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Brand new to this forum but not to Sig. I carry a 1988 West German P226 and if I could replace it with anything available today it would be a P226 Legion. I did replace it with a Sig 1911 for about a year for the better trigger and grip. But after recently adding a Grayguns ELS, new Hogue G10's, and Trijicon HD XR sights, the P226 is again my favorite carry gun.

But why, you ask, would anyone carry an antiquated DA/SA with all these striker fired guns on the market? First, I have 30+ years of shooting a SA/DA, specifically the P226, and carried one both on duty and off. I mastered the DA to SA trigger years before many of the guys at my range were born and can quickly and consistently make every round count. I can say that with even more confidence with the Grayguns ELS addition.

Second, I like the safety. A striker fired gun is certainly safe enough in a hard belt holster, such as carried by law enforcement or military. But once you go to holster that is close to the body as used for CCW, you now have the chances of clothing or the holster itself getting caught up in your trigger, especially if you are reholstering after a stressful real life experience. There is a reason for the term "Glock leg" though maybe it should be a more generic "striker leg". But with a SA/DA, I can put my thumb between the hammer and the beaver tail while reholstering to ensure I don't blow a hole in my femoral artery. I have not had it happen to me, but I hear it sucks.

If you like P320's, Glocks, or XDM's then that is what you should carry. Heck, if you prefer a Hi-Point carry that. (Though we WILL laugh at you behind your back and judge you, because that's what gun guys do.) But there are many who like the SA/DA and I think there are enough of us to keep them viable on the market for years to come.


So this is how liberty dies... with thunderous applause. (A comment on our COVID response)
 
Posts: 16 | Location: Governor Smek's Buckeye State | Registered: April 10, 2020Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Wait, what?
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Although my agency is switching over to P320’s, we still had the option to carry our old classics. I go back and forth between my issue 220R and personal 226 9mm. Which I’ll do for the next 2 years until retirement.




"Live every day as if it's going to be your last, and one day, you'll be right.”
Malachy McCourt
 
Posts: 11981 | Location: Martinsburg WV | Registered: April 02, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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At the same time I picked up my #4 P239 yesterday I also picked up a Taurus Striker fired poly pistol... the engineering of that thing and how to break it down to clean was done by some NASA scientist with too much timer on their hands.... I guess I've been spoiled by the Sig P series pistols.... rack and lock the slide turn the take down lever and release the slide.... it don't get any simpler than that.

With the Taurus there is a 'secret' grip with one hand then you have to push two little release tabs one on each side of the frame... release the slide and pull the trigger ..... and the real frustrating part is the owners manual does not tell you there are two release tabs or that you have to pull the trigger.
 
Posts: 1723 | Location: Greenville, SC | Registered: January 30, 2017Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by RichardC:
No, no, they're not dead!

They're restin' ...



What you did there, sir, was seen Wink




Frank

Dogs are gifts from God, full of love. Save a life, adopt!

…and God made dogs, and it was very good, and God said: “I’m gonna have to have all of these back.” Genesis 1, gospel according to Mr. Monkey ✡

NRA Benefactor Frown (Go away, Wayne!!! )

私のホバークラフトは鰻でいっぱいです!
 
Posts: 3947 | Location: too near debt-riot, mitch-e-gan | Registered: June 06, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by 07AMF:
I still favor them. I’m also one of the few that like the DAK trigger. I also prefer iron sights and manual transmissions...



We could be twins.


Might need DNA tests...



Big Grin




Frank

Dogs are gifts from God, full of love. Save a life, adopt!

…and God made dogs, and it was very good, and God said: “I’m gonna have to have all of these back.” Genesis 1, gospel according to Mr. Monkey ✡

NRA Benefactor Frown (Go away, Wayne!!! )

私のホバークラフトは鰻でいっぱいです!
 
Posts: 3947 | Location: too near debt-riot, mitch-e-gan | Registered: June 06, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I think i only have Classic P series. I have
6 P220s all older than 1996
A P220 Elite SAO 10mm.
A P229 AES 2018,
A P6 1984
Two (2) 2 P239s from 2013/2014.
A P210 Target new this year.

Are the newer elite and Legions not considered Classics? Is there a year that delineates them?

I like the older dolphin nose, sheet metal slides from W Germany best.


West German Sig P220, P6, P226, BDA
 
Posts: 69 | Location: NE Ohio Willoughby | Registered: December 13, 2018Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Carry a P365, but the West German P226 from 1994 is my favorite.


 
Posts: 13 | Registered: January 18, 2020Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by iron chef:
IMHO, one of major reasons why P-Classics are waning in popularity is due to loss of marketshare to CZ. When it comes to all-metal DA/SA pistols, there major players are: Sig, Beretta, CZ, and who else?

For whatever the reasons, the CZ 75 platform is considered the 'in' thing. It helps that they sell a gun of similar (if not comparable) quality to a Sig at 2/3rds the price. The aftermarket support from companies such as CGW makes them popular w/ shooters who like to mod their guns.

I never understood how it developed the reputation, but I often hear CZ as the brand of choice of hipster gun owners.


I enjoy my CZs a lot but they wouldn’t replace my SIGs entirely. I carry my 75 matte stainless often. It’s usually my choice for the motorcycle or when I don’t care about concealment. It’s stock except for a pin and trigger return spring from CGW. The stock spring broke. My P-01 has a Pro Package from CGW. I should carry it but honestly its trigger is almost too light for my taste. Maybe they’re not but the CZs seem to be more complicated internally than SIGs. In a SHTF situation I’d probably grab a SIG. I don’t think I’ve had a failure or malfunction from any of my SIGs. I think my new P220ST might see a lot of carry where I was using the CZ.







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Posts: 1523 | Location: Colorado | Registered: December 09, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Maybe The best of the Sig P line will be resurrected from time to time . This is what S&W did with their "Classic line of Revolvers".

I am not going to hold my breath for the company to do this any time soon.

Time marches on... and corporations only go torward and up the dollar road,


Never judge a man, till you have walked a mile in his shoes.....
That way, you'll be a mile away from him; and you'll have his shoes.
 
Posts: 148 | Location: So. of 3 Rivers < Penna. VIGILANT CURMUDGEON | Registered: April 12, 2014Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Yeah, that M14 video guy...
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Well, I didn't have a group pic of my classic P-series collection, so I decided to get a group photo. I didn't have any pics of my P226 Combat that I won from Q. I would like to add a standard P220 to the lineup.
Top: P220 Sport from 2004 and a P228 from 1999
Bottom: P226 Combat from 2012 and a P226 from 1990



My EDC is a P365 two-tone, but I recently got an IWB holster for the P228, so I'd like to start carrying the P228 when possible. I won't be buying any new classic P-series Sigs except a P220 Legion 10mm and I'd only consider buying another classic P-series if I had cash in hand and I found a P226 Sport, P226 stainless or a P220 stainless.

Most shooters aren't gun knowledgeable and they don't see the value of a classic P-series Sig. Most prospective pistol buyers aren't going to spend the extra cash for a classic Sig when they can get a polymer framed P320 or a P365, or a Glock.

Tony.


Owner, TonyBen, LLC, Type-01 FFL
www.tonybenm14.com (Site under construction).
e-mail: tonyben@tonybenm14.com
 
Posts: 3851 | Location: USA | Registered: February 13, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by DirectDrive:
Show me a P226 Race Gun.
I've never seen one, but maybe they could do something with the LDC ?

You mean the Sig X5? Frankly, Sig was doing factory race guns two decades before it was cool. The major problem is they they’ve been designed almost exclusively for the European market. They’ve never done an X5 that meets IDPA ESP specs, for example.


quote:
Originally posted by iron chef:
IMHO, one of major reasons why P-Classics are waning in popularity is due to loss of marketshare to CZ. When it comes to all-metal DA/SA pistols, there major players are: Sig, Beretta, CZ, and who else?

For whatever the reasons, the CZ 75 platform is considered the 'in' thing. It helps that they sell a gun of similar (if not comparable) quality to a Sig at 2/3rds the price. The aftermarket support from companies such as CGW makes them popular w/ shooters who like to mod their guns.

I never understood how it developed the reputation, but I often hear CZ as the brand of choice of hipster gun owners.

It is interesting how CZ has captured that market share. But, don’t conflate the 75B with the popularity of the Shadow. A standard P series Sig at $900 is a much better value than a $700 75B. However, the popularity of the CZ is entirely in their Shadow line, which is competitive in price and performance with the Legion and X5. The biggest problem for Sig is that the X5s weren’t made for the US, and now they are unobtanium. The Legions, meanwhile, are designed for “duty” more than competition.

Sig has been teasing a US made X5 for a while now. They may be significantly behind the Shadows in market share now that they might not be able to catch up. On the other hand, if they can pull off an X5A like they did the P210A, that would be fun to watch.
 
Posts: 756 | Location: Volunteer | Registered: January 16, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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For institutional use ? Yes the classic SIGs and other metal frame DA/SA guns are dead due to cost. Even organizations which want DA/SA can’t justify the the cost of metal frame service pistols with guns like the SP2022, PX4 and HK USP, p30 and P2000 available.

DA/SA takes a little more training to get similar results to a striker gun but training time in institutions is always limited. Ironically, if you understand DA/SA (i.e. it’s really only one trigger pull since they break in the same place) the real training hurdle is making decocking reflexive when done shooting.

The other thing going against the classic SIGs is parts availability for the folded slide models. Unfortunately SIG’s reputation for supporting discontinued models is justifiably poor.

Cost is also a factor for individual users but the guns themselves are perfectly viable in terms of performance.
 
Posts: 418 | Location: Texas | Registered: March 25, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by HCM:
...the real training hurdle is making decocking reflexive when done shooting.



DAK! DAK! DAK!

Smile


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Posts: 11541 | Location: Florida | Registered: June 23, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Sorry guys, if you want an answer to this look no further than the situation at S&W with their gen 3 semi auto pistols. They were fantastic guns. But, in the same period of production time, you can stamp out 5 plastic striker pistols and using less expensive materials. In fairness i guessed at the 5 number, but the point is the ratio. Way more and way less expensive to produce the plastic. I will even go out on a limb and say if they could make an all plastic revolver their current revolver line would go the way of the dinosaur.
The gen 3's are so far gone, Smith will not even support them with parts and mags anymore. I know this because I have passed on some really nice used gen 3 deals because a call to Smith revealed they don't have mags or parts at least according to the guy in the phone.
Sig will be no different if they want to continue profitable. Love the classic sigs, but they are merely symbols of a bygone era at this point.
 
Posts: 376 | Registered: August 09, 2014Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I'll take a 'P' any day of the week:

 
Posts: 1723 | Location: Greenville, SC | Registered: January 30, 2017Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Above comments on institutional use are correct. There are several departments around here that issue or permit carry of a personal P22x, though they are dwindling. One of the largest law enforcement organizations in the country to issue P226's is the Ohio State Highway Patrol. Last year they announced they are moving from P226 DAK's to P320's for which the state is paying all of $390/each.

So, yes, cost is a definite factor. Training is another. Some law enforcement organizations are really good at training, others do the very bare minimum required by their regulatory commission. Either way it is expensive. And training a shooter, particularly a new shooter, is easier on a striker fired gun.

Does this mean the end of the DA/SA? Absolutely not! Just look at the number of manufactures turning out 1911's. Or Colt's reintroduction of the DA revolver. As long as there is customer demand, manufactures will continue to make them. That goes for the SA/DA semi auto, as well. Demand for the DA/SA semi-auto will continue as there are many who prefer them over plastic striker-fired pistols. A quick search at the Lucky Gunner Blog will turn up articles on SA/DA that explain the continued interest better than I can.


So this is how liberty dies... with thunderous applause. (A comment on our COVID response)
 
Posts: 16 | Location: Governor Smek's Buckeye State | Registered: April 10, 2020Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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It had to be done ..........

 
Posts: 391 | Registered: December 07, 2016Reply With QuoteReport This Post
A day late, and
a dollar short
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I only have three "classic" Sigs, a 226 JK, P239, and a P220 German, I only carry my P365 at the present time.


____________________________
NRA Life Member, GOA, MGO Annual Member, Annual member MRPA
 
Posts: 12583 | Location: Michigan | Registered: July 10, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by RichardC:
quote:
Originally posted by HCM:
...the real training hurdle is making decocking reflexive when done shooting.



DAK! DAK! DAK!

Smile


Yeah! Smile

But although anyone who has seen my comments about DAK pistols knows that I am a fan to this day, I never considered the decocking issue to be a significant one when training shooters on the Classic line guns. It was something that I had to be very vigilant about at the beginning: “Decock! Decock!” but trainees always become conditioned quickly. During all the years I taught DA/SA P220s as the agency’s required duty weapon, I remember only a couple of times when an experienced shooter started to holster without decocking first. That never made me a fan of the DA/SA system, but I couldn’t object to it on that basis.




“The fundamental cause of trouble in the world today is that the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt.”
— Bertrand Russell
 
Posts: 42101 | Location: 10,150 Feet Above Sea Level in Colorado | Registered: April 04, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
E tan e epi tas
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Christ I can’t holster a Glock without decocking it first. Smile


"Guns are tools. The only weapon ever created was man."
 
Posts: 5065 | Location: On the water | Registered: July 25, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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