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NFL starts new season sitting for National Anthem. Update:(Trump comments on NFL bottom of page 2) Login/Join 
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Picture of Expert308
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by jhe888:
quote:
Originally posted by msfzoe:
Professional athletes and entertainers are too highly compensated.

What does that have to do with this?

And it isn't true anyway. They are paid a market price. Back to Microeconomics 101.

Besides, isn't condemning the NFL because a few players are behaving like asses a little like condemning all gun owners because a few of them are nuts?
 
Posts: 5010 | Location: Portland, OR | Registered: February 12, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Leatherneck
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Expert308:
quote:
Originally posted by jhe888:
quote:
Originally posted by msfzoe:
Professional athletes and entertainers are too highly compensated.

What does that have to do with this?

And it isn't true anyway. They are paid a market price. Back to Microeconomics 101.

Besides, isn't condemning the NFL because a few players are behaving like asses a little like condemning all gun owners because a few of them are nuts?


I think so. But otherwise intelligent people lose their shit when it comes to pro sports and forget how to count. Only around 2% of players have taken a knee but all of the NFL turns into America hating pieces of shit. Just like while very, very few of the players are actual felons the league is nicknamed the "National Felon League".

I'd wager that most people on this forum work with felons and people who support leftist causes but I doubt anyone hopes that their business gets boycotted over a few bad apples.

I do wish the league or individual owners would put a stop to it but I don't think that them allowing it also means that they support it. Just like When Trump didn't call the white supremacists out by name in Charlston, it didn't mean he supported them. But it's a fun tactic to use,implying such things which isn't limited to use by the leftist media.




Georgia Carry Member Calguns Foundation Member Second Amendment Foundation Member NRA Lifetime Member

Everybody wants a Sig in the sheets but a Glock on the streets. -bionic218 04-02-2014

 
Posts: 11977 | Location: Georgia | Registered: May 07, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Rail-less
and
Tail-less
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Didn't one of these disgusting NFL scumbags just raise $30 million for Houston Harvey relief? What a piece of shit that JJ Watt is. I said it in the other thread. Who gives a fuck what a couple of assholes do...the great majority of players stand for the anthem. Calling for boycotts and shit is pussy ass liberal shit. Stop being offended by the actions of a couple of dickheads. Allowing myself to be offended by someone else's actions says more about me then them. This is America...people have the right to be assholes. You have the right to not like it but whining about it is something a limp-dick commie millennial would do. You are no less a patriot if you still enjoy football...a game that's as American as apple pie, guns, and going heels to Jesus in the back of a Buick.


_______________________________________________
Use thumb-size bullets to create fist-size holes.
 
Posts: 11573 | Location: Charlotte, NC | Registered: May 07, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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There's a double header tonight. I wonder if anyone will sit or kneel tonight knowing what anniversary it is.



"Even if the world were perfect it wouldn't be." ... Yogi Berra
 
Posts: 868 | Location: York County, VA | Registered: August 25, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
quarter MOA visionary
Picture of smschulz
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by jhe888:
quote:
Originally posted by msfzoe:
Professional athletes and entertainers are too highly compensated.


What does that have to do with this?

And it isn't true anyway. They are paid a market price. Back to Microeconomics 101.


A LOT of the problem and/or disgust has to do with jealousy over the obscene money they make.
Not saying it is justified or not but it is just a fact.
Somehow having lots of money is supposed to make you the perfect personality.
 
Posts: 14104 | Location: Houston, TX | Registered: June 11, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Nullus Anxietas
Picture of ensigmatic
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quote:
Originally posted by Expert308:
Besides, isn't condemning the NFL because a few players are behaving like asses a little like condemning all gun owners because a few of them are nuts?

Sure it is, except it's not. Neither the NRA nor any other gun rights organization supports improper use of firearms. And I betcha if any firearms league had competitors start dissing the flag, those competitors would be gone or that league wouldn't be long for this world.

The NFL, OTOH, not only has done nothing to discourage disrespect for the flag, and, by extension, everything for which it stands, but even quashes attempts to honour those who paid the highest price upholding our country's values: NFL denies Cowboys' request to wear decal honoring fallen Dallas officers




"America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system,,,, but too early to shoot the bastards." -- Claire Wolfe
 
Posts: 11936 | Location: S.E. Michigan | Registered: January 06, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Tinker Sailor Soldier Pie
Picture of Balzé Halzé
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Expert308:
quote:
Originally posted by jhe888:
quote:
Originally posted by msfzoe:
Professional athletes and entertainers are too highly compensated.

What does that have to do with this?

And it isn't true anyway. They are paid a market price. Back to Microeconomics 101.

Besides, isn't condemning the NFL because a few players are behaving like asses a little like condemning all gun owners because a few of them are nuts?


No. It's not at all the same as that.

The NFL employs these people. They are the image of the NFL. By tolerating and even endorsing what some of these players are doing, they are making the entire organization look bad.

I work for a very large shipping company. We have policies that prohibit me from doing or saying certain things that might publicly make the company look bad. If i were on social media wearing my company logo doing or saying things on their dime that tarnishes their image, do you think for a second that they would tolerate that because "oh hey, he has freedom of speech?" Ha! It'd be either get with the program or I'm gone. That's if they even give me a chance. More than likely I'd just be unceremoniously canned.

So no, it's not the same at all. The NFL is condoning this garbage. And so are the fans with their indifference to it. Pathetic.


~Alan

Acta Non Verba
NRA Life Member (Endowment)
Family, Guns, Country

"My guns are always loaded."
~R.G. Justified

What whiskey will not cure, there is no cure.
 
Posts: 17930 | Location: Out of Jersey, Into Utah | Registered: October 29, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Thank you ensigmatic and Balzé Halzé for explaining what I was trying to explain.




 
Posts: 10307 | Location: Westminster, Colorado | Registered: June 18, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Leatherneck
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quote:
Originally posted by ensigmatic:


The NFL, OTOH, not only has done nothing to discourage disrespect for the flag, and, by extension, everything for which it stands, but even quashes attempts to honour those who paid the highest price upholding our country's values: NFL denies Cowboys' request to wear decal honoring fallen Dallas officers


Totally different things. The request was denied because it was a uniform modification. I disagree with the denial but it is not at all the same. I gurantee you that if Kapernick, or any of the others, tried to modify the game uniform during a game then the NFL would step in. I get why it's confusing to someone who knows nothing about the rules. But it is different.




Georgia Carry Member Calguns Foundation Member Second Amendment Foundation Member NRA Lifetime Member

Everybody wants a Sig in the sheets but a Glock on the streets. -bionic218 04-02-2014

 
Posts: 11977 | Location: Georgia | Registered: May 07, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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What is this NFL you speak of?
 
Posts: 13426 | Location: Lexington, KY | Registered: October 15, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Be not wise in
thine own eyes
Picture of kimber1911
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Pale Horse:
quote:
Originally posted by ensigmatic:


The NFL, OTOH, not only has done nothing to discourage disrespect for the flag, and, by extension, everything for which it stands, but even quashes attempts to honour those who paid the highest price upholding our country's values: NFL denies Cowboys' request to wear decal honoring fallen Dallas officers


Totally different things. The request was denied because it was a uniform modification. I disagree with the denial but it is not at all the same. I gurantee you that if Kapernick, or any of the others, tried to modify the game uniform during a game then the NFL would step in. I get why it's confusing to someone who knows nothing about the rules. But it is different.

With players being public figures, representatives of the NFL, the NFL can set rules for uniform wear while at work.

Why did you need to specify "game uniform during a game"?

If the NFL wanted to discourage this disrespect they can, but they don't.




"This American carnage stops right here and stops right now.”
Donald Trump (POTUS) Jan. 20th 2017

"ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ!" King Leonidas of Sparta
 
Posts: 2367 | Location: NC | Registered: December 05, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Leatherneck
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by kimber1911:

With players being public figures, representatives of the NFL, the NFL can set rules for uniform wear while at work.

Why did you need to specify "game uniform during a game"?



Because that was what I meant, and I knew someone was going to bring up those socks Wink. It was as predictable as another thread on this subject so I wanted to make myself clear. It clearly didn't work.

They could make rules for what they wear at work, but they don't. Or at least there were none at that time. I don't know about now. The same rule book that doesn't have rules against Kaperenicks disgusting socks has no rules against the Cowboys honoring police officers at practice or during warmups.

You can dislike the rule book but it is the rule book. Kapernick broke no NFL rules during practice.

I have a feeling this will devolve into something it is not. So please, please do your best to stay on topic if you respond.

I am not condoning Kapernicks action or his socks. I am not even defending the NFL and I have said in multiple threads on this subject that I wish they would put an end to this. All I am saying is that rules are rules and that based on the rules his wearing socks at a practice is not the same as someone modifying a uniform during a game. You can want it to be, I want it to be, but it is not.




Georgia Carry Member Calguns Foundation Member Second Amendment Foundation Member NRA Lifetime Member

Everybody wants a Sig in the sheets but a Glock on the streets. -bionic218 04-02-2014

 
Posts: 11977 | Location: Georgia | Registered: May 07, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
No double standards
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by kimber1911:....If the NFL wanted to discourage this disrespect they can, but they don't...


And that's the whole point.

The NFL may be in a lose/lose situation. If they favor the Flag, they will offend some minorities, liberals, media looking for opportunities to stir up stink using megaphones. If they give in, they will offend some portion of their fan base. Which will have the greatest economic impact?




"Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women. When it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it....While it lies there, it needs no constitution, no law, no court to save it"
- Judge Learned Hand, May 1944
 
Posts: 28179 | Location: CA | Registered: November 11, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Leatherneck
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Scoutmaster:
quote:
Originally posted by kimber1911:....If the NFL wanted to discourage this disrespect they can, but they don't...


And that's the whole point.

The NFL may be in a lose/lose situation. If they favor the Flag, they will offend some minorities, liberals, media looking for opportunities to stir up stink using megaphones. If they give in, they will offend some portion of their fan base. Which will have the greatest economic impact?


Personally I would think that giving their players freedom to express their opinions, left or right, would please most people. But both sides have a lot of people who are easily butthurt. The right thinks the NFL supports Kapernick because they let him kneel. The left thinks the NFL is racist because Kapernick doesn't have a job.

You can only try to please reasonable people on both sides.




Georgia Carry Member Calguns Foundation Member Second Amendment Foundation Member NRA Lifetime Member

Everybody wants a Sig in the sheets but a Glock on the streets. -bionic218 04-02-2014

 
Posts: 11977 | Location: Georgia | Registered: May 07, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Be not wise in
thine own eyes
Picture of kimber1911
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I guess that's my problem.
I don't see reasonable people on the other side.

Asking someone to stand during the National Anthem and not disrespect the Military or Law Enforcement while at work does not seem unreasonable to me.

Some have pointed to the fact that these players are not all players.
I look at it as they are all employees subject to the rules of the employer, The Team and ultimately The NFL.

The NFL is ultimately responsible for their employees actions while representing The Company.

As consumers We are ultimately responsible for judging their action or in-action through our decisions in respect to viewing and purchasing decisions.



"This American carnage stops right here and stops right now.”
Donald Trump (POTUS) Jan. 20th 2017

"ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ!" King Leonidas of Sparta
 
Posts: 2367 | Location: NC | Registered: December 05, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
No double standards
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Pale Horse:....Personally I would think that giving their players freedom to express their opinions, left or right, would please most people. But both sides have a lot of people who are easily butthurt. The right thinks the NFL supports Kapernick because they let him kneel. The left thinks the NFL is racist because Kapernick doesn't have a job.

You can only try to please reasonable people on both sides.


As various posts have implied, the NFL's goal is primarily economic; and they will be reasonable if/when economics favor such.

I live in the Bay Area, CA. And consistent with Kimber's post above, reasonable around here is a one way street. Everything a liberal does/has done is enlightened. Everything a conservative does/has done is oppressive.




"Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women. When it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it....While it lies there, it needs no constitution, no law, no court to save it"
- Judge Learned Hand, May 1944
 
Posts: 28179 | Location: CA | Registered: November 11, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
No double standards
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by kimber1911:...The NFL is ultimately responsible for their employees actions while representing The Company.

As consumers We are ultimately responsible for judging their action or in-action through our decisions in respect to viewing and purchasing decisions.


How many will increase their consumption of NFL goods/services due to this issue vs how many will decrease their consumption? I haven't followed college or pro sports for close to 25 years, haven't seen any studies, but would bet (symbolically) that NFL revenues will go down.




"Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women. When it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it....While it lies there, it needs no constitution, no law, no court to save it"
- Judge Learned Hand, May 1944
 
Posts: 28179 | Location: CA | Registered: November 11, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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And then there's J.J. Watt, by all appearances a good person. Definitely a role model for young people-as well as an example of how those of privilege and wealth (by nature of being a highly paid athlete) should act.
 
Posts: 1762 | Registered: July 31, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Be not wise in
thine own eyes
Picture of kimber1911
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Trump comments on the NFL:

"When people like yourselves turn on television and you see those people taking the knee when they are playing our great national anthem – the only thing you could do better is if you see it, even if it's one player, leave the stadium," Trump said. "I guarantee things will stop."

"Wouldn't you love to see one of these NFL owners, when somebody disrespects our flag, to say, 'Get that son of a b---- off the field right now,'" he continued, adding, "'He is fired.'"

NFL commissioner Roger Goodell fired back at President Trump:

“divisive comments” show “an unfortunate lack of respect for the NFL.”

“The NFL and our players are at our best when we help create a sense of unity in our country and our culture,” Goodell said in a statement.

NFL head: Trump's 'divisive comments' show a 'lack of respect'



"This American carnage stops right here and stops right now.”
Donald Trump (POTUS) Jan. 20th 2017

"ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ!" King Leonidas of Sparta
 
Posts: 2367 | Location: NC | Registered: December 05, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of GGF
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quote:
“an unfortunate lack of respect for the NFL.”


And you have a lack of respect for your core audience. This will equate to lower revenue and lack of interest in the NFL.
But please, feel free to make your point and I'll feel free to ignore you.

GGF
 
Posts: 577 | Location: Indiana | Registered: January 28, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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