SIGforum.com Main Page The Lounge I may be late to the party, but I did not know that oil change places sell your personal data to insurance companies
Main Page The Lounge I may be late to the party, but I did not know that oil change places sell your personal data to insurance companiesGo | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
Member |
Man, lots of hate for insurance companies in this thread. Funny how there's 1 thread with people thrilled to support capitalism by buying an iPhone X for $999 (that cost crApple $370 in materials) and then have this thread where people loathe capitalistic insurance companies for trying to turn a profit and stop people from claiming discounts they don't qualify for. Boggles the mind. At any rate, the issue of this thread may not be an issue at all. Most states require oil change, maintenance, repairs, inspections, etc. to be reported to the state. That information is compiled and generally available on websites...sometimes available to the public at no cost. TX has a site (that you can Google for yourself) that you can input your VIN and every time your mileage was reported to the state shows up...free of charge. Insurance companies are more than likely using avenues such as this for their data (as opposed to paying for it which would hurt their profits). | |||
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Info Guru |
Provide some evidence for this statement, please. Most states require your personal information to be reported to the state? “Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.” - John Adams | |||
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Member |
What states require this? I've never heard of it. "The people hate the lizards and the lizards rule the people." "Odd," said Arthur, "I thought you said it was a democracy." "I did," said Ford, "it is." "So," said Arthur, hoping he wasn't sounding ridiculously obtuse, "why don't the people get rid of the lizards?" "It honestly doesn't occur to them. They've all got the vote, so they all pretty much assume that the government they've voted in more or less approximates the government they want." "You mean they actually vote for the lizards." "Oh yes," said Ford with a shrug, "of course." "But," said Arthur, going for the big one again, "why?" "Because if they didn't vote for a lizard, then the wrong lizard might get in." | |||
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Sigforum K9 handler |
 Show me where in state or federal law that I'm required to buy an iPhone. To the point, the penalty is enforcement by a government gun if I don't buy an iPhone. Until that time, your point is a straw man argument at best, and laughable at the least! Those poor, poor insurance companies.  Hey, it wasn't too long ago we were told that it wasn't a tax to be forced to buy their product!And not to mention that Texas requires it's subjects to report mileage and other information. Those in compliance will have nothing to fear. | |||
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| Member |
You guys are really pushing the limits on what is personal information. A vehicle's odometer is NOT personal information - it's not your SSN, your DOB, your mother's maiden name, or anything that would remotely be considered personal information. Is the amount of electricity your residence used last year personal information? I don't know why I asked that...some of you would still say yes. Even if the information is not reported by maintenance and repairs, it is definitely reported to the state when you title the vehicle and more often than not when you register/re-register the vehicle. So either way, the state is getting the vehicles odometer information. Anyway, my original point was that,, the oil change places are probably NOT selling the info to insurance companies - they're providing it to the state. Usually this information is used for emissions/pollution reporting (so the state knows how much pollutants are going into the air). Completely harmless info but shared. | |||
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| Member |
Ok, I'll concede your point that purchasing an iPhone is not compulsory while automobile insurance is. So, if having private insurance companies is the wrong, what's your solution to make it right? We're driving down the road and you hit my Jeep. You're legally obligated to put me in a pre-loss condition because you're at fault. You have no insurance because there's no law for compulsory auto insurance requiring you to have it. Am I just stuck paying for fixing my car myself?! Is everyone required to have $25K in their bank account before they can get a license? | |||
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| Info Guru |
OK, so there is no requirement by any state that says that oil change places, maintenance or any other records be reported to the state. That's exactly what I thought. No, oil change places are not 'giving' this information to the state, they are selling it for profit to insurance companies. If you are going to make claims that there are laws or requirements from states to provide this information you need to provide a link to a source, because I can tell you that no such requirements exist. And yes, the vehicle I own and any information about it is my personal, private information with the exception of any state requirements. Here in TN there is no state requirement for inspections or giving them mileage information when registered, so insurance companies could not get that information from that source because it does not exist and is not shared. “Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.” - John Adams | |||
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Nullus Anxietas |
So, speaking of Big Brother: Registered at MoPar, today, for my new-to-me Jeep. Imagine my surprise to find the mileage value for my Jeep was up-to-date. I don't mean up-to-date as in when I bought it. I mean as of today. "America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system,,,, but too early to shoot the bastards." -- Claire Wolfe "If we let things terrify us, life will not be worth living." -- Seneca the Younger, Roman Stoic philosopher | |||
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Told cops where to go for over 29 years… |
Ok, to really cut it down to basics, the idea of “insurance” was meant to be pooled money to cover damages on shared risk. Essentially, that would suggest premiums minus costs and overhead should roughly equal payouts. Not saying “non-profit” but kind of like the old savings and loan bank or a credit union where the deposits were used to fund the loans and the interest on the loans covered expenses as well as paying interest to depositors. A mutually beneficial, symbiotic relationship with a direct connection between the two sides. Instead there is little connection to premiums and payouts. Premium money is used to buy capital, invested, acquire property, etc. the goal is to maximize profits and payout as little as possible in order to continue to build wealth. Payouts are not covered by premiums, but instead by a fraction of the earnings on the investments. Unlike a savings and loan though, none of those earnings come back to the insured unless they actually suffer a loss (or are also a stock holder) It is like roulette, you bet every month on a variety of things and then spin the wheel. Once in a rare while you hit your number and the house pays. EXCEPT, unlike roulette, after the house pays you are then forced to pay it back by being required to bet MORE every month since you previously “won”. I would like to see some sort of a car insurance co-op like we are starting to see with medical share programs. Of course I imagine it would be illegal as the insurance industry lobbyists would make sure it could never get off the ground. Fuckers... What part of "...Shall not be infringed" don't you understand???  | |||
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| Member |
My Chevy Trax regularly e-mails me a full vehicle report, right down to tire pressure. It also e-mails its location to my family regularly. Who knows how many others get the same info? End of Earth: 2 Miles Upper Peninsula: 4 Miles | |||
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| Nullus Anxietas |
Or credit unions. Yeah, that'd be nice.
With enough public pressure/sentiment it would be inevitable. Only needs to happen in one state, just like shall-issue started, and we'd be off to the races. But, should that ever happen, don't be surprised if it doesn't end up looking a lot like what's currently available. As in the case of the guy who got caught under-reporting mileage: People will cheat "their own" insurance co-ops, necessitating the co-ops eventually having to resort to many of the same methods for-profit insurance companies do, to remain solvent.
When I told my wife about the mileage thing she responded "They probably know where your Jeep is, too."
*nod* I don't mind if FCA collects that info for my use and for "product improvement" purposes. Don't mind at all. I would mind if they shared/sold any of it to third parties. "America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system,,,, but too early to shoot the bastards." -- Claire Wolfe "If we let things terrify us, life will not be worth living." -- Seneca the Younger, Roman Stoic philosopher | |||
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| Sigforum K9 handler |
No one here says that private insurance companies are wrong. EVERYONE is saying that having private insurance is wrong when all of their enforcement is done by the government. Private insurance companies are great, but the racket that their lobbying the government and FORCING people to buy it isn't. If someone hits your Jeep, just like in ANY scope of society, the other party if at fault is responsible. We have a WHOLE civil court system that deals with that. Why should non-payment of damage to your Jeep be any different? The answer is no easy. The insurance companies have convinced you that you need them more than they need you, and you've bought into the notion. What do insurance companies do? They sue the uninsured, or other insurance company if a pennies on the dollar solution (that is the pennies on the dollar that you get, they get to keep your money that you paid) can be found. I'm unsure why anyone would believe that this is a good system. (well aside from the insurance companies and those who work for them). OMG, that sounds like work on the property owners part? How in the world can we take time out of our youtube watchin', Twatter twittin', Facebook live streamin', day to wade through the complexity of the court system? Guess what? The cool thing about a free market is that it finds solutions to problems JUST LIKE THAT. Most likely in the form of an attorney doing it for you for a percentage. Which likely would be less than what the insurance company gets. Yep, it is that easy. Plus, no one is saying that you can't have insurance if you want to have insurance. If insurance companies were told to step off by the government tomorrow, they would still require you to have uninsured motorist coverage. If you want to have private insurance, that is fine and dandy. The government needs to step out of being their enforcers, and leave the insurance companies to be their own enforcers through the civil court system. Right now, they have a racket, that they have carefully lobbied for over the years, that forces the consumer, under penalty of a government gun, to buy their product. And there is little oversight to what they charge, how they conduct themselves, or the rules that they have lobbied for to screw over the consumer. Thanks to Obama, the medical insurance companies are now in this scam too. Get the government out of the insurance business. Break up the racket. | |||
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Sound and Fury |
You don't have to have insurance, at least in this state. You only have to have proof of financial responsibility. And so states are "no fault," where you carry insurance for your own protection. I'm pretty libertarian, but as you know, traffic accidents are bloody common. So the externalities IMO justify some action by the government. "I've spoken of the shining city all my political life, but I don't know if I ever quite communicated what I saw when I said it. But in my mind it was a tall proud city built on rocks stronger than oceans, wind-swept, God-blessed, and teeming with people of all kinds living in harmony and peace, a city with free ports that hummed with commerce and creativity, and if there had to be city walls, the walls had doors and the doors were open to anyone with the will and the heart to get here." -- Ronald Reagan, Farewell Address, Jan. 11, 1989 Si vis pacem para bellum There are none so blind as those who refuse to see. Feeding Trolls Since 1995 | |||
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| Sigforum K9 handler |
^^^^ That would be great. Here YOU HAVE TO HAVE insurance. Or else. If you let your insurance lapse, not only will the government fine you and take your stuff, put you in jail, they will also suspend your driver license, cancel and revoke your tags, make you ineligible for any other state licenses until such time that you have paid the insurance coffers their due. | |||
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| Sigforum K9 handler |
Let me hit this from another way- The current system requiring people to buy insurance serves- The insurance companies, first and foremost, the government, and then in a distant third place is the people. First offense driving without insurance is a $500 fine. Goes to the state's general fund. Second offense is a $1000 but not less than $2500. All of that money goes to......you guessed it.....the state's general fund. Having to get the driver's license, tags, professional licenses reinstated goes to.......yep.....the states general fund. And it does ZERO to stop people from driving without insurance, and the system penalizes those who do have insurance through higher rates of insurance they MUST buy, instead of it being a civil arrangement of the amount of insurance needed by the lender, or the property owner, if at all. You want to do something about the bloody accidents where no insurance is involved? Easy fix. Make it a felony with a mandatory sentence of 5-10 with 85 percent of that incarceration if you cause serious physical injury or death with no insurance in force at the time of the collision. Boom. Problem solved. (To this date, mandatory insurance hasn't stopped a single bloody crash.) No one here is using quite the same argument as the gun grabbers, but a lot of the arguments sound similar. You have to buy the expensive insurance that maybe you don't need because someone MAY need it. Instead of if I don't have it, punish me. No amount of laws are going to stop those who don't want to follow the rule of society. Stop punishing me to make society feel better about itself that it is "doing something". Something else that I would immediately change is that the police would stop working directly for the insurance companies. IE- The insurance companies set what the police do. If it were up to me, the police would not investigate ANY non-injury crashes. The parties involved would swap information or file a mail in report. But, in the interest of the insurance companies, and to make their jobs easier, in the Commonwealth a report MUST be completed if- There is other than vehicle property damage, injury, or greater than $500 damage to either vehicle. Yeah, you scratch the paint and that constitutes $500 worth of damage. It is all rigged to make the insurance companies more money. | |||
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| Told cops where to go for over 29 years… |
I’m with Jones. Jail time for the deadbeats who are at fault and don’t/won’t take responsibility. In WA you are required to have insurance AND required to have uninsured/underinsured coverage as a part of it. Absolutely retarded, required to have coverage and then have additional coverage to cover incidents with those who don’t have the coverage required so you have to cover them as well. Fuckers.... What part of "...Shall not be infringed" don't you understand??? | |||
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| Told cops where to go for over 29 years… |
And now Oklahoma passing legislation to use license plate scanners to find and ticket mandatory insurance scofflaws... Kinda like red light or speeding cameras, but for insurance... http://oklahomawatch.org/2017/...o-automatic-tickets/ What part of "...Shall not be infringed" don't you understand??? | |||
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| Dances With Tornados |
Wow that's the first I've heard of this. I've seen a few of those little smart cars with the plate scanners cruising neighborhoods in the last few months. No one could tell me who they were or why they were cruising neighborhood streets. Maybe this was it. Oklahoma, like many states, has way too many drivers with no insurance. I'm told it's 1 in 4 have none. Some states have even worse percentages. It's a big problem. I was hit early summer by a bum with no insurance and with expired tag. I ended up paying my 1,0000 deductible and $350 car rental out of my own pocket. My insurance went after him, got nothing, turned it over to a collection agency who got nothing. Screw me. Something needs to be done. | |||
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SIGforum.com Main Page The Lounge I may be late to the party, but I did not know that oil change places sell your personal data to insurance companies
Main Page The Lounge I may be late to the party, but I did not know that oil change places sell your personal data to insurance companies© SIGforum 2024