We were discussing which pistols would handle steel case ammo. The ones we came up with are the Glock, the HK USP, the Walther P 99, Walther PPQ, Sig 320, S&W M&P and the Ruger 1911 ( it says it is ok right in their manual). In all of the afore mentioned pistol I shot steel case through and seen others should a lot of steel case without any problems ( especially the Glocks) The one pistol I do not know anything about is the Sig 226. Is is strong enough to handle steel case ammo?
I have shot many cases of steel 9 and 45, most if not all Russian. My only gripe is some of the powder burns kinds dirty. It seems to be loaded to the lower end of the power range, but I haven't chronographed any, so that is just by feel. Most of the world's military has used steel cases for a long time. I suspect we would too, except the copper industry has a lot of political power.
Posts: 1496 | Location: North Carolina | Registered: June 16, 2004
It's not a matter of a gun being "strong enough to handle steel cased ammo". There's way too much interweb hyperbole about "steel ammo breaking guns" and 'steel-on-steel destroying your gun parts". Various militaries have used steel cased ammo for over a hundred years.
Not all steel is created equal. There are hundreds/thousands of different steel formulations out there in the world, with different properties for different purposes. The kind of mild steel used in ammo casings has a similar hardness rating to the brass used in ammo casings. That means it's relatively soft and malleable. Whereas the types of hardened steel used in gun parts are significantly harder. You're not going to "wear out" your gun parts using steel cased ammo, any more than you do with brass cased ammo.
Besides, things like barrels and extractors are wear items, and any time you shoot with any kind of ammo - brass or steel - you're causing wear. Deal with it. They will all wear out eventually when you're shooting a certain high volume, which most people don't do outside of frequent serious training or competition. And even if steel cased ammo were to happen to wear these items out slightly more quickly (at say 18k rounds instead of 20k rounds), as jljones pointed out, you'd still be ahead in the long run on money saved on steel ammo vs. money spent on slightly more frequent replacement of wear parts.
The only real differences between steel cases and brass cases are:
1) Steel is cheaper than brass, so the ammo is less expensive,
2) Unlike brass, steel is susceptible to rust, so has to be protected with some sort of coating (typically either lacquer or polymer), and
3) Steel is slightly less flexible than brass, so it doesn't expand quite as readily to fully seal the chamber during firing, so the gun internals (namely the chamber) foul slightly faster while firing steel cased ammo, from the additional amounts of dirty gas that squeezes out past the steel case.
That's it. A little money saved and a little extra cleaning. No massive risk of breakage. No excessive wear on parts. No locusts. No rivers of blood. No dogs and cats sleeping together. No mass hysteria.
Good Lord. This is definitely the most idiotic thing we argue about. 2 months ago I bought my standard quarterly supply. Tula, steel case, 123 US dollars per case of a thousand. Guys will argue they can get brass that cheap. No you can’t. Period and end of sentence. Not factory and I won’t shoot reman which is way more troublesome than steel.
The first cast alone saves you between 50-100 dollars. Just do the math. A couple cases in, if you were paranoid, you have saved enough to buy a factory barrel, extractor, and ejector, just in case. Of course you won’t need it anytime soon but if you are a scared, knock yourself out.
As for commie ammo. Who cares. Do you really think your WWB is being made in a clean room by trained gunpowder monkeys? Fuck, they are being cranked out by the billions in the cheapest possible way.
I will leave you with this. I have shot 10’s of thousands of commie ammo. A lot less than a bunch of guys like jones for sure. Enough to do damage if that is going to happen. You know the issues I have found? Exactly one. Steel case Tula binds up in non metal lined mags, I’m looking at you Magpul, in my glocks. That’s it. Went back to lined mags, even the shitty KCI ones, and problem goes away.
Edited to add: Arguing this is like arguing with libs. You get the same nonsensical, feelings argument with no evidence to back it up. Somebody eventually pulls out the lucky gunner (?) test with AR’s which as a test ranks right up there with beard guys torture test for pistols of water sand dirt and mud. There’s some flaws in the dialogue. Lol
True story, my brother was shooting his HK P2000 .40S&W at the local range with Wolf steel case/lacquer covered ammo. He blew thru a mag as fast as he could accurately shoot and mid way thru the casing glued itself to the chamber. However, we only knew that after we drove the barrel back with a brass punch. The slide was locked partially open and we had no idea if the round had fired or not. If you want cheap ammo, go for it. Myself, I will only shoot brass or nickel plated ammo.
---------- “Nobody can ever take your integrity away from you. Only you can give up your integrity.” H. Norman Schwarzkopf
Posts: 3257 | Location: OPSEC | Registered: July 06, 2006
Blume9mm I have seen Glocks digest countless steel case ammo and shot a lot of it through my Glocks. Is that a cheap gun? Now that being said I would not shoot steel case through any of my custom 1911s which I do consider expensive guns.
Some people have universal beliefs. Someone at some point told them “as fact” and they can’t let it go. Some are not grounded in any kind of logic or reality. That’s such the case with steel cases ammo.
Originally posted by The Viking: Blume9mm I have seen Glocks digest countless steel case ammo and shot a lot of it through my Glocks. Is that a cheap gun? Now that being said I would not shoot steel case through any of my custom 1911s which I do consider expensive guns.
Viking... I think you made my point very well with out me .... thanks...
Blume9mm Just so there is no misunderstanding a Glock is durable, reliable, dependable, simple and inexpensive. I do not consider it cheap. I consider it a bargain. A custom 1911 is $3,000+. That I consider that expensive. The Sig more fits the definition I gave to the Glock. Like I said I do not shoot steel case through expensive guns.
To the guy who asked price. Ammoman. I watch and wait. In a three month span it will always dip to 123 per case and I pounce for a couple three cases at a time. Currently they have bumped the price to 209. Still cheaper than brass but unless I run out I will wait.
As for stuck cases guy. I had a case stick just the same in my K9. Brass. It happens. Tight chamber, slightly oversi
I am one of the BRASS guys. Over the years I have just had more issues with steel cased stuff. That said those issues were probably more a matter of low quality control of the really cheap ammo combined with the extra friction still has in the magazines etc.
I did have some steel cases damn near hermetically seal themselves into a revolver one time. That was PITA.
I will shoot steel occasionally but I much prefer brass and will pay the extra to run it. For what its worth I don't really care for aluminum cased stuff either.
"Guns are tools. The only weapon ever created was man."