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You're arguing about things I have not said.

I've said that it will wear some guns, and it's silly to believe that there would be no difference at all in other guns. I have said that some people are ok with that for the price difference, and some are not.

The last I'll say is that for someone dedicated to the truth, you should understand that absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
 
Posts: 3261 | Location: Nashville | Registered: July 23, 2012Report This Post
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Picture of jljones
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He’s not the only one that needs to give it a rest. This thread would be 1.5 pages long if about three people weren’t posting “yes it is/no it’s not”.

Calling out one dude for being “pointless” is probably by definition pointless.




www.opspectraining.com

"Make it a shooting, and not a gunfight" LSP552 02/19/2011



 
Posts: 34152 | Location: Logical | Registered: September 12, 2004Report This Post
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Picture of RichardC
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quote:
Originally posted by pedropcola:

Any simple search reveals this. I just checked SGAmmo.



Good Lord.

I was gonna try some steel cased ammo.

Today, nothing 9 MM is in stock except expensive shotshells.


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Posts: 11524 | Location: Florida | Registered: June 23, 2003Report This Post
Go ahead punk, make my day
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This thread is like kids playing with pop guns...

"I shot you!!"

"No, but I shot you FIRST"

"NOOOOO, I shot YOU First"

"NOOOOOOOOOO, I SHOT YOU 1st!!!!!"

"NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO....... Your STOOOPID"

"NOOOOO, YOU ARE!!!!!!!
 
Posts: 45631 | Registered: July 12, 2008Report This Post
Go ahead punk, make my day
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quote:
Originally posted by RichardC:
Today, nothing 9 MM is in stock except expensive shotshells.
Today? You mean the last month or two.

Only thing still 'sorta' reasonable and available is 38SPL FMJs.
 
Posts: 45631 | Registered: July 12, 2008Report This Post
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Picture of jljones
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Even .40 is back in style. Cool




www.opspectraining.com

"Make it a shooting, and not a gunfight" LSP552 02/19/2011



 
Posts: 34152 | Location: Logical | Registered: September 12, 2004Report This Post
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Picture of Oat_Action_Man
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quote:
Originally posted by RichardC:
quote:
Originally posted by pedropcola:

Any simple search reveals this. I just checked SGAmmo.



Good Lord.

I was gonna try some steel cased ammo.

Today, nothing 9 MM is in stock except expensive shotshells.


Nothing is in stock. Full stop.

A guy can barely find a folding rear sight online or on local shelves these days.

It's like a truly Biblical plague of locusts hit everything gun related. Roll Eyes


----------------------------

Chuck Norris put the laughter in "manslaughter"

Educating the youth of America, one declension at a time.
 
Posts: 18700 | Location: SE PA | Registered: January 12, 2001Report This Post
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Picture of RichardC
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quote:
Originally posted by RHINOWSO:
quote:
Originally posted by RichardC:
Today, nothing 9 MM is in stock except expensive shotshells.
Today? You mean the last month or two.

Only thing still 'sorta' reasonable and available is 38SPL FMJs.


RHINO, I've gotten at least three emails from them in June, with listings of 9MM. I bet they sold out instantly, probably guys checking emails at 3 a.m.

Not to argue, just to point out that I haven't tried to order 9MM from them for a good while.



Even some steel cased from Barnaul, on June 26th:


"1440 Round Spam Can - 9mm Luger 115 grain FMJ Lacquered Steel case Wolf Ammo - Made in Russia by Barnaul
$360.00 + $25.00 Shipping
If you get an 'access denied' when you click the link it has already sold out.
A stock photo is used in this listing, this ammo comes in the same sort of cans but the one case I opened had stenciling on the can so they look just slightly different than pictured. I never had a chance to take pictures and this item is a 1-time deal on some ammo the factory had made a while back and was collecting dust, they wanted to move it and that is how we ended up with. This might sell out fast. "


Yep, bet it sold out real fast!

I haven't used steel pistol ammo, but after reading this thread, I thought maybe I'd try shooting a bunch without cleaning to see if brass cased ammo following would stick in the chamber due to carbon rings.

I know that after shooting LOTS of dirty-powder cowboy .38 Specials in my revolvers, .357 magnum rounds can be hard to eject.


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Posts: 11524 | Location: Florida | Registered: June 23, 2003Report This Post
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I’ll stop I promise. I’m bored and tired of guys claiming shit that theyread on the internet and regurgitating it as fact. They don’t even shoot it but are soooooo convinced it’ll break something.

And no bob not posting evidence doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist but for fucks sake with the millions if not billions of rounds shot you would certainly think you could find a fucking trend? Right bob?
 
Posts: 2834 | Registered: June 18, 2005Report This Post
Go ahead punk, make my day
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No worries Richard, I was just making the point that shit has been really sideways for the last 2 months. Yes, things have been in / out of stock but it's nothing like it was 4+ months ago when you could order from any one of 5+ ammo vendors and the deciding factor was how cheap you could get it.
 
Posts: 45631 | Registered: July 12, 2008Report This Post
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Richard, I am an admitted NON cleaner. I rarely clean any of my guns on a regular basis with exception of rimfires and revolvers which tend to start not working as well.

My match guns rotate between 2 Glocks, a 320, and a P10C. I rarely clean them. I lube regularly and sometimes wipe down with a rag. That is it. The fouled chamber stuff has more to do with AR shooting. It won't affect your pistol at all. In normal times, Tula steel is 6 bucks and change per box if you buy by the case. Its inexpensive range ammo and it won't break anything or leave lacquer anywhere, not in a pistol. Apparently you don't want to dip it in seawater though. lol
 
Posts: 2834 | Registered: June 18, 2005Report This Post
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Picture of bobtheelf
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quote:
Originally posted by pedropcola:
I’ll stop I promise. I’m bored and tired of guys claiming shit that theyread on the internet and regurgitating it as fact. They don’t even shoot it but are soooooo convinced it’ll break something.

And no bob not posting evidence doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist but for fucks sake with the millions if not billions of rounds shot you would certainly think you could find a fucking trend? Right bob?


Please, please tell me what I've read on the internet and regurgitated as fact.

Quote it for me.

Go ahead.
 
Posts: 3261 | Location: Nashville | Registered: July 23, 2012Report This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by jljones:
Even .40 is back in style. Cool


I have only 1 .40, a BHP. During the last ammo shortage, it was the ONLY ammunition I regularly found on shelves and was thankful I owned it!!!!
 
Posts: 19844 | Registered: June 12, 2005Report This Post
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I promised I’d stop so this is last one. Bob you aren’t the only guy posting. Read this thread. Just read it. All kinds of claims of damage, it’ll hurt my thousand dollar gun, extractors will break, blah , blah ,blah. If you didn’t claim steel cased ammo would break parts then I apologize. You sure sounded like you did, but perhaps I confused you with all the blow hards who think it damages handguns but can’t actually say how they know. If you weren’t implying that it hurt the gun, I take it all back. Feel better now?
 
Posts: 2834 | Registered: June 18, 2005Report This Post
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Picture of bobtheelf
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No, you made specific accusations that I was just regurgitating stuff I read on the internet.

If you never read a damn thing I wrote and just made assumptions, then come out and admit that.

If you did read it, then please quote where I said what you claim, not some mealy-mouthed "if you didn't then I'm sorry".
 
Posts: 3261 | Location: Nashville | Registered: July 23, 2012Report This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by bobtheelf:
quote:
Originally posted by pedropcola:
Bob we are talking about handguns. That video you referred to was also a basic ammo dump. They didn’t run those rifles hard, they ran them hard and ugly. It was a mag dump after mag dump. Rifles got crazy hot and they just put on gloves and went on. So it is reasonable to say if you run them in that manner, which short of a firefight with unlimited ammo and continual rapid fire you would wear out parts. Ran in more normal usage the results might vary.

Also, the reason we are talking about handguns is that steel cased ammo in rifles is easier to document adverse results. Stuck cases, fouled chambers, etc.

In handguns you don’t see these results.

Arguably as well, in rifles, the broken extractors are due to sticky extraction causing extra stress on the part, not steel wearing on steel causing the extractor to break.


I made no claims about the reasons why the extra wear happened, merely that it did. I don't care why an extractor breaks more often shooting steel ammo, whether it's the hardness of the steel or the extra fouling. That doesn't matter.

Results might vary with different usage. The point is, with steel cased ammo it is possible, if not necessarily likely, to see increased wear in certain areas. The difference in cost of the ammo might make that acceptable to some, while with others it might not.


Ok bob, I’ll play. There’s the post. Quoted and everything. You brought up the Lucky Gunner AR torture test. I quite correctly pointed out that the test of steel cased ammo in AR15’s was irrelevant to steel cased ammo use in handguns. You ignored all that. “Doesn’t matter, if it happens in rifles it can happen in handguns”. Paraphrasing your dumbass response. Even though I said issues in AR15’s are documented, issues in handguns aren’t. It’s that simple. Very clearly you stated the issues occur across both platforms. More correctly you hedged your bullsjit with the word “possibly”. Typical lame ass response when you don’t know dick about what you are saying. “Possibly” you were dropped on your head as a baby, see how that hedging stuff works?

Either way you get the last word because this thread has run its course. I can’t disprove a negative and you guys seem unable to find anything to back up damage claims in handguns. So here’s to you bob, make it a good one ‘cause I’m out.
 
Posts: 2834 | Registered: June 18, 2005Report This Post
Go ahead punk, make my day
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Geez it never ends....

 
Posts: 45631 | Registered: July 12, 2008Report This Post
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