As some of you are aware, Bruce Gray and crew at GGI are planning to convert some 220STs to 10mm.

Flork has posted an update regarding this project, and is attempting to ascertain the number of Bar-Sto barrels that need to be ordered.
His post is on page 2, here.

"Friends and fellow Sigophiles. I'm here with another announcement about the Sig 10mm.

Keep in mind that the entire converesion requires Bruce or myself to be at a bench for every step of the process. It's all hand fitting and custom work so it's not gonna be cheap.

The reason we're posting this is that our barrel maker is preparing to make the barrels for us and we need a good solid idea of how many barrels to have them make.

The following list is our price break down for the Sig 10mm conversion in a 4.4" barrel on a Stainless frame Sig P220 which would need to be supplied by the customer or purchased from us by the customer for retail price.

The basics:

Barrel: Custom made Bar-Sto barrel supplied and fitted - $325

Slide work: Includes welding and recutting the breach face, supplying a custom made GGI extractor and setting up proper extractor tension and function - $225

Solid stainless steel guide rod with 24lb mainspring $42.00

Custom modified 10mm magazines supplied buy GGI - 5ea. per gun, including modifications to the Slide Catch Lever and Magazine Release to make them function properly - $325

Dehorn, detail and blend the slide - $75

Total for the basic package work: $992.00


Additional options are as follows:

Tritium night sight front paired with Warren Tactical rear sight - $150

Custom wleded and blended beaver tail - $150

Reduced Reset Comprehensive Duty Package - $250

Custom Fabricated Grayguns Magwell welded and fitted - $225

Total for additional options - $775


Grand Total for the full on everyghing GGI 10mm conversion - $1767.00


If you're seriously interested in one of these pistols, please email me at scott@grayguns.com so I can talk to you about the project."

So, if you're serious about making an investment in a firearm that has the potential for becoming a righteous collectible in years to come, please let Flork know in this thread.

For those of us without a Stainless frame, what would be the additional cost. Also could it be done with a DAK trigger?

As of right now, we are not convinced that an alloy frame gun can handle the slide velocity and recoil generated by the 10mm cartridge. Our plan is to make them in stainless and see how it goes, then we'll make an attempt at the alloy frame.

Yes, we can use the DAK trigger system for the 10mm. If you have a DAK in your gun, no big deal, if you don't we can supply and install the parts.

What would be the cost for a frame? I don't have a stainless donor gun, so this would have to be a ground up build for me.

quote:

Stainless frame Sig P220 which would need to be supplied by the customer or purchased from us by the customer for retail price.

Note that it says "stainless frame ... P220," not "stainless P220 frame."
I interpret that as saying the customer must supply a complete P220ST pistol for the project or purchase a complete pistol from Grayguns.

Yes it does, I must stop trying too read, drive and type at the same time.....

Good luck getting just stainless 220 frame. As far as I know, you would need to buy the entire gun.

And, yes, my intention was to tell you that you would need to supply an entire pistol for the modification, bacause we will need a slide and internals too.

Glad to see this come to fruition.

Now it's time to see how many of those "Damn it, SIG, make a 10mm" people put their money where their mouths are.

Oat

If I am not able to afford the entire project now would it be possible to buy the barrel and have the gunsmithing done down the road?
Andrew

quote:

Originally posted by andrewl:
If I am not able to afford the entire project now would it be possible to buy the barrel and have the gunsmithing done down the road?
Andrew

Bruce and I agree that would be OK. As these barrels (and the other custom conversion parts) are proprietary to Grayguns Inc, we'd only ask that we retain the barrel until we complete our work.

Bruce is always worrying about how to make our best work more affordable. Hey, perfection isn't cheap. So, we can offer some sort of payment schedule, since this work will take a fair amount of time to complete anyway. Why not tell us what would work for you? Even though the 10mm project isn't that pricey compared to some of the ridiculous 1911's that Bruce takes freakin' decades to build, it's still a significant chunk. We'll work with you guys.

What would a New 220ST from GGI go for with the package? I had a moment of clarity a few months back and sold mine.


Mitch

quote:

Originally posted by Oat_Action_Man:
Glad to see this come to fruition.

Now it's time to see how many of those "Damn it, SIG, make a 10mm" people put their money where their mouths are.

Oat

LOL!

Oh, the kittens I'll be anxious to read a range report on the new GGI 10mm beast!

Flork,
Can this work be done to a 220ST elite model as well??

Thanks.

kewl - gotta go shopping for a P220ST!


So, I guess you're not making the slides out of Tungsten?

Rather than doing all the fancy work on the breech face of the P220 slide, wouldn't it have been easier to just mill out the area in a stainless slide amd put in the breech block of a p220 38 super? The rim specifications are very close (.406 for 38 super versus .425 for 10mm).

With the 38 super breech block out of the slide, its much easier to mill a an extra .019 out of sides of the 38 super breech face than having to weld and recut the hard-to-reach internal area of a stainless slide (not to mention custom extractor requirements). If the fear would be inset breech block movement, then small locking engagements could easily be milled into the slide cut that match and engage similar cuts in the the 38 super breech block. This combo would still be heavier than a standard folded slide to retain the mass needed for 10mm lockup.

In addition, the 38 super extractor would probably need no work to work properly (it's not going to be able to tell the difference beteen .0095 inch (1/2 radius difference between the 2 cartridges. Then just put the p220 38 super ejector on the stainless frame.

As it's eaier to mill out a nice tight square in the slide, the 38 super breech block could be nice and tight. With a simple switch to a the slightly larger diameter solid pin would ensure no movement under firing.

The 38 super mags will proably hold the 10mm cartridge just fine, so very minimal modification should be needed (although the frame would need to be punched out in grip area to accomidate the 38 super mags (which you probably have to do anyways for custom mags as the cartridge length is longer than the .45.

A higher rated recoil spring with heavy guide rod would help tame the 10mm full-house loads. This would seem to be an easier solution than all the custom work directly on the breech face and needing custom extractors. Of course it's all conjecture..

Heck, it would seem easier to easier (re: cheaper) to mill a brand new custom copy of 38 super breech block (in 10mm breech face dimensions) that fits into a custom cutout of a stainless slide, than play with weldup and recut and other custom work you need to do on the .45 breech face and extractor. Could even make it of tungsten to add more lockup mass. Kinda of a "why redesign the wheel thing" and then parts availability would also go up if many interchanged (like extractors and magazines).

Just my two cents! Would still love to have one...

Someone should post this on 10mmtalk.

For a California resident: To start this project, I would need to supply a Sig 220 with a stainless steel frame. That's because I can't have GGI buy the 220 in Oregon, modify and, and then transfer it across state lines to a California FFL, because a 220 in 10mm is not on the California Roster of handguns, therefore it can not be imported into the state.

But what if I don't have a 220 in stainless yet? That's where the problem arises. On the roster, there are two stainless frame models: The "P220 (Stainless) Sport / Stainless Steel" (which has a 5.5inch barrel and long slide and is therefore not eligible for this conversion), and the "P220 (Stainless) / Stainless Steel" with the 4.4 inch barrel (that's probably what's colloquially known as the P220ST).

The problem is: As far as I can see, neither of those two models is sold by Sigarms any longer. On Sigarms web site, the only 220 with a stainless frame I can find is the 220 Elite Stainless, which is not (and probably will not be) California approved.

If this analysis is correct, then the only way for a Californian to participate in this would be to find a stainless 220 on the used market (perhaps including Sig CPO, but I find it unlikely to find a stainless gun among the law enforcement trade-ins).

Is this correct?

While we are at it: How difficult would it be to do have Bar-Sto make a few 5.5" barrels, and perform the conversion on the long-slide version of the P220 stainless?

quote:

Originally posted by frankinaug:
Can this work be done to a 220ST elite model as well??

Yes we can, we would change out the SRT system for the GGI reduced reset system. We definitely like the beaver tail and I feel it would be a great addition to the 10mm caliber.

I was just wondering; since there is a conversion 9mm barrel availave for P226 .40s&w (that works with .40 slide). Wouldn't it be possible to make a 10mm conversion barrel that would work with P220 .45 slide? (so no mods would be required to the gun) What do you guys think?