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quote:
Originally posted by FN in MT:
quote:
To get "toned" you just need to lower your body fat percentage, the muscle is under there already. Focus on whole foods, cut out all breads, potatoes, pasta, sugar (and alcohol or severely limit it). Replace those empty carb cals with meat and veggies.


I would have to feel awfully damned good AFTERWARDS....to give all that up.


Some people give up years of life, or quality of life, or (literally) body parts...to keep eating that stuff.

In a way, you give it up now, to have it (and so much more) later. Assuming a person is overweight and un-healthy, and on a bad path; Make changes now, give up the carbs, sugar etc. and start a fitness plan. When you get healthier, some stuff can be added back in or enjoyed on occasion without it being an issue.

Maintaining a healthy weight range is a more lax nutrition plan than what you need to do to actively lose the fat. I eat about 80% good, so there is the 20% for the occasional beer, carb, dessert etc.

I honestly don't miss most of that stuff. I still enjoy alcohol (perhaps a tad too much). I didn't spend Thanksgiving eating just a salad and turkey. I had mashed potatoes, gravy, stuffing, pie etc. just like everyone else. I also am at a healthy weight to start and did an intermittent fast that day so it was my only meal (no, I wasn't "starving" and suffering before either).

In any case, anyone who truly wants to get "toned" will need to get their BF percentage at or below 10 (for men) and that is going to take some dedication.




“People have to really suffer before they can risk doing what they love.” –Chuck Palahnuik

The world's a dangerous place, we can help! http://portlandfirearmtraining.com/
 
Posts: 2863 | Location: Oregon | Registered: October 02, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Nullus Anxietas
Picture of ensigmatic
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quote:
Originally posted by Strambo:
To get "toned" you just need to lower your body fat percentage, the muscle is under there already. Focus on whole foods, cut out all breads, potatoes, pasta, sugar (and alcohol or severely limit it). Replace those empty carb cals with meat and veggies.

Yup.

I just signed up for a 21-day body fat challenge. I was at ±15% when I moved to this club from my old club a year ago. Got into bad habits (poor nutrition, inconsistent workout schedule). I'm now at ±21%. I plan to be down to at least 18% in 21 days, if not 17%.

Cut out all sugar two days ago. Put all the snacks away. Put the whisky away. Stocking up on "diet beer," and I'll have only the one with dinner. There'll be no candy, chocolate, cake, pie or ice cream at all. No chips. I'll reduce portions somewhat and not go back for seconds.

Been on a consistent weight training regimen for about two months. Adding cardio back Monday.




"America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system,,,, but too early to shoot the bastards." -- Claire Wolfe
 
Posts: 12347 | Location: S.E. Michigan | Registered: January 06, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
The Constable
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So what do You suggest a person DOES eat then.

I have no issues with the alcohol, same with potatoes. But the bread, sugar is going to be tough.

Assuming one can eat fish, chicken along with the meat?

I'm 67, 6'-2" and 210 pounds. NO health issues. I'm thinking of joining a health club for the Winter , so this thread is timely for me.

All I want to do is lose some weight, and get in better shape. I am probably more active than the average guy, but unless we have snow in the winter, which I shovel....I tend to gain some weight each winter. Walking the dog gets tougher, with snow, so I don't, etc. Hence the thought of a health club.

Any help appreciated.

FN in MT
 
Posts: 5249 | Location: Craig, MT | Registered: December 17, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by FN in MT:
So what do You suggest a person DOES eat then.

I have no issues with the alcohol, same with potatoes. But the bread, sugar is going to be tough.

Assuming one can eat fish, chicken along with the meat?

I'm 67, 6'-2" and 210 pounds. NO health issues. I'm thinking of joining a health club for the Winter , so this thread is timely for me.

All I want to do is lose some weight, and get in better shape. I am probably more active than the average guy, but unless we have snow in the winter, which I shovel....I tend to gain some weight each winter. Walking the dog gets tougher, with snow, so I don't, etc. Hence the thought of a health club.

Any help appreciated.

FN in MT


Hmmm, ditch or severely limit the sugar for sure. You could make 1 night per week "dessert night" and have something really good that day, make it count! Healthy things to eat are any and all veggies, all meats (including fish and poultry), nuts, fruits and healthy fats-olive oil, avocado, coconut (not vegetable, canola). I personally skew towards "Paleo" so I don't eat much dairy, grains, or beans. Tonight's dinner for example was all the Tri-tip I wanted and I fried up some bacon, brussel sprouts, purple cauliflower with garlic and an olive oil mayo siracha-lime sauce drizzle.

At your height and weight with no health issues, I think adding some resistance training and just minor nutrition tweaks would be fine. Maybe look into intermittent fasting, especially around holiday meals. Free weight or body weight training working into some decently heavy loads will also help maintain or re-gain bone density. Drinking milk is BS for that (and studies have shown no correlation with it helping with osteoperosis), but weight training is the bone density builder #1.




“People have to really suffer before they can risk doing what they love.” –Chuck Palahnuik

The world's a dangerous place, we can help! http://portlandfirearmtraining.com/
 
Posts: 2863 | Location: Oregon | Registered: October 02, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by FN in MT:
So what do You suggest a person DOES eat then.

I have no issues with the alcohol, same with potatoes. But the bread, sugar is going to be tough.

Assuming one can eat fish, chicken along with the meat?

I'm 67, 6'-2" and 210 pounds. NO health issues. I'm thinking of joining a health club for the Winter , so this thread is timely for me.

All I want to do is lose some weight, and get in better shape. I am probably more active than the average guy, but unless we have snow in the winter, which I shovel....I tend to gain some weight each winter. Walking the dog gets tougher, with snow, so I don't, etc. Hence the thought of a health club.

Any help appreciated.

FN in MT


I'm on the go a lot and never eat lunch at home. For lunch I'll do a 12" subway whole wheat sub with turkey or tuna (no mayo no cheese) but all the veggies I want..... or I'll do their 12" multigrain flatbread with egg whites and American cheese. Or, I'll do the pick 2 at Panera with a turkey sandwich and green goddess cobb with chicken salad. Or, I'll do 2 chicken ceaser wraps from Pollo Tropical.

For dinner I tend to skip carbs entirely. I'll have generally 12-16 ounces of Chicken breast grilled and either marinated in lite Italian dressing or terryaki, or bbq sauce on it. I'll do fish grilled with blackening seasoning.....again 12-16 ounces......tonight I grilled a prime 16 ounce NY strip, but that's once a week or less.......and then I'll go a ton of veggies with it.....very large salad, or 1.5 lbs of grilled zucchini with olive oil and garlic salt...... or a pound of steamed asparagus.....

I almost never eat cheese, butter, desserts (once a week), ice cream......

I went from 245lbs to 217lbs.....am 220 right now.......I'm 6'3 and 41......but haven't exercised in a while......I do some manual work for work......But just a change in diet and I dropped the weight and am never hungry. I just changed out things.....olive oil over butter......yogurt instead of ice cream.....etc.....I didn't cut out sugar just cut back on it.......
 
Posts: 14993 | Registered: June 12, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of SigSentry
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by ensigmatic:
quote:
Originally posted by Strambo:
To get "toned" you just need to lower your body fat percentage, the muscle is under there already. Focus on whole foods, cut out all breads, potatoes, pasta, sugar (and alcohol or severely limit it). Replace those empty carb cals with meat and veggies.

Yup.

I just signed up for a 21-day body fat challenge. I was at ±15% when I moved to this club from my old club a year ago. Got into bad habits (poor nutrition, inconsistent workout schedule). I'm now at ±21%. I plan to be down to at least 18% in 21 days, if not 17%.

Cut out all sugar two days ago. Put all the snacks away. Put the whisky away. Stocking up on "diet beer," and I'll have only the one with dinner. There'll be no candy, chocolate, cake, pie or ice cream at all. No chips. I'll reduce portions somewhat and not go back for seconds.

Been on a consistent weight training regimen for about two months. Adding cardio back Monday.


This was my breakfast this morning (It can protect itself). Before that coffee with 2 spoons of butter. Well on my way. Asthma symptoms decreasing every week. You don't need carbohydrates. You know you are adapted when you open the fridge and the butter looks good. This is working for me. Everyone is different but when my fasting glucose was 93 I linked insulin resistance to inflammation. Live by the pyramid and you will eventually look like the pyramid.



Jeff Volek: The many facets of keto-adaptation: health, performance, and beyond
https://youtu.be/n8BY4fyLvZc
 
Posts: 1988 | Registered: May 30, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Nullus Anxietas
Picture of ensigmatic
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quote:
Originally posted by Strambo:
Hmmm, ditch or severely limit the sugar for sure.

+1

That includes anything that says "added sugar" on the label.

quote:
Originally posted by Strambo:
You could make 1 night per week "dessert night" and have something really good that day, make it count!

When I'm on my normal fat-loss diet I make non-work-nights (Friday and Saturday) my splurge nights. On those nights I'd have real beer, have candy coffee after dinner, and some chocolate. (I won't be doing that now. 3-4% fat loss in 21 days will be challenging.)

quote:
Originally posted by Strambo:
I personally skew towards "Paleo" so I don't eat much dairy, grains, or beans.

I've never subscribed to diets that eliminate food groups. I eat a balanced diet, avoid the empty calories and control my portions.

quote:
Originally posted by Strambo:
...I think adding some resistance training and just minor nutrition tweaks would be fine.

The neat thing about weight training is it builds muscle (duh), which consume calories even at rest. Plus weight training builds bone density.

quote:
Originally posted by Strambo:
Maybe look into intermittent fasting, ...

Ha! I tried that. First the "600 calories two-days-a-week" method. I'd already hit 450 by noon, so that was a wash. Then I tried the "16-hours-a-day" method, where you eat nothing between the hours of 8 p.m. and noon the next day. (Water, black coffee and tea is ok.) I'd been working out in the mornings, so I ended up with carb headaches. Boy, did those ever suck Frown

I work out in the afternoons, now, so maybe I'll try that 16-hour one again on non-post-weight days.




"America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system,,,, but too early to shoot the bastards." -- Claire Wolfe
 
Posts: 12347 | Location: S.E. Michigan | Registered: January 06, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Experienced Slacker
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Forgive the drift, but what about the info presented here?:

Yeah, you kinda do need carbs


------------------------------
"There are FOUR lights!"
 
Posts: 5778 | Location: North Idaho | Registered: May 12, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Not a drift at all. Humans have no essential neef for carbohydrate, there is no known human carbohydrate deficiency disease. The food industry is about economics not science.

Google or Amazon Vilhjalmur Stefansson.

Prof. Tim Noakes.
https://youtu.be/fL5-9ZxamXc
 
Posts: 1988 | Registered: May 30, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Nullus Anxietas
Picture of ensigmatic
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quote:
Originally posted by SigSentry:
Not a drift at all. Humans have no essential neef for carbohydrate, ...

Tell that to the ex-body building competitor and nutritionist from whom I take much of my guidance.

And my wife, who's studied a fair bit on nutrition and health.

Then there are those carb headaches I got, which "mysteriously" cleared up after I put nutrition, incl. carbs, back into my morning diet.




"America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system,,,, but too early to shoot the bastards." -- Claire Wolfe
 
Posts: 12347 | Location: S.E. Michigan | Registered: January 06, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by ensigmatic:
quote:
Originally posted by SigSentry:
Not a drift at all. Humans have no essential neef for carbohydrate, ...

Tell that to the ex-body building competitor and nutritionist from whom I take much of my guidance.

And my wife, who's studied a fair bit on nutrition and health.

Then there are those carb headaches I got, which "mysteriously" cleared up after I put nutrition, incl. carbs, back into my morning diet.


Many have attributed that to low salt. 1 bullion cube is about 1g of salt. Everyone is different but it's amazing to see the switch in endurance runners and pro tour cyclists to a more fat-based metabolism.

More Volek.
https://youtu.be/tQbgdRoAfOo
 
Posts: 1988 | Registered: May 30, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
The Constable
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Jimmy123x & Strambo,

Thanks a lot Gentleman for the information. Going to give this a shot.

I'm assuming Tea or Coffee is OK. Only have a few cups of tea in the AM and maybe coffee in the aftn.

Eggs OK?

Anywhere I can go to read more on similar diet recommendations?

FN in MT
 
Posts: 5249 | Location: Craig, MT | Registered: December 17, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Spectemur Agendo
Picture of brecaidra
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Just adding a few thoughts:

Xylitol, Erythritol, and Stevia are acceptable substitutes for sugar if you are having a hard time giving up sweets. They are not artificial like sucralose, aspartame, and saccharine.

I think healthy carbs like wild rice, quinoa, oatmeal, etc. are fine; just don't have them at the same time as fats if you want to lose weight.

If you can't give up bread, go with a sprouted or true sourdough.




SIGforum's triple minority


"It can't rain all the time." - Eric Draven
 
Posts: 16656 | Location: IA | Registered: May 28, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by FN in MT:
Jimmy123x & Strambo,

Thanks a lot Gentleman for the information. Going to give this a shot.

I'm assuming Tea or Coffee is OK. Only have a few cups of tea in the AM and maybe coffee in the aftn.

Eggs OK?

Anywhere I can go to read more on similar diet recommendations?

FN in MT


Tea and coffee should be fine.....I eat egg whites, but there are various opinions on eggs. They should be fine, I went with egg whites because my cholesterol was high which spurred the whole weight loss thing. Also Kind Nut bars (not the granola ones) are pretty good for a sweet like snack, or RXbars (protein bar) are pretty good too. Nuts. I basically took my existing diet and substituted healthier stuff in place of the stuff I already eat......without going to some crazy new diet.
 
Posts: 14993 | Registered: June 12, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Originally posted by apprentice:
Forgive the drift, but what about the info presented here?:

Yeah, you kinda do need carbs


Wow, that article was way oversimplified and blew the supposed “dangers” of low carb way out of proportion. Ketoacidosis is lethal so if no carbs makes that happen how come we don’t see it all the time? (It is exceedingly rare, happening only in extreme circumstances, especially outside the diabetic population) How come our ancestors eating meat, twigs and berries, “fasting” perhaps for days didn’t all die off?

I don’t really want to drift the thread from fitness, someone can start a nutrition one. All I said in this thread was for fat loss; limit the carbs and ditch sugar, bread, pasta, fruit and white potatoes. Shouldn’t be much argument there, you wanna eat “complex” carbs as part of a healthy whole foods diet, go for it! Add fruit back in when you reach your target weight, sure, it is the only healthy thing in that list.

Oh, and please do some meaningful fitness routine!




“People have to really suffer before they can risk doing what they love.” –Chuck Palahnuik

The world's a dangerous place, we can help! http://portlandfirearmtraining.com/
 
Posts: 2863 | Location: Oregon | Registered: October 02, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Nullus Anxietas
Picture of ensigmatic
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quote:
Originally posted by Strambo:
I don’t really want to drift the thread from fitness, someone can start a nutrition one.

Which would no doubt include comments and questions about training, for the two are more-or-less inseperable, are they not?

Weight training, cardio, stretching, nutrition (which may include supplementation, depending upon ones goals/needs), adequate rest and mental well-being are all part of ones health.




"America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system,,,, but too early to shoot the bastards." -- Claire Wolfe
 
Posts: 12347 | Location: S.E. Michigan | Registered: January 06, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by ensigmatic:
quote:
Originally posted by Strambo:
I don’t really want to drift the thread from fitness, someone can start a nutrition one.

Which would no doubt include comments and questions about training, for the two are more-or-less inseperable, are they not?

Weight training, cardio, stretching, nutrition (which may include supplementation, depending upon ones goals/needs), adequate rest and mental well-being are all part of ones health.


The topic of the OP is fitness, efficient workouts, not general health which is an extremely broad topic for a single forum thread. More appropriate for an entire sub-forum at least.




“People have to really suffer before they can risk doing what they love.” –Chuck Palahnuik

The world's a dangerous place, we can help! http://portlandfirearmtraining.com/
 
Posts: 2863 | Location: Oregon | Registered: October 02, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Dances With
Tornados
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Thsnks for posting, I need to get serious and knock off some pounds. I'm going to the Y almost every day to exercise.

Anyone do water Aerobics?
 
Posts: 6855 | Registered: October 26, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of konata88
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I like this thread. Some good info here and I learned some things.




"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." - B.Franklin
"Wrong does not cease to be wrong because the majority share in it." L.Tolstoy
 
Posts: 6777 | Location: In the gilded cage | Registered: December 09, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Very good chart showing a visual representation of the continuum of benefits by rep range. A little busy at first until you get used to what it is showing.

https://www.allthingsgym.com/r...r-strength-and-mass/

It should be clear that pretty much all the "goodness" is happening in the low rep range with the exception of sarcoplasmic hypertrophy and capillary action (neither related to strength or functional fitness)

A huge thing missing from the chart is endurance. Studies have shown that low rep training will build muscle and 1RM strength, however, you will actually lose endurance (max number of reps able to perform). So, for a functionally fit person, you also need to do some higher rep endurance (that can serve as your "cardio" at the same time). Body weight squats, push ups and pulls are great, cheap, and easy.

Also, look at the excellent chart at 1:37 in this video. My google-fu was not strong enough to find a link to this chart anywhere else.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lb-7BY84WX4




“People have to really suffer before they can risk doing what they love.” –Chuck Palahnuik

The world's a dangerous place, we can help! http://portlandfirearmtraining.com/
 
Posts: 2863 | Location: Oregon | Registered: October 02, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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