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| Just an ACARS message with feelings  |
This attitude is very typical of LE in California. They trust no one but their union. Only the po-leece should have guns according to them. ____________________________ 220/229/228/226/P6/225/XO/SP2022/239 | |||
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Essayons |
@ Pipe Smoker: the answers to your questions are all at handgunlaw.us. Check it out! Thanks, Sap | |||
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| Member |
I know,I know, I think I can help you. People on the south and west sides of Chicago are dropping dead after being shot by......gasp, other people from the south and west sides of Chicago who (another gasp) do not have a ccw permit. | |||
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| I believe in the principle of Due Process  |
It is easy. I've had permits from Florida and Utah for years while I was living in SD. They are inexpensive and the staffs are friendly, knowledgable, easy to work with, not like freaks from DMV. Utah requires a course by a Utah arrived instructor. It's been a decade or more but I bet American Shooting Center in Kearney Mesa has/knows one. I took the course one Saturday morning, did the shooting later, so easy even a lawyer could do it. I just got a renewal notice from Utah, but won't be renewing. In Texas now, so there is no need and I can't travel anymore anyway. Luckily, I have enough willpower to control the driving ambition that rages within me. When you had the votes, we did things your way. Now, we have the votes and you will be doing things our way. This lesson in political reality from Lyndon B. Johnson "Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." - Justice Janice Rogers Brown | |||
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| Too old to run, too mean to quit! |
Same here, way back about 15 years ago when I got my CCW permit. I.e. Virginia! Elk There has never been an occasion where a people gave up their weapons in the interest of peace that didn't end in their massacre. (Louis L'Amour) "To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors, is sinful and tyrannical. " -Thomas Jefferson "America is great because she is good. If America ceases to be good, America will cease to be great." Alexis de Tocqueville FBHO!!! The Idaho Elk Hunter | |||
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California, the Gunshine State. This is so old and tired. | |||
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| Member |
And only California POLICE. I have a valid LEOSA permit issued annually by my local department. I called the Orange County and Los Angeles County Sheriff's Offices to try and get insight into what was legal. . e.g. Magazine size, Ammunition, etc. Neither would tell me, and neither could refer me to an office in their organizations that could. Chief Beck is only protecting us from that whole "blood running in the streets" armageddon deal that we would face if citizens could carry guns without government sanction. | |||
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Irksome Whirling Dervish |
I've said this many times and everytime it falls on deaf ears on the forum but I'll say it again. The LAPD doesn't much care about the honest lawabiding citizen who follows the law. It's not you or me they are worried about per se. They are concerned, as are other LEO I know, about 1. Gangbangers with CCW. If they have a record they will be denied in the process but, come as shock to many, not every gangbanger has a record so under must issue states and national reciprocity, those very people with not very good intent, will be carrying concealed. I don't know where you are all from but in LA there are, according to LAPD, 45k gange members and close 400 total gangs in the city but some sources put the total number LA Basin number at closer to 120k with around 1,400 gangs. It's those people who ought not to be armed even particpate in a national reciprocity agreement but there's no mechanism to weed out the good from the bad, at least on paper. The other thing is that LAPD has no idea whethe the CC hoder has any training on the laws for concealed carry in CA or whether training in the home state is even required. If the ability to carry concealed is solely defined by someone in another state paying a small fee and nothing more, that's worrisome to them. So as a blanket proposed policy reaction, they are opposed to it but they are dealing with people and populations of gang bangers with numbers greater than the populations of the entire cities of where many of you live. If there was national reciprocity based on agreed upon training and standards that would be one thing that might alleviate some of the angst with Beck but if faced with just having more armed people and told just to deal with them, he's going to come out against this. What I'm saying isn't popular here but the reality here is different than where a lot of you live. | |||
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Step by step walk the thousand mile road |
Its deja vous all over again. Nice is overrated "It's every freedom-loving individual's duty to lie to the government." Airsoftguy, June 29, 2018 | |||
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| No double standards |
So how is a gangbanger with CCW who carries that much more dangerous than a gangbanger without CCW who carries? And given that many gangbangers in SoCal with guns, will changing CCW rules be a significant escalation in violence and shootings? "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women. When it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it....While it lies there, it needs no constitution, no law, no court to save it" - Judge Learned Hand, May 1944 | |||
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delicately calloused |
I don't care. I demand my rights. Anyone can rationalize tyranny of others. You’re a lying dog-faced pony soldier | |||
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Member |
I'm curious as to why a 'gangbanger' would bother with submitting the paper work to get a concealed license. Are they handed out for free somewhere? Usually, there's a process and some money to be paid. What advantage does a gangbanger get by having a concealed license? Just because he's carrying legally, does that get him off the hook for ill intent or actions? I don't understand the argument here. ———- Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for thou art crunchy and taste good with catsup. | |||
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| I believe in the principle of Due Process |
None of the gang bangers in LA can get a CCW/CHL/LTC and few would bother. The first time they use it inappropriately, it would go away. If you stop someone who is carrying, is he THAT likely to pose a threat? No warrants, no beefs, presumably. It isn't the paper that makes him dangerous, if at all, is it? Luckily, I have enough willpower to control the driving ambition that rages within me. When you had the votes, we did things your way. Now, we have the votes and you will be doing things our way. This lesson in political reality from Lyndon B. Johnson "Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." - Justice Janice Rogers Brown | |||
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| The Main Thing Is Not To Get Excited  |
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| Irksome Whirling Dervish |
You could flip the question around and ask does someone who is intent on carrying concealed need a valid CCW to do so. It's sort of the same thing in a reverse way. The gangbangers are cowards and they aren't brilliant but the do like their weapons. If you're in a gang but don't have a rap sheet and otherwise not disqualifed from having a CCW, you will get one and be the gun holder for other members of the gang. That's one of the problems that LAPD will face when the Phoenix chapter of Brown Pride comes out to do business with the LA chapter. There's no white and black cowboy test for this stuff so they'd rather push against the national reciprocity than deal with a new level of problems. | |||
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| Irksome Whirling Dervish |
You're thinking clearly but as I said in a reply to someone else, why do you bother with a CCW since it's just paper and carrying concealed means carrying concealed? A CCW for a banger is cover and it gives them legitimacy to carry. Same with a driver's license. LAPD has enough problems with gangs without a national reciprocity issue. | |||
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| Member |
To think gangbangers get Concealed Carry permits is the stupidest thing I ever heard. If you've never been fingerprinted for a crime you don't voluntarily give the police a unique identifier- your fingerprint. ____________________________________________________ The butcher with the sharpest knife has the warmest heart. | |||
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| Irksome Whirling Dervish |
Under the current scheme no one in LA gets a CCW. I think it's less than 25 or so a year but it isn't LA that they're worried about. It's about the people and bangers from other states coming in with their weapons. As a banger you bring them in lawfully and if stopped, you pass po-po muster and go on your merry way. The guns can be dropped off and the owner can claim his car was broken into and that's that. Violent crime is up in LA and the stats are constently being manipulated to show reduced numbers. I think on a statewide level, for instance, Gov. Brown reported that only non-violent offenders/non-felongs are being set free or turned over to the county jails (who are overcrowded and releasing people very quickly). So what's the secret? They simply reclassify crimes as now non-violent or change them to misdemeanor. Arson was redefined down to a misdemeanor in some circutmstances. The dollar amount to support a felony theft charge was increased so that anything less than $1k is a misdemeanor with no real served time. It's all numbers game and my point is that LA is much more violent than admitted and having to deal with gang members with guns that are legitimately brought in from other states or having to deal with white cowboy hat CCW holders who may not be familiar with CA carry laws is a problem they'd rather not deal with in light of everything else. | |||
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semi-reformed sailor |
This is why I don't live in CA "Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor.” Robert A. Heinlein “You may beat me, but you will never win.” sigmonkey-2020 “A single round of buckshot to the torso almost always results in an immediate change of behavior.” Chris Baker | |||
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| Irksome Whirling Dervish |
You're making a very wrong assumption that all gangbangers have been fingerprinted. Where do understand that to be true? Is that some sort of universal truth where you're from? | |||
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SIGforum.com Main Page The Lounge LAPD Chief warns of Apocalypse if National Concealed Carry passes-
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