P250 - The Official Word - Topic Powered by eve community

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Posted

quote:
In the age of the internet and UPS/DHL/etc. this is easily solved. All the gun store need sell is the module w/o the grip or trigger but a coupon for both that you use to get what you need mailed to you. It can't be that hard, if you have a little patience.

So you walk out of the gunstore with only a receiver, slide, barrel, recoil spring & guide rod; still having absolutely no idea what size grip frame or trigger you need. How do you know exactly what "you need mailed to you"? Exactly WHO is going to mail it to you? You haven't fixed the basic problem of how someone tries out the different combinations of grip frames and triggers to ensure they get the best "fit".

In his G&A article on p. 41, author Greg Rodriguez stated "During my initial test session at the Sigarms factory, I changed the grip modules and triggers to fit each shooter's hands quickly and easily with very little training." Who will do this for the average Joe consumer who wants to purchase a properly "fitted" P250?

The ability to "fit" a grip frame/trigger to a shooter's hand and replace damaged frames inexpensively and without paperwork is one of the main innovations of the P250 touted by Sig. I'm just not sure they have figured it out for the masses (or haven't told us yet).

This message has been edited. Last edited by: 229DAK,

Posts: 4884 | Location: Virginia | Registered: November 04, 2005

Ignored post by 229DAK posted

Badwing

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Posted

I would also like to be added to the "backup" list..

Posts: 140 | Registered: September 29, 2005

Ignored post by Badwing posted

Kelvrick

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Posted

quote:
Originally posted by 45caldan:
quote:
Originally posted by Kelvrick:
I might have missed the answer in one of the many threads and in this one, but is the P250 going to be california legal?

In the thread running: "The Official Word" it plainly says CA and MA NO

Ah, thread got too long and I just did a text search for "California" and didn't see anything. Shoulda seen the CA compliant - NO line though.

Posts: 328 | Registered: May 08, 2007

Ignored post by Kelvrick posted

ColinP

Member

Posted

quote:
Originally posted by sigfreund:
quote:
Originally posted by 229DAK:
How does Sig plan to do this?

I believe you've identified what will turn out to be another source of frustration for would-be SIG owners. Although I would be very pleasantly surprised if the "bodies" are inexpensive enough for every gun shop to have the full line available to install whichever one the customer prefers or even for the customer to try, I seriously doubt that will happen. I once asked for a short trigger at a well-stocked shop that carried things like spare SIG barrels and was told, "We don't get much call for things like that."

Here's my guess: the bodies will be expensive and it won't be easy to find P250s fitted with the small or large sizes. A few individual consumers will have a chance to try the large or small variety and will have to order what they want from SIGARMS if they're willing to pay the price. I also suspect that the different bodies are something that will be sold primarily to large LE agencies so they can customize the gun for each individual officer.

Hopefully I'm wrong about all this, but I'm developing a fairly good personal prediction record about such things.

I wonder if they could do it with fake bodies with the proper sizes?

P220R, 226ST & 229 Elite got to love it!

Posts: 367 | Location: Vancouver | Registered: June 02, 2006

Ignored post by ColinP posted

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Posted

quote:
I wonder if they could do it with fake bodies with the proper sizes?

Sounds like my ex-wife.

Posts: 4884 | Location: Virginia | Registered: November 04, 2005

Ignored post by 229DAK posted

Fire Away

Member

Posted

I wonder if the P250 will be available in traditional DA/SA?

Posts: 699 | Location: Central Pennsylvania | Registered: December 08, 1999

Ignored post by Fire Away posted

Member

Posted

quote:
Originally posted by Fire Away:
I wonder if the P250 will be available in traditional DA/SA?

Given the way Sig has designed the drop in/out receiver, I doubt it.

Posts: 4884 | Location: Virginia | Registered: November 04, 2005

Ignored post by 229DAK posted

fatboy97

Member

Posted

Very interesting that Mr Erhardt calls this a "P250 Compact." If I'm looking at a comparable size gun from Glock I would consider the Full Size Glock G17, but to be fair I will include the Glock G19 (which is considered a compact by Glock).

Overall Length: P250 - 7.2", G17 - 7.32", G19 - 6.85"
Overall Height: P250 - 5.1", G17 - 5.43", G19 - 5.0"
Weight w/Empty Mag: P250 - 24oz, G17 - 22.04oz, G19 - 20.99oz

Is the next steps putting out a Full Size, or a Subcompact?

Be Observant and Be Safe.

Current Collection: Glock G26, G19, G23C, SIG P226-40, and Ruger GP-100
Former Collection: Taurus 92SS, SIG P220, S&W 360, SIG P239-40

Posts: 415 | Location: Land of 10,000 Lakes | Registered: July 17, 2005

Ignored post by fatboy97 posted

Oat_Action_Man

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Posted

In SIG parlance, the 229 is a "compact" gun, as well. Not compact in my idea, which is a G26 or Kahr, but definitely not full-sized, either.

Oat

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Ignored post by Oat_Action_Man posted

variablebinary

Banned for being a
Chronic Troublemaker.

Posted

quote:
Originally posted by fatboy97:
Very interesting that Mr Erhardt calls this a "P250 Compact." If I'm looking at a comparable size gun from Glock I would consider the Full Size Glock G17, but to be fair I will include the Glock G19 (which is considered a compact by Glock).

Overall Length: P250 - 7.2", G17 - 7.32", G19 - 6.85"
Overall Height: P250 - 5.1", G17 - 5.43", G19 - 5.0"
Weight w/Empty Mag: P250 - 24oz, G17 - 22.04oz, G19 - 20.99oz

Is the next steps putting out a Full Size, or a Subcompact?

Keep in mind Glock never fully designed their slides and frames for anything other than 9mm (with the exception of the .45, .45 GAP, and 10mm) which contributes to the compactness of the Glock design.

Posts: 1757 | Location: Salt Lake City, Utah | Registered: January 31, 2004

Ignored post by variablebinary posted

signoir

Member

Posted

The P250 IS revolutionary - not from a shootability standpoint but from a supply, demand, and inventory standpoint. The "frame" is no longer a critical component that needs to be controlled and can be outsourced to any good plastics manufacturer. LEO agencies and the military can stock pistols in "parts bins" and only have to control the small serialized receiver. Pistols can be assembled and custom fitted to each recruit. Frames, slides, and barrels can be exchanged with Sig as the need arises. The cost of maintaining the armory will go down as will Sig's total cost of production. If it all works, I predict that the P250 is just the forerunner of modular designed firearms.

"When I held that gun in my hand, I felt a surge of power...like God must feel when he's holding a gun." H. Simpson.

Posts: 651 | Registered: July 04, 2006

Ignored post by signoir posted

Member

Posted

quote:
Originally posted by signoir:
The P250 IS revolutionary - not from a shootability standpoint but from a supply, demand, and inventory standpoint. The "frame" is no longer a critical component that needs to be controlled and can be outsourced to any good plastics manufacturer. LEO agencies and the military can stock pistols in "parts bins" and only have to control the small serialized receiver. Pistols can be assembled and custom fitted to each recruit. Frames, slides, and barrels can be exchanged with Sig as the need arises. The cost of maintaining the armory will go down as will Sig's total cost of production. If it all works, I predict that the P250 is just the forerunner of modular designed firearms.

So how does Joe consumer get fitted for his pistol? Your local gun store isn't going to have a P250 "parts bin" in the back.

Posts: 4884 | Location: Virginia | Registered: November 04, 2005

Ignored post by 229DAK posted

signoir

Member

Posted

quote:
Originally posted by 229DAK:
So how does Joe consumer get fitted for his pistol? Your local gun store isn't going to have a P250 "parts bin" in the back.

The gun store could have sample frames that the customer could try. Sig could have an ordered frame shipped to the store within the waiting period. Afterall, the DROS only needs the serial # off the receiver.

"When I held that gun in my hand, I felt a surge of power...like God must feel when he's holding a gun." H. Simpson.

Posts: 651 | Registered: July 04, 2006

Ignored post by signoir posted

sigfreund

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Posted

quote:
Originally posted by signoir:
Sig could have an ordered frame shipped to the store within the waiting period.

Not to argue with your basic premise, signoir, but for some of us, the "waiting period" is seldom longer than an hour. Even that's longer than it should be, but hardly enough for SIGARMS to ship us what we need to make the gun work.

“Most men … can seldom accept the simplest and most obvious truth if it … would oblige them to admit the falsity of conclusions … which they have woven, thread by thread, into the fabrics of their lives.”
_{— Leo Tolstoy}

Posts: 18329 | Location: 10,170 Feet Above Sea Level In Colorado | Registered: April 04, 2002

Ignored post by sigfreund posted

Member

Posted

quote:
Originally posted by signoir:
quote:
Originally posted by 229DAK:
So how does Joe consumer get fitted for his pistol? Your local gun store isn't going to have a P250 "parts bin" in the back.

The gun store could have sample frames that the customer could try. Sig could have an ordered frame shipped to the store within the waiting period. Afterall, the DROS only needs the serial # off the receiver.

...and what about the trigger? What gun shop is going to want to hammer and punch the two triggers in/out six times to help the potential buyer figure out which of the six combinations (3 grip frame sizes x 2 different triggers) fit his hand best?

BTW - no waiting period here in Virginia.

Posts: 4884 | Location: Virginia | Registered: November 04, 2005

Ignored post by 229DAK posted

signoir

Member

Posted

I realize that there could be "customer service" issues for dealers at the time of sale. But they have those issues today. The P250 just gives dealers more options in dealing with the customer. However, I believe that the P250 is designed to meet the needs of LEOs and military first.

"When I held that gun in my hand, I felt a surge of power...like God must feel when he's holding a gun." H. Simpson.

Posts: 651 | Registered: July 04, 2006

Ignored post by signoir posted

Slimcakes

Member

Posted

quote:
I believe that the P250 is designed to meet the needs of LEOs and military first.

That is certainly my impression.

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Ignored post by Slimcakes posted

souljahboi

Member

Posted

quote:
Originally posted by Kelvrick:
quote:
Originally posted by 45caldan:
quote:
Originally posted by Kelvrick:
I might have missed the answer in one of the many threads and in this one, but is the P250 going to be california legal?

In the thread running: "The Official Word" it plainly says CA and MA NO

Ah, thread got too long and I just did a text search for "California" and didn't see anything. Shoulda seen the CA compliant - NO line though.

I've gotta get out of this state...

"Just remember this, every bullet you launch has an attorney attached to it" -- Ken Hackathorn

Posts: 11 | Location: SoCal, Kalifornia | Registered: December 08, 2005

Ignored post by souljahboi posted

sigmundsauer

Member

Posted

quote:
Originally posted by fatboy97:
Very interesting that Mr Erhardt calls this a "P250 Compact." If I'm looking at a comparable size gun from Glock I would consider the Full Size Glock G17, but to be fair I will include the Glock G19 (which is considered a compact by Glock).

Overall Length: P250 - 7.2", G17 - 7.32", G19 - 6.85"
Overall Height: P250 - 5.1", G17 - 5.43", G19 - 5.0"
Weight w/Empty Mag: P250 - 24oz, G17 - 22.04oz, G19 - 20.99oz

Is the next steps putting out a Full Size, or a Subcompact?

fatboy97,

Your cited dimensions are misleading.

The SIG accounts for the extreme most measurements in each category. The Glock's do not.

The SIG's weight includes the magazine. The Glock's do not.

The Glock's overall length dimensions only measure the slide length, this excludes other bulk and size added to the overall length from the frame, which extends well past the rear of the slide, and must be concealed.

In all practical dimensions and measurements, the P250DCc is virtually identical to the G19. Certainly much closer to the G19 than the G17. And do so with the mags inserted, as you would carry the weapon. Even the protuberance of the semi-beavertail on the P250, that accounts for the rearmost metric of overall length is not in a position to create a concealment challenge and virtually a non-factor.

Tim

"Very well then. Carry on." -Para

Posts: 1452 | Location: The Land of the Free! | Registered: February 13, 2003

Ignored post by sigmundsauer posted