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My first foray into the world of pistol RMR's. Login/Join 
Ammoholic
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quote:
Originally posted by abnmacv:
quote:
Originally posted by pingman274:
I'd be happy to host a few folks in the Burlington area. I've been working with a G19 with RMR and a G43 with the Shield RDS.

www.ccgci.org


How do you like the Shield on the G43?


I really like it. Very light, compact and same footprint as the Jpoint. Made of aluminum rather than polymer. Not likely as durable as an RMR, but the G43 doesn't get as many rounds as the G19. Suarez did my slide and installed suppressor height night sights which cowitness with the dot.



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Posts: 1751 | Registered: April 21, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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to see the RMR screws back out regardless of the amount of Loctite 242 applied

Whenever I see comments like this I am always asking did you follow the correct locktite install. Clean, proper primer, then locktite (amount is not relevant). I have not had this problem but I am concerned about it, so when I hear about problems I ask for the specifics to learn. Especially since one has to dismount an RMR to change the battery.
jb


“So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.”
 
Posts: 8039 | Registered: October 14, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I took a quick look at the Shield since I have not heard of it. My experience is anything that auto adjusts will not work very well in many common conditions. So maybe some of you that use it can comment.


“So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.”
 
Posts: 8039 | Registered: October 14, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by hrcjon:
to see the RMR screws back out regardless of the amount of Loctite 242 applied

Whenever I see comments like this I am always asking did you follow the correct locktite install. Clean, proper primer, then locktite (amount is not relevant). I have not had this problem but I am concerned about it, so when I hear about problems I ask for the specifics to learn. Especially since one has to dismount an RMR to change the battery.
jb


I've always just cleaned the surfdaces with acetone then 99% alcohol, dry, apply loctite, then let set. I just ordered some primer...hopefully this is the step that I am missing. Thanks!




"You have the right not to be killed..."

The Clash, "Know Your Rights"
 
Posts: 26943 | Location: Westizzle Virgizzle | Registered: December 19, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Ammoholic
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quote:
Originally posted by hrcjon:
I took a quick look at the Shield since I have not heard of it. My experience is anything that auto adjusts will not work very well in many common conditions. So maybe some of you that use it can comment.


Which conditions are those?



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Posts: 1751 | Registered: April 21, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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First in the interest of disclosure my experience is only on RMR's. Those conditions are any in which the gun and target are in vastly different light conditions. Examples:
- you are in inside a shaded building (your garage) but the target is outside in bright sunlight. This is incredible common in my shooting in indoor range matches, well lighted target, you in almost total darkness. The sight overcompensates to the point of uselessness. Really common in real life.
- You are in sunlight and the target is in the shade. This happens to me all the time at steel matches at a certain club. The sun climbs over the berm and the firing line is in serious blazing sunlight but the targets are still shaded. The sight simply cannot be used. Again pretty common in real life.
- Using a flashlight. Sight in the dark but target well lighted.

These are just examples to give you a flavor. But based on years of using these optics you simply do not one that autoadjusts, the electronics is not yet up to the task.
For carry find a manually adjustable one. Find a good setting that works and leave it there except in unusual conditions. I leave mine in one setting during the day but since I spend a ton of time in the woods with my dogs at night know to pick another when I head into the woods.


“So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.”
 
Posts: 8039 | Registered: October 14, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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My SECOND foray into the world of pistol RMR's.

Well after a year of shooting the 17 RMR and discovering the benefits of using a red dot on a pistol, I felt it was time to seriously consider a RMR for EDC.
I had initially sent out a slide for milling, but eventually sold it and the matching RMR in order to recoup moneys used during Christmas. Also, at the same time I had issues as mentioned previously with the RMR and the idea of carrying an RMR'd gun soured a bit.

That said, I got a good deal on yet another Trijicon RMR07, and decided perhaps I'll give it another go.

So I purchased another Unity Tactical Atom slide, this time for a gen 4 Glock 19. These haven't been in stock for a while so when I got the email that they were available I snatched one quickly.

I still like the idea of having a slide that could be upgraded for future red dot sights that may come down the pike. This despite my apprehension about the shallow threads on the RMR Atom mount adapter as I mentioned in the recent past. So I got a couple of extra mounts just in case. Smile



Sadly no Unity swag accompanied my order this time...I'm a patch and sticker whore.

The slide was dripping with oil.



Black cerakoted inside and out with just one small linr where they missed some coating.


The new slide also has some new engravings:


I'm assuming this is a serial number. My older 17 Unity slide did not have such engravings.


And I noticed that the suppressor-height sights are a little taller than on my previous 17 slide. The rear sight is also narrower with steeper angles bilaterally which makes for a thinner rear sight presentation.






"You have the right not to be killed..."

The Clash, "Know Your Rights"
 
Posts: 26943 | Location: Westizzle Virgizzle | Registered: December 19, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Something positive:
It looks like Unity Tactical listened to customer complaints about the RMR sealing plate being too sharp. The new plates that came with my adapters have smooth corners....no more scalpel edges!
They also opened up the side indents to better match the footprint of the RMR sight.





The new Atom RMR adapter plates are also now engraved with the Unity symbol and the type of adapter sight it matches.




"You have the right not to be killed..."

The Clash, "Know Your Rights"
 
Posts: 26943 | Location: Westizzle Virgizzle | Registered: December 19, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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So I set out all my parts, trying to figure out how I wanted the gun to end up. I eventually switched to a 'minus' OEM connector and stole an all-black Overwatch Precision trigger from a gen4 Glock 17 that I use only for shooting fun with a suppressor. Otherwise everything in this pic was crammed into the gun. The gun was initially a gen4 Glock 23 that I picked up for dirt-cheap around Christmastime. All I wanted really was the frame.



Finished!
Here is the youngling shown beside the original pistol on which this thread was started. I have now renamed the old FDE Glock 17 RMR "Atom Heart Mother" for all the Pink Floyd fans out there. Smile



So far the gun dry-fires fine. The trigger passed my drop testing.
All I needed for EDC was to get an OEM Glock 19 barrel. But for now will be using an OEM barrel from my edc gen4 19. The stainless threaded barrel is only for shooting at the range suppressed.



Loctited and torqued the RMR....I'm still waiting for the Loctite primer I ordered and will be redoing the mount when it arrives. I'll also at the time pop a new battery in it...the battery in it now is the one that came with when I bought it from a fellow forumite.

Here with the barrel from my stock gen4 EDC.




"You have the right not to be killed..."

The Clash, "Know Your Rights"
 
Posts: 26943 | Location: Westizzle Virgizzle | Registered: December 19, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I don't have a holster for this gun yet...it won't fit into my personal favorite for AIWB, the GCode Incog Eclipse that I use for both my stock 19 and 26. And I don't want to wait 12 weeks for one to arrive, so I'll most likely make my own copy in the next couple weeks. I like making kydex sheaths for my knives, but have only have two kydex holsters in the recent past--one for my Glock 43 and a chest rig kydex for hiking with my Glock 20. But that will be another post.

I mounted a Surefire XC1 to it as I hate AIWB carrying a gun with the Surefire X300...it's just plain uncomfortable. Got this light again from one of our forum members. I had another in the past, but ruined it when I attempted to take it apart and overdrive the LED to get higher light output. I burnt out the LED completely. That's what sucks about Surefire weapons-mounted lights, they are a pain to modify.





Well, heading to the range within the hour to devirginize the new RMR 19. Hopefully it will prove reliable over the next couple weeks before I decide to EDC it.

I did install an oem stock plunger safety, extractor, and springs as well as the loaded-chamber load bearing plunger. Hopefully I won't get any brass-to-face, which would save me $60 by not having to buy the Apex extractor kit.







"You have the right not to be killed..."

The Clash, "Know Your Rights"
 
Posts: 26943 | Location: Westizzle Virgizzle | Registered: December 19, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Go ahead punk, make my day
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Nice, the G19/XC1 combo is a great EDC. I had those slides on notification as well, as I have considered giving RMRs a try for EDC, but right now isn't the time to sink $600+ (RMR), $560+ (slides plus adaptor plate), $150 (holster), $200-400 (1-2K of 9MM) into reworking my EDC, so I passed.

But I'm looking forward to watching your experiences. I have used a RDS on a Ruger Mark 2, so it'll be interesting to see your impression on what works / what doesn't.
 
Posts: 43737 | Registered: July 12, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
so sexy it hurts
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quote:
Originally posted by RHINOWSO:
Nice, the G19/XC1 combo is a great EDC. I had those slides on notification as well, as I have considered giving RMRs a try for EDC, but right now isn't the time to sink $600+ (RMR), $560+ (slides plus adaptor plate), $150 (holster), $200-400 (1-2K of 9MM) into reworking my EDC, so I passed.

But I'm looking forward to watching your experiences. I have used a RDS on a Ruger Mark 2, so it'll be interesting to see your impression on what works / what doesn't.


Yeah, the sticker shock is crazy. But after spending a shit ton on the first RMR gun, it didn't hurt so much the second go around. Plus the new Atom slide was $485 from weapon outfitters.....every dollar counts! Smile




"You have the right not to be killed..."

The Clash, "Know Your Rights"
 
Posts: 26943 | Location: Westizzle Virgizzle | Registered: December 19, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Ammoholic
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Just some observations from my end...not trying to be argumentative, just my personal thing. I have the Shield 8 MOA, I know the Dual-illuminated RMR's suffer from the dark shooter / light target washout you describe.

quote:
Originally posted by hrcjon:
First in the interest of disclosure my experience is only on RMR's. Those conditions are any in which the gun and target are in vastly different light conditions. Examples:
- you are in inside a shaded building (your garage) but the target is outside in bright sunlight. This is incredible common in my shooting in indoor range matches, well lighted target, you in almost total darkness. The sight overcompensates to the point of uselessness. Really common in real life.

I don't shoot any indoor matches - but I can easily stand in my darkened garage and look out the door into the sunlight and see the dot. Is it a bit dimmer than if the gun itself was in daylight, yes. Still very easy to pickup.

- You are in sunlight and the target is in the shade. This happens to me all the time at steel matches at a certain club. The sun climbs over the berm and the firing line is in serious blazing sunlight but the targets are still shaded. The sight simply cannot be used. Again pretty common in real life.

I'm not sure if I could use any sight in scenario - you are saying the glaring sun is basically directly in your face, say at sunrise or sunset and the target is shaded? Honestly, I haven't tried in those conditions. I will and report back. Those are tough conditions for any shot.

- Using a flashlight. Sight in the dark but target well lighted.

No problem at all with the Shield, or in fact one of the LED RMR's set to adjust. I've tested that in my darkened home. Major issue with the dual-illuminated RMR model. Also, that is a big reason for co-witnessed night sights. This is still an optical device and I recognize it could fail.


These are just examples to give you a flavor. But based on years of using these optics you simply do not one that autoadjusts, the electronics is not yet up to the task.
For carry find a manually adjustable one. Find a good setting that works and leave it there except in unusual conditions. I leave mine in one setting during the day but since I spend a ton of time in the woods with my dogs at night know to pick another when I head into the woods.


I see the Shield as a lighter alternative for EDC of smaller guns, I use an RMR on my G19. Both are a complete godsend for my older eyes that had lens implants for distance vision. I have no hope at all of seeing a front sight post, the dot is clear as a bell.



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Posts: 1751 | Registered: April 21, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Ammoholic
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quote:
Originally posted by Oat_Action_Man:
quote:
Originally posted by agony:
Let's do it!
Maybe pingman and other locals can get the ball rolling. Would love to take the wife to Raleigh for the weekend anyway, let's make to most of it.


Don't think we'd have a chance to get down there until early July. Work til early June and then taking a class in NH until last week and a half of June.

Also, if y'all want to drive a little further east, there's a place, Fun Time Shooting, outside of Wilson (bout 1.5 hours E from Burlington, maybe). Basically a bunch of steel, a short jungle walk type course, plate racks, barricades, plus rifle steel out to 700ish, I think. No website, but I've got the guy's card and can do some askin'.

Based on his info, I bet MikeinNC knows the owner as well.


If anyone still is interested in a small gathering in Burlington later in the summer, there are a couple of weekends in June and July we could do this. Shoot me an email to the one in my profile and I will build a list.



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NC CCH Instructor
GRNC Life Member
VCDL Member
 
Posts: 1751 | Registered: April 21, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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FWIW if you are price sensitive using an MOS glock saves a bunch. The price gap on that is way less than the Atom and gives some options to use a variety of optics. Milling a slide is also way less but of course doesn't have the flexibility of the atom or MOS.


“So in war, the way is to avoid what is strong, and strike at what is weak.”
 
Posts: 8039 | Registered: October 14, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
so sexy it hurts
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by pingman274:
quote:
Originally posted by Oat_Action_Man:
quote:
Originally posted by agony:
Let's do it!
Maybe pingman and other locals can get the ball rolling. Would love to take the wife to Raleigh for the weekend anyway, let's make to most of it.


Don't think we'd have a chance to get down there until early July. Work til early June and then taking a class in NH until last week and a half of June.

Also, if y'all want to drive a little further east, there's a place, Fun Time Shooting, outside of Wilson (bout 1.5 hours E from Burlington, maybe). Basically a bunch of steel, a short jungle walk type course, plate racks, barricades, plus rifle steel out to 700ish, I think. No website, but I've got the guy's card and can do some askin'.

Based on his info, I bet MikeinNC knows the owner as well.


If anyone still is interested in a small gathering in Burlington later in the summer, there are a couple of weekends in June and July we could do this. Shoot me an email to the one in my profile and I will build a list.


Yup let's do this....I'm pretty flexible this June and July unless the powers-that-be put me on call last minute. Also I'll be at the NC beaches in late July so I may be able to kill two birds with one stone.




"You have the right not to be killed..."

The Clash, "Know Your Rights"
 
Posts: 26943 | Location: Westizzle Virgizzle | Registered: December 19, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
so sexy it hurts
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by hrcjon:
FWIW if you are price sensitive using an MOS glock saves a bunch. The price gap on that is way less than the Atom and gives some options to use a variety of optics. Milling a slide is also way less but of course doesn't have the flexibility of the atom or MOS.


I'm still kinda kicking myself for selling off my 34MOS. Before I got the ATOM I looked for a cheap used 19MOS slide, but the prices were not far from that of a new Atom.




"You have the right not to be killed..."

The Clash, "Know Your Rights"
 
Posts: 26943 | Location: Westizzle Virgizzle | Registered: December 19, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Okay, first time out with the Glock RMR19.

RMR19 rounds, total: 400.
ETS 22-round mag total round count: 22,880.

I shot 300 rounds of my 124gr standard pressure handloads.
I shot 100 rounds of 124gr +P factory Gold Dots.

I shot mostly static square range stuff, no drills other than a single Dot Torture. Just draws from holster, reloads, shooting for accuracy and reliablity and familiarity at 7 yds and 25 yds. I used a holster meant for the RMR17. The RMR19 didn't fit perfectly but it was okay for what I was doing. No timed shots other than the Dot Torture, only because I'm waiting to make a proper holster for RMR19.
I used the same six 22-round ETS mags, used two OEM Glock 19 mags when shooting my carry ammo.

I did bring a 34 to shoot if the RMR19 failed. Luckily the 34 stayed in the holster. I did run a couple mags through the 26 just to rotate my carry ammo.



The good:

No malfunctions with the gun. No FTE/FTF.
Handling was no different than shooting any other 19, other than the slight adjustment you have to make on presentation to lower the gun slightly in order to get the red dot on target quickly...no biggie anymore since shooting the RMR17 for a year. The suppressor-height irons were dead-on out to 25. I didn't even touch the adjustments on the RM07, sighting it in based on the irons at home.

Ejection with the standard OEM extractor was PERFECT! No brass-to-face at all, other than one single round that took a weird bounce off of the RMR. I see no need right now to spend the $60 for an Apex extractor.

The RMR held up fine. No loosening of the mounting screws. Held zero, as I expected with my experience with the RMR17. The improved sealing plates are a blessing...so smooth, no sharp edges at all.

The XC1 held up fine as well. Unlike the X300, no sooting of the lens at all using the factory barrel. Which I thought strange, but I'll take it.

The ETS 22-rounders just keep chugging along. I have found that these run better in the 19 sized frame than the 17 sized frame. I get binding issues at times with the larger frame, but they dropped free everytime from the 19 frame.


The bad:

The front sight loosened. It happens. Took it apart, tightened it up at the range. When I got home I loctited it. No biggie.

That's it. No other issues whatsoever.
---------------------------------------------
I'm going to shoot it again in a couple days.
I want to get at least 1000 rounds through it before I relegate it to primary carry.

I simply wiped down the gun after loctiting the front sight. I won't clean the gun until I get a malfunction.


I also want to take the RM07 off, change the battery to one that I know is brand new, and remount the screws using the Loctite primer I ordered as recommended by hrcjon.

I'll try to make a holster for it in the next week or two.

I may steal the Glock gen4 extended mag release from one of my 17's that I keep as a backup.

I may also order a tritium front sight for it, but I'll need to ensure I find one of the proper size, as I don't know if there is any standardization in regards to height with suppressor sights. Again, these sights appear taller than those found on the older Atom RMR17.
----------------------------------------------

Accuracy was good with my standard pressure loads. Accuracy was typical with the 124gr GD's. The barrel that is in the gun now is from my primary 19 EDC. I may try to find another in the future that will stay in this gun permanently. I do want to shoot it with a threaded barrel using my Silencerco Omega 9k.

I ended the session with a single Dot Torture at seven yards. Missed 5 shots, which of course, is a failure. But still happy with the gun so far.





"You have the right not to be killed..."

The Clash, "Know Your Rights"
 
Posts: 26943 | Location: Westizzle Virgizzle | Registered: December 19, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by agony:
I may steal the Glock gen4 extended mag release from one of my 17's that I keep as a backup.


If you haven't already, I'd suggest trying the Vicker Gen 4 extended mag release. I find them to be much superior to the factory extended mag release.

https://tangodown.com/shop/vic...ase-for-large-frame/
 
Posts: 23675 | Location: Northwest Arkansas | Registered: January 06, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I have the Vickers on most of my Glocks. They are good, but I'm having issues with the one in my RMR17. It sticks at times, and takes significant pressure to pop the mag. No issues with the vickers on other guns.




"You have the right not to be killed..."

The Clash, "Know Your Rights"
 
Posts: 26943 | Location: Westizzle Virgizzle | Registered: December 19, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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