Co-worker purchased a CZ Scorpion in FDE and threw on a SB Tactical brace and a low-end Holosun optic. I like it. Very much. So much so, that I almost picked one up for myself yesterday after training.
But, I took a deep breath, and said to myself, "Ask the SIG Forum first." Especially as I began to wonder what role a PCC would have for me.
In concert with this odd drive for a CZ Scorpion, I came across the idea of buying a suppressor for it. I've long dismissed the thought of purchasing a suppressor, mostly out of ignorance for the process and an aversion to the cost, but then I got thinking about a suppressed CZ Micro.
But then I thought about just getting a suppressor and running it on a pistol. And then I thought, "I should probably start a Trust first."
So my question is...is a PCC just a "fun" gun, or is it a worthwhile suppressor host and then a good idea for home defense purposes, or should I just get a suppressor, skip the PCC route, and just run it on something like my P320?
I have rifles, I have pistols, I'm tempted to grab another revolver (don't need one, though), but the hole in my firearm experience seems to be the PCC realm, and the suppressed realm, so I'm hoping for words of wisdom from those who have gone there before.
Thanks in advance.
tempus edax rerum
|"The deals you miss don’t hurt you”-B.D. Raney Sr.|
I have an ATI/New Frontier Armory pistol in 9MM.
I use it at a local pro steel range with a suppressor. It is an absolute hoot! I don’t even get a time because the timer won’t pick it up, but I don’t care. It is so much fun.
But I have other stuff for home/self defense. Could the PCC be pressed into service if need be? Sure. But I have those bases covered already.
I have looked at the scorpions, but I’m pretty heavily invested in the AR stuff and Glock mags. So I can’t speak to that particular firearm. But PCC stuff in general? Have fun with it.
BTW: my last purchase was a revolver, and I’ve been carrying it lately. Let’s not get into “need” on any of this stuff, ok?
I started with the MPX carbine,
Then I picked up a Kriss Vector in 40sw,
Then I picked up a B&T GHM 45 pistol
Then I picked up a Foxtrot mike M9.
Then I picked up a PTR 9kT.
I then Turned the MPX Carbine, The Vector Carbine into SBR's, Then THe GHM into SBR, The 9kt into a SBR, Sold the FM9.
If I was to look at anything now, I would look at the HK SP5 in 9mm, GHM/APC in 9mm, LWRC in 45acp in that order.
They are fun to shoot, and the ammo is cheap.
I have a Scorpion Evo pistol and a Dead Air Odessa 9. Works like a dream, and cost less than most competitors.
I work for a Class III dealer. Trusts take MUCH longer to clear ATF that individual tax stamps. Why do you want a trust? They have few advantages.
If you want the Scorpion, get it. Don't be shy about the suppressor, it's well worth it.
They are a lot of fun.
I have a Quarter Circle 10 in Colt pattern.
Mags are cheap. Love them straight mags like Sgt. Saunders had.
The Colt 9mm mag is actually a modified UZI mag.
The two common "pattern" AR9's are Colt pattern and Glock pattern.
And when you get good, you can kill tanks with these things.
|Man of few words|
I had a Scorpion and loved it but bought a Kel Tech Sub 2000 and just found myself shooting the Kel Tec and leaving the Scorpion in my safe; so I traded the Scorpion.
I also have 2 H&K USC's that have been converted to UMP's. I'm saving up money to have my 2nd one SBR'd and a suppressor put on it.
I'm a big fan of pistol caliber carbines and find myself shooting them way more than my high powered rifles.
I purchased a Ruger PC carbine for $620. I sprung for the Davidson exclusive that had FDE cerakote on the metal parts otherwise I could have had the base model for about $75 less. I also bought a new G4 G17 that day too total was about $1050 out the door.
I promptly installed the G17 magwell when I got home. I got one range session in before Covid shut down my range. I enjoyed it, and it was reliable. I only shot it at 25 yards with iron sights and uncorrected 46 year-old eyes that need glasses for distance vision. That said the entire G17 mag hit straight and achieved a reasonably small group. An optic or my getting glasses would no doubt improve things.
What I am saying is the CZ Scorpion is a nice looking rifle and the ones I handled seemed to shoulder nice. It seemed to me a higher quality rifle vs. the Ruger Carbine, but not immeasurably so. The CZ also run close to or just over $1000 alone and will require their own dedicated mags. If I were a bit wealthier I would probably have one. However for me, my interest in a Pistol caliber carbine is $500-700 level interested, not $1000 plus level interested.
The big question you have to ask yourself, what is your level of interest in a pistol caliber carbine? Is it enough to justify the added expense and dedicated mags ?
|Failing to prepare is |
preparing to fail.
The CZ micro is a hoot and extremely accurate. It is my go to house gun, feeds everything and cheap magazines.
"Don't mistake activity for achievement." John Wooden, "Wooden on Leadership"
|I run trains!|
Personally, a suppressed PCC is way more fun than a suppressed pistol.
Scorpions are great for the price, lots of alternatives that will take the price higher, many for a much higher quality firearm. My Scorpion will never be more than a range toy so it scratches the itch for me just fine.
I enjoy the benefits of my trust for my NFA items. Wife and family/best friend can access them if need be without me being there, as well as allowing kids access once they’re of age.
Success always occurs in private, and failure in full view.
|I got a Million of 'em!|
Succinct but true. I’ve had two “MP5s”, an MPX and now a CMMG Guard.
|Res ipsa loquitur|
I have a properly 922r and SBR taxed Scorpion and a Cx4 Storm. Very fun and reliable guns to shoot. I wouldn't hesitate to get one. I'm currently saving to buy a binary trigger for my CZ.
Maybe DSgrouse has the disease more than me, but probably not. I love these PCC guns and have a pretty big collection. What's not to love. Simple, effective, a zillion varieties, ammo is cheap, fun to shoot, quiet if suppressed. Easy to be effective since you can shoulder them and yet keep the lengths reasonable. I have never had a single person that shot any of mine say anything negative. And mostly you can use them for anything. Pick your budget and there is literally a choice for you. If you want to talk which ones we had a good thread about that recently. The CZ is a great choice. But so are about a zillion other options. In this case I don't happen to agree with DSgrouse on a go forward plan as I happen to think the best of the available options is a glock lower AR. But I honestly can't think of a bad gun in this space.
“So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.”
PCC's are crazy fun and I'd recommend everyone own one. Along with crazy fun there's a crazy amount of choice too. Most are straight blowback designs and for not too much more you can buy into better options that use more advanced designs that aren't straight blowback. If I were to suggest a PCC to a friend, relative, work colleague, etc, I'd tell them to wait for the Stribog A3 or look at the CMMG Banshee. If you already have an AR you can also just buy a Banshee upper and their conversion mags or conversion inserts.
I have the Ruger and love it. My next PC will be a CMMG Banshee 9mm.
End of Earth: 2 Miles
Upper Peninsula: 4 Miles
If you want to know if a PCC is serious then check out what the Germans had during WWII. The 9mm Schmeisser. Deadly. I have the Freedom Ordnnce
FX9 (8.5" barrel) and wouldn't trade if for any of these thousand dollar ones. It's Mil-Spec. Have ten 33 round mags for it and a Primary Arms Advanced 30mm Red Dot. (14000 hr battery life) I use yellow cheap tennis balls for targets out on my desert.
Well, a 10' steel gong target too....
|Prepared for the Worst, Providing the Best|
As someone who has all three of those, how does the Guard compare to the other two? After two disappointing experiences with straight-blowback PCCs, I'm considering an MPX, PTR 9CT, or a CMMG RDB build. The CMMG build would be the cheapest, and easiest as I already have a bunch of ARs, but I don't want to spend money on another gun I am not happy with. Trying one out would be best, but I don't know anyone locally who has one, so I'm looking for all the knowledgeable first-hand opinions I can get.
I'm just did my first PCC with a PSA AR9 with an 8"barrel and Endomags.
It runs well, though it is a bit punchy.
Now I'm looking at the CMMG radial system as it looks to be a bit smoother with a lighter mass action.
If I had the coin I'd just get an MPX but for now the AR9 works and is a blast to shoot.
I was going to do a 5.56 upper next but it looks like I'll be doing another AR9 upper.
Still dig my CMMG Banshee in 10 mm. Just wish I could actually SHOOT it...
Multiple questions are being asked by the OP.
1) Scorpion as a PCC. Yes , a lot of after market support, upgrades , mags , etc. Very good bang for the buck.
2) Host for a suppressor. Yes, have to be careful of the Scorpion model--some come with fake flashhiders to make the barrel length legal. Also, you need to make sure the suppressor will fit in the handguard. Pistol vs SBR vs Brace, it becomes confusing.
3) Suppressor--yes on it's time to get a suppressor. A Trust may add another month to the wait but it allows another person(s) to use or possess the suppressor. A legal document that governs who "owns" the suppressor. See HeavyD post on Trusts in the classified. A suppressor needs to be 9 mm and the diameter fit the handguard. That means you cannot use a 45 caliber suppressor because the diameter may prevent it from fitting in the handguard.
Overall--CZ Scorpion is a great 9 mm pistol or pistol carbine or carbine. Feel free to ask other questions--a daunting process but worth it. You have to increase your 9 mm bullet weight to make suppressed shooting quieter, (115--->147).
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