quote:

Originally posted by bigdeal:

quote:

Originally posted by smithnsig:

quote:

Originally posted by cooger:
Does anyone know if having asthma leads to a higher risk of more severe symptoms?

Also, can people be reinfected with this if they get it and recover?

Yes and no.

"No". Has that been proven as fact at this point? I've read speculation that that's the case, but no confirmed medical decision that one can not be re-infected.

quote:

Originally posted by chellim1:
The really scary thing is... we are a service based economy and a lot of those jobs aren't coming back. Many people will be unable to afford many services which will have a cascading effect.

quote:

Originally posted by bigdeal:

quote:

Originally posted by TXJIM:
China is fucked and this will cost them dearly in the long run in both conscious trade retribution and unintended consequences. This whole issue has exposed the danger of a supply chain without diversity.

Some decisions to pull production of goods, pharmaceuticals and healthcare supplies/equipment will be done out of anger over the chicom actions and some will be pulled because it's smart given what we have learned from this crisis. Either way, China is going to lose a lot of money in the long run and rightfully so. It's a shame it took a pandemic for the world, and the US in particular, to see the folly in relying so heavily on a bunch of fucking commies.

Got any money you're willing to wager? My bet is once this passes and is in the rear view efforts will be made my some Repub's in Washington to separate us from China. My prediction...majorities of both parties will demonize those efforts, calling them xenophobic and racist, and fight tooth and nail to oppose them given how much their personal fortunes hinge on Chicom dealings. and I believe that same paradigm will exist in governments around the world that have effectively been bankrolled by the Chinese.

quote:

There will be changes to the supply chain based on the obvious vulnerabilities exposed recently. How big those changes are will be somewhat influenced by the factors you outlined but there will be changes and it will hurt China's bottom line significantly.

quote:

Originally posted by 6guns:
Hopefully we, as Americans at least, will get into the habit of looking for products made elsewhere. And with the help of President Trump to expedite a huge manufacturing growth in this country, it would (will) be easier.

quote:

Originally posted by Georgeair:

quote:

There will be changes to the supply chain based on the obvious vulnerabilities exposed recently. How big those changes are will be somewhat influenced by the factors you outlined but there will be changes and it will hurt China's bottom line significantly.

Duration.

It will be very interesting to see how long we can stay committed to that. Not the Sigforum we, the larger we.

1 year feels optimistic.

quote:

Originally posted by chellim1:
^^^ So the Metropolitan Sewer District (St. Louis) is probably crawling with the stuff...
Are you going to quarantine 1.5 million people? Without even testing individuals to see if they have it?
I should hope not.

Detroit? I'm sure the wastewater is full of it... Lock everybody up?

quote:

Originally posted by chellim1:
^^^ So the Metropolitan Sewer District (St. Louis) is probably crawling with the stuff...
Are you going to quarantine 1.5 million people? Without even testing individuals to see if they have it?
I should hope not.

Detroit? I'm sure the wastewater is full of it... Lock everybody up?

quote:

Originally posted by TXJIM:

quote:

Originally posted by bigdeal:

quote:

Originally posted by TXJIM:
China is fucked and this will cost them dearly in the long run in both conscious trade retribution and unintended consequences. This whole issue has exposed the danger of a supply chain without diversity.

Some decisions to pull production of goods, pharmaceuticals and healthcare supplies/equipment will be done out of anger over the chicom actions and some will be pulled because it's smart given what we have learned from this crisis. Either way, China is going to lose a lot of money in the long run and rightfully so. It's a shame it took a pandemic for the world, and the US in particular, to see the folly in relying so heavily on a bunch of fucking commies.

Got any money you're willing to wager? My bet is once this passes and is in the rear view efforts will be made my some Repub's in Washington to separate us from China. My prediction...majorities of both parties will demonize those efforts, calling them xenophobic and racist, and fight tooth and nail to oppose them given how much their personal fortunes hinge on Chicom dealings. and I believe that same paradigm will exist in governments around the world that have effectively been bankrolled by the Chinese.

You make great points but I did not say we, or anyone else, will stop doing business with China. There will be changes to the supply chain based on the obvious vulnerabilities exposed recently. How big those changes are will be somewhat influenced by the factors you outlined but there will be changes and it will hurt China's bottom line significantly.

Regardless of political retribution, private businesses will seek geographic and political redundancy in their supply chain. Surely they see now that putting all of their manufacturing eggs in one basket is just too risky. Will China fight like hell to stop that, of course, but they will lose money fighting to keep business and lose business despite those efforts.

quote:

Originally posted by bigdeal:

quote:

Originally posted by sdy:
NY and NJ have 49% of the total U.S. "China virus" confirmed cases.

Throw in California and Washington state and I wonder what the percentage would be.

quote:

https://www.npr.org/sections/h...ll-covid-19-patients

Most coronavirus patients who end up on ventilators go on to die, according to several small studies from the U.S., China and Europe.

And yet again, these are the types of stories I really take issue with. So what's the takeaway of this story? A large majority of the people placed on ventilators do not recover, or they die. And? The author makes zero effort to provide the rest of the picture. I'm plucking these numbers purely out of the air to try and make a point, but let's say 50% of the people placed on ventilators die. That stat provides you with about 10% of the picture. How many total people were placed on vents and what percentage of corona positive people does that represent? Additionally, what percentage of the total population do the number of people placed on vents and died represent. My bet is the answer to both those questions is a very, very, small percentage. Is it horrible that these people die? Absolutely. But its even more horrible if we lose perspective on this whole issue and continue making bad decisions based on incomplete or faulty analysis.

Again, as I noted previously in this thread, living inside numbers and statistical modeling has been a huge portion of my adult life, and I see through stories like this very quickly. The underlying goal of this article is to scare the hell out of people. I do not believe we accomplish much of anything positive by doing that. But I absolutely know the underlying goals and where this leads...

quote:

Originally posted by bigdeal:

quote:

Originally posted by TXJIM:

quote:

Originally posted by bigdeal:

quote:

Originally posted by TXJIM:
China is fucked and this will cost them dearly in the long run in both conscious trade retribution and unintended consequences. This whole issue has exposed the danger of a supply chain without diversity.

Some decisions to pull production of goods, pharmaceuticals and healthcare supplies/equipment will be done out of anger over the chicom actions and some will be pulled because it's smart given what we have learned from this crisis. Either way, China is going to lose a lot of money in the long run and rightfully so. It's a shame it took a pandemic for the world, and the US in particular, to see the folly in relying so heavily on a bunch of fucking commies.

Got any money you're willing to wager? My bet is once this passes and is in the rear view efforts will be made my some Repub's in Washington to separate us from China. My prediction...majorities of both parties will demonize those efforts, calling them xenophobic and racist, and fight tooth and nail to oppose them given how much their personal fortunes hinge on Chicom dealings. and I believe that same paradigm will exist in governments around the world that have effectively been bankrolled by the Chinese.

You make great points but I did not say we, or anyone else, will stop doing business with China. There will be changes to the supply chain based on the obvious vulnerabilities exposed recently. How big those changes are will be somewhat influenced by the factors you outlined but there will be changes and it will hurt China's bottom line significantly.

Regardless of political retribution, private businesses will seek geographic and political redundancy in their supply chain. Surely they see now that putting all of their manufacturing eggs in one basket is just too risky. Will China fight like hell to stop that, of course, but they will lose money fighting to keep business and lose business despite those efforts.

And again, I would assert that when all this is over, politicos will fight tooth and nail to change anything, even maybe going so far as to pass legislation making it illegal for private industry to pull back out of China. All the while, the public will return to their "I want it now and I want it cheap" approach to purchasing. I really hate to say it, but maybe if the death toll in this country did reach the projections the "experts" are throwing around, maybe then we'd see a paradigm shift pushed into being by the public in this country.

I personally do not want to see "supply chain changes" alone occur. I want to see the global community come together in a focused cumulative approach to destroying the Chinese economy. There are many economists who claim the Chinese economy is a paper tiger and vulnerable to economic impacts. I say lets see just how accurate their analysis is and let's see if we can push the Chinese economy over the edge and into virtual default. They deserve nothing less for what they've done to the world with this bug, as well as their other deceitful behavior across the spectrum.

quote:

Originally posted by bigdeal:
With all due respect, I think the areas you referred to should probably be closed down for a multitude of reasons.

No, I was simply suggesting that if testing of effluent showed high signs of Covid matter, then testing could be specifically targeted to the areas creating that effluent and decisions could eb made from there as to how to deal with the findings.

quote:

Originally posted by chellim1:

quote:

Originally posted by bigdeal:
With all due respect, I think the areas you referred to should probably be closed down for a multitude of reasons.

No, I was simply suggesting that if testing of effluent showed high signs of Covid matter, then testing could be specifically targeted to the areas creating that effluent and decisions could eb made from there as to how to deal with the findings.

Well,... I can save you the trouble then. I'm sure the effluent matter will show high signs of Covid matter. But my point is, what difference does that make? Those places are already performing individual testing at maximum capacity, so they can't increase it.

quote:

Originally posted by wreckdiver:
What is going on? Loads of Youtube video's showing hospitals in big urban areas being empty, I just don't know what to believe.

My cousin says they are showing video's from Italy to depict NYC, WTF????

I'm not a chicken little kind of guy, but all this has me spooked :shrugs:

quote:

Originally posted by medic451:

quote:

Originally posted by wreckdiver:
What is going on? Loads of Youtube video's showing hospitals in big urban areas being empty, I just don't know what to believe.

My cousin says they are showing video's from Italy to depict NYC, WTF????

I'm not a chicken little kind of guy, but all this has me spooked :shrugs:

The last 2 weeks hospitals in LA County have been pretty quiet as well, but this week we started to swing back to normal patient levels. Most doctors think by the end of the month every hospital bed in the County will be occupied.

quote:

Originally posted by bigdeal:

quote:

Originally posted by TXJIM:

quote:

Originally posted by bigdeal:

quote:

Originally posted by TXJIM:
China is fucked and this will cost them dearly in the long run in both conscious trade retribution and unintended consequences. This whole issue has exposed the danger of a supply chain without diversity.

Some decisions to pull production of goods, pharmaceuticals and healthcare supplies/equipment will be done out of anger over the chicom actions and some will be pulled because it's smart given what we have learned from this crisis. Either way, China is going to lose a lot of money in the long run and rightfully so. It's a shame it took a pandemic for the world, and the US in particular, to see the folly in relying so heavily on a bunch of fucking commies.

Got any money you're willing to wager? My bet is once this passes and is in the rear view efforts will be made my some Repub's in Washington to separate us from China. My prediction...majorities of both parties will demonize those efforts, calling them xenophobic and racist, and fight tooth and nail to oppose them given how much their personal fortunes hinge on Chicom dealings. and I believe that same paradigm will exist in governments around the world that have effectively been bankrolled by the Chinese.

You make great points but I did not say we, or anyone else, will stop doing business with China. There will be changes to the supply chain based on the obvious vulnerabilities exposed recently. How big those changes are will be somewhat influenced by the factors you outlined but there will be changes and it will hurt China's bottom line significantly.

Regardless of political retribution, private businesses will seek geographic and political redundancy in their supply chain. Surely they see now that putting all of their manufacturing eggs in one basket is just too risky. Will China fight like hell to stop that, of course, but they will lose money fighting to keep business and lose business despite those efforts.

And again, I would assert that when all this is over, politicos will fight tooth and nail to change anything, even maybe going so far as to pass legislation making it illegal for private industry to pull back out of China. All the while, the public will return to their "I want it now and I want it cheap" approach to purchasing. I really hate to say it, but maybe if the death toll in this country did reach the projections the "experts" are throwing around, maybe then we'd see a paradigm shift pushed into being by the public in this country.

I personally do not want to see "supply chain changes" alone occur. I want to see the global community come together in a focused cumulative approach to destroying the Chinese economy. There are many economists who claim the Chinese economy is a paper tiger and vulnerable to economic impacts. I say lets see just how accurate their analysis is and let's see if we can push the Chinese economy over the edge and into virtual default. They deserve nothing less for what they've done to the world with this bug, as well as their other deceitful behavior across the spectrum.