A drone, for one.

quote:

Originally posted by arabiancowboy:

The USAF screwed up years ago not investing in A10 upgrades. Too much faith in F35 promises which have fallen short. But we can't simply "turn on" the A10 assembly line. Its gone forever. That's why the USAF keep trying to decommission A10s- they're breaking and fixing them is harder & more expensive each time. Hopefully we get funding for LAA and more AC130Js. The video is cool, but frankly a 30mm strafe isn't the option most GFCs/JTACs/pilots would recommend for that target.... AGM-114R4 on the roof is more common because its more likely to grant first pass lethality.

?
The Air Force did spend a ton of money on A-10 upgrades. In the mid-2000s they upgraded A-10s to "C" models ushering the plane into the 21st century. If the Air Force hadn't upgraded when it did, the planes undoubtedly would have been scrapped by now because they would have been next to useless in a modern theater.

And I don't care what a jtac would prefer, dead is dead and it's a helluva lot cheaper to do it with 30mm than a six figure hellfire.

quote:

Originally posted by AirmanJeff:

quote:

Originally posted by arabiancowboy:

The USAF screwed up years ago not investing in A10 upgrades. Too much faith in F35 promises which have fallen short. But we can't simply "turn on" the A10 assembly line. Its gone forever. That's why the USAF keep trying to decommission A10s- they're breaking and fixing them is harder & more expensive each time. Hopefully we get funding for LAA and more AC130Js. The video is cool, but frankly a 30mm strafe isn't the option most GFCs/JTACs/pilots would recommend for that target.... AGM-114R4 on the roof is more common because its more likely to grant first pass lethality.

?
The Air Force did spend a ton of money on A-10 upgrades. In the mid-2000s they upgraded A-10s to "C" models ushering the plane into the 21st century. If the Air Force hadn't upgraded when it did, the planes undoubtedly would have been scrapped by now because they would have been next to useless in a modern theater.

And I don't care what a jtac would prefer, dead is dead and it's a helluva lot cheaper to do it with 30mm than a six figure hellfire.

Two things- first the “upgraded” A10 is beneath the interoperability desired. Most of these strikes require real time FMV to approve (not the case with CAS, where the A 10 really shines). A10s broadcast FMV LOS, which means someone else needs to pick up that LOS signal and send it BLOS to a JOC where the commander can approve it. That means manned/unmanned ISR needs to be there in order to use an A10 to strike during a non-CAS event like the OP. So upgraded cockpit, sure. But not what we need for the job we’re asking it to do.

Second, sure 30mm is cheaper than an 80k hellfire. But flight hours on the A10 are more expensive than flight hours on armed manned and unmanned ISR strike aircraft that shoot hellfires or griffins. When you add it all up, including the cost of a tanker so the A10 can stay on station until the target is vulnerable, this is an extremely expensive, logistically complicated, and tactically dicey way to do business when compared to LAA, armed drones, or AFSOC.

Just my opinion, and I could be wrong. But I have over a dozen deployments flying ISR strike and co-wrote a graduate paper on advantages of light attack aircraft: LAA (with an A10 pilot) so it’s an informed opinion.

Dude I love A10s. If I was on the ground under fire that is certainly what I’d want, in addition to an AC130, watching my ass. And I would not want an RPA with 2-4 Hellfires as a replacement. But for shooting a few dudes in a car 200NM from anywhere, and we have to wait 6 hours for them to drive.... there are better solutions than A10. still awesome to see those smoking holes though!

quote:

Originally posted by 4MUL8R:
Maybe I missed it, but what asset can video the attack and then remain overhead to confirm destroyed target? Digital zoom, high resolution from some altitude. What would it be?

satellite with real time video feed...

quote:

Originally posted by smlsig:

quote:

Originally posted by 4MUL8R:
Maybe I missed it, but what asset can video the attack and then remain overhead to confirm destroyed target? Digital zoom, high resolution from some altitude. What would it be?

satellite with real time video feed...

You've been reading too many Tom Clancy novels. Satellites have the technical capability, but they're not going to be used to call in a strike on some cheesedick Taliban grunt.

As sigmonkey said, it's either a drone or a helicopter.

You're right, this is not the ideal mission for an A-10. This is definitely drone turf. And drones are cheaper per flight hour. But I would argue that the A-10s usefulness in that theater, overall, makes it worth having them in the air for whatever should go down.

And the same effect could be had if the drone pickled off a Hellfire. Now Hellfires are expensive, but how expensive is operating the Warthog, and how many $$$$ a shot is the GAU-8.

I wouldn't mind the AF, or even the Army, bring back some OV-10s, update with modern technology, and carrying Hellfires, and a .50 Gatling Gun. Would do most of the same job the A-10s and other jets are doing in the sandbox, but be a lot cheaper to operate.

quote:

Originally posted by Orguss:

quote:

Originally posted by smlsig:

quote:

Originally posted by 4MUL8R:
Maybe I missed it, but what asset can video the attack and then remain overhead to confirm destroyed target? Digital zoom, high resolution from some altitude. What would it be?

satellite with real time video feed...

You've been reading too many Tom Clancy novels. Satellites have the technical capability, but they're not going to be used to call in a strike on some cheesedick Taliban grunt.

As sigmonkey said, it's either a drone or a helicopter.

quote:

Originally posted by BBMW:
I wouldn't mind the AF, or even the Army, bring back some OV-10s, update with modern technology, and carrying Hellfires, and a .50 Gatling Gun.

Heck, we can't even get Ford to actually bring back the Bronco.

quote:

Originally posted by BBMW:


I wouldn't mind the AF, or even the Army, bring back some OV-10s, update with modern technology, and carrying Hellfires, and a .50 Gatling Gun. Would do most of the same job the A-10s and other jets are doing in the sandbox, but be a lot cheaper to operate.

A few years ago, that happened:
https://www.cnn.com/2016/03/11...inst-isis/index.html

A pair of nearly 50-year-old planes has been brought out of retirement to fight ISIS.
The Vietnam-era OV-10 Bronco turbo-propeller planes are part of an experiment to see if "light turbo-prop aircraft" are more effective in conducting counterinsurgency operations, a U.S. military representative told CNN this week.
During their deployment, the planes flew 120 combat missions against ISIS targets as part of the counter-ISIS coalition, said spokesman Capt. Bryant Davis of U.S. Central Command, which oversees military operations in the Middle East.

quote:

Originally posted by gearhounds:
Loved the gratuitous second burst...

Helping ensure the Pentagon doesn't have to spend $ destroying expired ammo!

Boeing pitched a modernized version to the AF, the OV-10X. Same basic airframe with modernized systems. In places like the various sandboxes we've been fighting in, they'd be very useful. Basically a attack helicopter with better speed range and capacity.

Edit: What an updated OV-10 would look like

http://www.ov-10bronco.net/Tec...nfo_card_2009_01.pdf

quote:

Originally posted by Sgt Neutron:

quote:

Originally posted by BBMW:


I wouldn't mind the AF, or even the Army, bring back some OV-10s, update with modern technology, and carrying Hellfires, and a .50 Gatling Gun. Would do most of the same job the A-10s and other jets are doing in the sandbox, but be a lot cheaper to operate.

A few years ago, that happened:
https://www.cnn.com/2016/03/11...inst-isis/index.html

A pair of nearly 50-year-old planes has been brought out of retirement to fight ISIS.
The Vietnam-era OV-10 Bronco turbo-propeller planes are part of an experiment to see if "light turbo-prop aircraft" are more effective in conducting counterinsurgency operations, a U.S. military representative told CNN this week.
During their deployment, the planes flew 120 combat missions against ISIS targets as part of the counter-ISIS coalition, said spokesman Capt. Bryant Davis of U.S. Central Command, which oversees military operations in the Middle East.

Just a fantasy, but I think that it would be awesome if the USAF were to deploy an updated P-47 Thunderbolt. I love watching the Jugs tear up those german trains. Makes me feel warm and fuzzy thinking of the Taliban being shredded by eight .50 cals. Any thoughts Arabiancowboy?

In a lot of ways, the A-10 IS an updated Thunderbolt. It was made by the descendant of the company that built the P-47, and it's official "nickname" is the Thunderbolt II.

Of course the P-47 was a very good dogfighter and a very good CAS platform. Given the way combat aircraft have developed, I don't think you're ever going to see that combination again.

quote:

Originally posted by mr kablammo:
Just a fantasy, but I think that it would be awesome if the USAF were to deploy an updated P-47 Thunderbolt. I love watching the Jugs tear up those german trains. Makes me feel warm and fuzzy thinking of the Taliban being shredded by eight .50 cals. Any thoughts Arabiancowboy?