We had MP5s. They were hugely underutilized. While fun, they brought few if any articulable advantages over the semi-auto options. Also, maintaining proficiency (and the agency-required quals) ate a lot of range time for the agents who opted for them. The agency ditched them-- ironically giving them to another white-collar agency, who played with them for a few years and then reached the same conclusions-- and left us with shotguns as our only "long gun" inventory.

Cue 2015 and proposals for M4s. Voices were raised for full-auto versions (mostly among people who never ran a FA before) and against (mainly by people who had.) I can find few domestic LE roles for FA that can't be seamlessly met with semi-auto models. They're out there, but they're... few.

Just my opinion, but I am admittedly a dinosaur who is perfectly happy with my SBS 870P.

My old dept had two MP5s that were select fire. The two best shots on the swat team used them. Plenty of patrol rifles but none full auto.

We have HK 416s. They are full auto. We got them because HK could deliver them six months sooner than semi-auto guns. With that being said, we never use them on full auto.

I personally think 99 percent of LE have no use for full auto in rifles. Sub-guns (MP5s) do have a use in full auto because they are efficient at recoil control and you can place a lot of pistol rounds on target.

I think that the ultimate police rifle is a 14 inch semi-auto.

quote:

Originally posted by jljones:


I think that the ultimate police rifle is a 14 inch semi-auto.

Concur.

I would add that unless you are working at a dept where you might be out in the sticks...not like the PD where I worked where houses were stacked on top of each other and you could hear your neighbor farting....there a 14inch carbine was perfect.

My department used to have a fair number of castrated M16’s but they all got returned to the .gov after what is best described as a pissing match. All equipment received under that program (DERMO? Can’t quite remenber) from machine guns to microwaves were returned.

Currently there are some legacy MP5’s that don’t see use, a single malfunctioning G18 (won’t shoot semi), and less than a dozen SCAR 308’s with the giggle switch. Half belong to SWAT, half belong to the Air unit, justified because they were DIRT CHEAP from FN and the powers that be could potentially see the need to stop a vehicle from the air.

Anyway, that’s how it was relayed to me by one with first hand involvement. I don’t swim in that lane myself.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: thumperfbc,

quote:

Originally posted by DennisM:
Voices were raised for full-auto versions (mostly among people who never ran a FA before) and against (mainly by people who had.)

Interesting how that is, isn’t it?

 
I am not a LEO, just a gun lover. I would think that for those who are allowed to carry full auto weapons, a 3 shot burst selection would be much preferred. More effective than semi, and much more controllable downrange. I am not familiar with which weapons have this option.

Burst has its own set of quirks. In many platforms, letting off the trigger during the burst will leave the remaining rounds in the burst for the next trigger pull. Although not necessarily common, this can create problems when there number of rounds fired does not match the expected result. I can see an argument for two round burst, like some HKs have, but even then, a quick double tap is a less complex, more controlled way to do the same thing.

thanks folks , very interesting.

We had MP-5's and Sig 552's but got rid of them. Sig made it impossible to get spare parts for the sigs so we went with Semi-auto AR-15's. Sold the Sigs to the B.I.A. for $148 a piece. There are still two MP5's floating around amongst our SWAT thugs. Too much fun to give them up I guess.