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quote:
Originally posted by MNSIG:
quote:
Originally posted by Scoutmaster: I asked him if, given billions of years of evolution, a jet plane could form itself on our street, fully fueled, and take off? He replied that if the matter and energy are "destined" for such, then yes, it could happen. I asked where "destiny" comes from. He remembered he was late for an appointment. Smile


Airplanes are not living creatures, so they can’t evolve. However, the humans needed to build one certainly did and could do so again.


That illustration is used to show the problem of randomly creating a complex system. A simple protein is a chain of about 150 amino acids arranged in a specific way. If you arrange it incorrectly it won’t fold into the correct shape and, consequently, it won’t function. It also has to be left handed and formed with peptide bonds. The probability of that happening at random is extremely low. But there is a chance, right? Yes, but you’ve only created a protein. For it to do anything it needs a system for decoding and replicating within which to act - mRNA, ribosomes, etc. so just creating a protein isn’t enough - it needs to happen together with a bunch of other complicated things to work. It’s like randomly creating a software program - certainly possible but useless without a computer to run it. The probability of randomly creating both the software and the computer, at the same time and in the same place, is so high it’s essentially impossible.

You correctly point out that a jet is not a living thing - it’s used to illustrate the point that you can’t use evolution to explain the origin of life because, by definition, there was no living thing for the first living thing to evolve from.

This isn’t a bunch of creationist voodoo. Secular scientists have been wrestling with this problem since not long after DNA was understood. Francis Crick noted it early on and a MIT had a conference about it in 1964. The calculations keep changing because we keep learning more about how complicated cells really are.

Again, I’m not saying this proves scientifically what did or didn’t happen. What it does prove is that the statement “Life randomly emerged from a prebiotic soup” is built on an extraordinary set of assumptions that we can’t even begin to substantiate.
 
Posts: 492 | Location: Tampa | Registered: July 27, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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2) best theory so far.
 
Posts: 2523 | Registered: May 30, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Fly High, A.J.
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quote:
Originally posted by sjtill:
I believe that there is a Divine Creator...I also believe that God could have worked through the process of evolution.
I also believe that my human limitations make it impossible to know the answer(s).


Sums up my thoughts pretty well. I believe in a life after death, and I feel (hope) that once my consciousness is freed from the limitations of my human brain, things will make more sense.
 
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2) then humans made up the concept of "gods" to explain things they were unable to find answers to.


The citizen watches the watchman, not the taxpayer.
 
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God
 
Posts: 703 | Location: Down South | Registered: February 22, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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God, I have no doubt.

Dan
 
Posts: 1956 | Location: Central Illinois | Registered: April 07, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
No double standards
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quote:
Originally posted by DaveL:....
Again, I’m not saying this proves scientifically what did or didn’t happen. What it does prove is that the statement “Life randomly emerged from a prebiotic soup” is built on an extraordinary set of assumptions that we can’t even begin to substantiate.


Makes sense, the odds are infinitesimal. It is true, scientifically, one can't prove God exists. And, one cannot prove, scientifically, that God doesn't exist.




"Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women. When it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it....While it lies there, it needs no constitution, no law, no court to save it"
- Judge Learned Hand, May 1944
 
Posts: 30112 | Location: CA | Registered: November 11, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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And this evolution buisness,
How long does evolution take any way?

How many bazillion years does it take for humans to do this evolving?

Man has been eating, pooping and sleeping since for ever,
Oh blah, blah, blah, using tools

Big effen deal.

So what's it take for the humans to get some evolving?





Safety, Situational Awareness and proficiency.



Neck Ties, Hats and ammo brass, Never ,ever touch'em w/o asking first
 
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#1
 
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Big Stack
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2. There are plenty of breadcrumbs to follow in the fossil record the prove it.
 
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Lost
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quote:
And this evolution buisness,
How long does evolution take any way?

The general scientific consensus is 4 billion years.



ACCU-STRUT FOR MINI-14
"Pen & Sword as One"
 
Posts: 13755 | Location: SF Bay Area | Registered: December 11, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Three Generations
of Service
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In my not-so-humble opinion, #7 is the only honest answer.

I respect everyone's right to subscribe to #1 or #2, but "believing" something and "knowing" something are two entirely different things.




Be careful when following the masses. Sometimes the M is silent.
 
Posts: 12878 | Location: Downeast Maine | Registered: March 10, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Lawyers, Guns
and Money
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quote:
Originally posted by bigdeal:
Personally, I think God created the earth and all its flora and fauna on Monday through Saturday, then went out for a bender with his bros on Saturday night. When he came in hung over to the max on Sunday, he looked at his ToDo list and all that was left was 'man'. And this is what we ended up with.

Big Grin
Something like that... I do think that God has a sense of humor.

Actually, I think both of these are true:
1) God created us.
2) We evolved through evolution.
They are not mutually exclusive. Did it all happen in a week? What's time to an eternal being?



"Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible."
-- Justice Janice Rogers Brown

"The United States government is the largest criminal enterprise on earth."
-rduckwor
 
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Void Where Prohibited
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#7

I don't know, and neither does any other human in this existence.
You can believe anything you want, but that's faith - not proof of any specific cause.



"If Gun Control worked, Chicago would look like Mayberry, not Thunderdome" - Cam Edwards
 
Posts: 15310 | Location: Under the Boot of Tyranny in Connectistan | Registered: February 02, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Little ray
of sunshine
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The white mice.




The fish is mute, expressionless. The fish doesn't think because the fish knows everything.
 
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A Grateful American
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#1.

I doubt my understanding of God.
God does not doubt His understanding of me.

For that, I am grateful, and content that He is first in all things.

Sh'ma Yisrael Adonai Eloheinu Adonai Eḥad
"Hear, O Israel: the LORD our God, the LORD is One."




"the meaning of life, is to give life meaning" I could explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you.
 
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To quote the old "Gunsmoke" episode:

"The world began the day I was born.."

(My granddaughters both firmly believe this about their grandfather - and who am I to dispute their faith!)
 
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God is #1 !
 
Posts: 1707 | Location: Northern Virginia/Buggs Island, Boydton Va. | Registered: July 13, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
MAGA
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God.
He will give me the answer to this question and many others, when he knows I will be able to understand his answer.


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Just leave Wayne
 
Posts: 1411 | Location: Indiana | Registered: July 10, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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^^^ Me too!!


_________________________________________________

"Once abolish the God, and the Government becomes the God." --- G.K. Chesterton
 
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