|The Blue Machine|
I’m interested in picking up a new gun, and have been looking at the Hellcat. I’m a Glock guy, but would,like something smaller, but still with good capacity. I tried the P365 (bought one, sold it - bought another, sold it too), but it’s not for me. The grip is too small front to back, and the grip angle feels very different from a Glock
I thought about a G43x, but it’s as tall as a G19, so I don’t think I’m going to go that route either.
So how about the Hellcat? What has your experience been with it? How is the grip? How does the grip angle compare to a Glock?
There is one or two for sale over here on the East side of Columbia at The Gun Vault. The grip is a touch bigger, to me it felt blockier than a 365.
I prefer my 26 Gen5 over all the other sub compacts. And I can use my existing mags!!
LOL, you do know that glock uses their own unique (wrong) grip angle, right? Nothing is going to feel "normal" to you unless its a glock. Be a glock fanboy 100% and get a 43 and deal with the inferior design (limited capacity), or get mag extensions.
I own and love my P365, and was shooting the Springfield Hellcat earlier this year to see how this competitive small beastie compared.
There is more to the gun than this, but I will tell you that when I shot it as a rental, it stung my wrist and the web between my thumb and fingers like a SOB every shot, and I turned it back in for a different rental gun after two magazines worth. Never had that happen before and I've shot a fair few different handguns.
I doubt this afflicts every hand - it couldn't for the Hellcat to be widely available -but I would strongly urge you to find a place to try it before you buy, in case it affects yours.
Now, other than the hand pain, it shot well and seemed pretty accurate. A couple folks at the range told me they owned Hellcats and liked theirs. So really, the only caveat is that if I were you, I'd take the time to find a rental to shoot and see if your hand likes the gun.
Comparing the Hellcat to the 365, since these days they're considered to be the closest 'natural' competitors at their end of the market and, as you said, you've got bench time with the little SIG (I'm presuming that you shot at least one of the two):
'Dirty' is my word that best describes the HC trigger action. Definitely to me it's not as good as what the SIG offers, or even regular XD/XDS/XDm guns for that matter. Winner: SIG. In addition, even the normally meh factory Glock triggers (where a heavy break is often most complained about) in the 43/43X/48 to me are significantly better than the HC's.
I'm pretty sure based on customer reactions that ergonomics plays better with the HC over the 365 for guys with larger hands. Conversely I don't have said large hands so the 365's ergonomics wins out for me; the Springfield feels a tad more blocky, chunky and overall the larger gun. Plus for whatever reason the little SIG's upright grip angle has not created any on-point sighting problem despite my three decade old Glock muscle memory, certainly nothing like the original pre-Xframe P320 does for me. The Hellcat does have a bit more angle in its grip than the SIG does; it may make a difference for you but for me it's a "non-determining" factor, if there's such a thing.
I like that the HC eliminates that silly grip safety that has sometimes been cited as a reliability problem in earlier Croatian product done for Springfield. Other than that, I still like and prefer the 365 over the HC because of its smaller dimensions and great shooting characteristics at the range. Most of our customers without a horse in this contest (i.e., brand loyalty) also prefer the 365 over the Hellcat when comparing them side-by-side. And our sales during placid, unstressed times reflected that preference, by a pronounced factor (over 6 to 1). That said I can't honestly say if this divide is a completely accurate reflection of the demand throughout however, since we had less trouble getting the 365 in than then still new-to-market Hellcat. But there were times when we had both Hellcats and 365s in at the same time and it was clearly the SIGs that were the movers.
Also there's the self-serving political baggage that Springfield Armory has over their heads from a couple or so years ago; only you can decide whether that's something to take into consideration or if it's now water under the bridge.
I have and carry the Hellcat having owned and sold 2 P365s. and retired a M.2 Shield.
Comments about the blocky feeling are a result of the true double stack mag but in my hands feels better than the Sig.
There is a bit more recoil with the HC but it's not abusive. I had a new trigger kit installed -Powder River Precision- and the trigger, IMO, is as smooth as I want.
I shoot it regularly but not hundreds of rounds per session.
I am about to have a red dot mounted rather than fight with my glasses.
Harsh but true!
If you are truly a dedicated Glock guy, other guns will not "point" naturally for you.
I shoot my best when I stick to a "family" of guns and get as grooved in to the trigger, grip angle and manipulation of controls as possible.
I concede that can take a little fun out of shooting though. The fun that comes with playing with dufferent guns.
OP, since you asked, here's my 2 cents;
My local indoor range had a Springfield Days weekend. I had the chance to shoot the Hellcat.
There was nothing that I liked about that gun. My buddy also shot it and said "eh, its o.k. but nothing special".
I'll say that even though I have owned more than a "few" different small 9mms and shot MANY more over the years, I am not really a fan of small 9mms.
Like usual, try to find a rental and check it out for yourself.
Good luck on your search for the next gun.
Tomorrow's battle is won during today's practice.
I've got to run here in a second so I'll just give you the quick version. I have an OSP model. I like it and will probably carry it when my F'n 507k finally gets here. It is snappier than a 365 (I wonder if this has to do with the standoff)but I like it and its quite accurate if you do your part which is a little harder with the tiny guns. The trigger is not as nice as the 365 but its fine. Grip angle seems normal and non glocky if that makes sense.
|The Blue Machine|
Thanks for the replies so far. Some guns don’t bother me as far as grip angle goes. I have and can easily shoot 1911’s and M&P’s with no issue, but with the P365, every time I presented it from the holster, it was pointed low, to such a degree that the front sight was buried.
I have a G43 now, but would like something with a little more capacity, hence looking at the P365, G43x, and the Hellcat. I’ll try to find one to shoot and see how I like it.
I can shoot my Hellcat almost as well as my M17 and can't get nearly as good of groups with the 365. Part of it is the sights and my eyes, and part of it is the grips and trigger. I'll sell my P365 with the True Precision barrel for the right price.
Had a 365 that worked. Trigger felt spongy to me. Accurate, easy to carry.
Got a hellcat and put the Shield dot on it. Using more dot guns these days. Perfect function. Good trigger. No issues with it or the dot at close to 1k rounds.
365 gives me a smaller package in the AZ summer. Hellcat lets me more precise at the same time. Keeping both.
was a guy next to me at the range shooting a hellcat .I asked his impressions of the little gun ,he said he was happy with the reliability but a little miffed with the point of aim Said he really didnt want to fool around with sights ,, I guess im like that too
Just an update now that my holosun 507k got mounted. I've been great with the HC and it's beginning to get me to phase out my G19 which is surprising, atleast for summer carry. The trigger seems to be smoothing out or maybe I'm just getting more used to it. Hitting at speed is very easy and it hides well. I'm really enjoying this gun so far. The dot on too does cut into the form factor a touch but I wouldn't trade the usefulness of the dot. It's nice having 11+1 in the gun and two reloads of 13 ready to go.
While at the range recently,
A Springfield employee had one.
It had a dot sight on it .
It looked tiny, but I have big hands.
His first 60 shots were less than acceptable at the 15, 20 and 30 ft. Lines
The second day he had taken the dot sight off and his groups shrunk by 50%.
I was shooting my XD and had absolutely no desire to try his Hellfire.
Can't imagine shooting that small of a gun with my size mitts
Safety, Situational Awareness and proficiency.
Neck Ties, Hats and ammo brass, Never ,ever touch'em w/o asking first
If you have really short fingers or tiny hands, the Hellcat is not a good pistol because if there is any initial side or angular trigger pressure, the safety lever locks against the frame and stops the trigger dead. So for example, I have super short sausage fingers. My trigger finger's end-digit rolls over the face of the trigger as I pull out the slack (at least most pistols). With my Glock 19, as I take up the slack in the trigger, with a bit of angular trigger pressure, my finger will finally roll over and engage the safety lever "after" the trigger is in rearward motion, and then it will fire; Even if the safety lever hits the frame, a little more trigger pressure will slide it past the frame and it will fire. With the Hellcat, the safety lever will catch on the frame as my short finger starts the to pull out the trigger slack with the slight side trigger pressure. This stops the trigger dead in its tracks and it wont fire at this point no matter how hard I squeeze the trigger (even directly on the trigger safety lever).
Obviously not an issue if you have bigger hands or longer fingers, but I don't unfortunately. I already have a p365, so I have this size and capacity covered. I do really like the sights on the Hellcat though.
I picked one up on Saturday. Only fired 100 rounds but here is my opinion. It feels a little snappier than my 43, but nothing terrible. I love the sights. The trigger to me felt like my g19 gen4. I did not experience the trigger not releasing with pressure on the side. I put heavy pressure on the side to test it and I had no problems. I have small hands and the gun fit well and I like the grip texture. So far I am really liking it.
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