In Gary Taubes' 2010 book Why We Get Fat: And What to Do About It, he talks about the gov's party line - need to lose weight? exercise and eat less, which for most people does not work. At 272 pages, it is a fascinating and quick read.

This is not a diet book. He explains the history behind the rise of the low fat dietary recommendations (avoid fat, eat more carbs) by the gov and the straying away from what was known then that eating less carbohydrates will let you lose weight.

Eating too much and a sedentary lifestyle makes you fat (overweight)? [cough] [bullshit]. Carbohydrates (bread, starchy foods / vegetables, sugar, beer, soda, etc., etc., etc.) elevates insulin. Insulin directs cells to store fat - you gain weight and get bigger. When you cut carbs, you instead burn fat. Cutting carbs also lowers your triglycerides, increases HDL, and increases LDL particles (small LDL particles leads to plaque buildup in arteries) - all of which decreases your risk for heart disease.

Reading that book right now. Wife and I started low carbing about 3 weeks ago. Not sure of the weight loss but have lost 1/2 inch on my waistline so far without any appreciable exercise.

I miss the world is academia and being surrounded by intelligent people. 1/2 of Americans are diabetic or pre-diabetic. If you trust the government (and your doctor for that matter) to tell you what to eat, you're going to have a hard time.

Stephen Phinney.
https://youtu.be/r8uSv6OgHJE

https://youtu.be/_evJd_iZZzs

While Taubes is right, you can also consume too much fat and protein. Excess protein is unlikely to be converted to fat, because the conversion process, itself, is complex and energy-intensive, but excess fat is little better for you than excess carbs. And it has its own ill effects.

That being said: The government's nutritional guidelines for decades have been, in large part, responsible for today's obesity epidemic. That and Americans' love of sweetening everything beyond all reason.

And that being said...

quote:

Originally posted by f2:
Eating too much and a sedentary lifestyle makes you fat (overweight)? [cough] [bullshit].

Not entirely. While it's true excess carbs may be the biggest culprit: If you consume more calories than you expend you will gain weight. Period.

Personally, I like carbs. I like sweets (chocolate, desserts) on occasion. I like a beer with dinner. I like the occasional spirit. I like potato chips and, in fact, potatoes. Sometimes I like these things in excess.

So I work out regularly and otherwise try to stay active.

quote:

Originally posted by tk13:
Wife and I started low carbing about 3 weeks ago. Not sure of the weight loss but have lost 1/2 inch on my waistline so far without any appreciable exercise.

Yeah, but you probably didn't replace the calories with increased fat and protein intake, either.

I went on a low carb diet a few months back. (Est. less than fifty grams/day on average.) Lost eight pounds in 21 days, while gaining muscle mass. Lost over an inch off my waistline. And lowered my BP from averaging around 135/85 to 115/65.

I've sloughed-off, since. Weight and waist are back up a bit. So's the BP. But neither terribly so.

Intermittent fasting can help a lot, too. One method is no food from dinner to lunch the next day (16-18 hours). Do that 2-3 times/week. Some researchers recently did a study on low-carb diets vs. intermittent fasting and the latter group saw increased fat loss over the former.

Sugar is the devil. Stop it.

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:
...While it's true excess carbs may be the biggest culprit: If you consume more calories than you expend you will gain wait. Period.

bullshit. Excess carb calories is the culprit. If you cut carbs you limit elevated insulin, which stores fat, which makes you gain weight / girth. You should have stuck to it. The results of triglycerides and LDL and HDL is telling.

quote:

Originally posted by f2:

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:
...While it's true excess carbs may be the biggest culprit: If you consume more calories than you expend you will gain wait. Period.

bullshit. Excess carb calories is the culprit.

No, it is not "bullshit" that taking in more calories than you expend will result in fat gain. It is, in fact, fact.

Excess carbs is the primary culprit in American diets. It's not the only culprit.

But you're free to believe whatever you wish. I've only known what you're preaching (except your apparent belief excess calories don't matter if they're not carbs) for... oh... better than a decade?

^^^^^

You're right. There's no arguing with the calorie in vs out equation. Is just chemistry and physics. Now, I'll admit that carbs are a wickedly potent source of calories that make it super easy to exceed the burn from exercise. That Snickers bar offset an hour of walking. Unless a person is training for the Olympics, it's a heck of a lot better to manage the "in" than the "out".

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:
I've only known what you're preaching (except your apparent belief excess calories don't matter if they're not carbs) for... oh... better than a decade?

It's been common knowledge longer than that. Hundreds of years. They did not know the why (enzymes, insulin), the science, like we do now. You don't need to count calories. Why would you? You do need to know which calories will make you fat. That sounds like useful information.

Some recent threads from late last year on fitness, weight loss, exercise, muscle building, ketogenesis, calories in vs. calories out, etc. (by order of date and time started):

Muscle build rate?

How to be actually fit without it being an all-consuming hobby

Fitness Geeks: Just Finished Creatine Loading Phase

Un-biased (I hope?) Basics of Nutrition

If you choose wisely which calories you put in (avoiding / significantly reducing carbs), you don't have to worry about calories out.

I was overweight and freshly diabetic. I went low carb and have lost over 50 pounds. My A1C is back in the normal range.

It took getting use to but I feel like a new man.

I think calories in vs. calories out is so over-simplified as to be just about real-world useless. It doesn't speak to health or quality of food and is not tied to any result other than moving a needle on a scale. Also, it is not exact and can be wrong or quickly become wrong because our metabolisms are changing/adjusting and different macros cause different reactions. (Technically it isn't wrong, but you have to constantly adjust and can't accurately measure things like metabolism changes.)

Worst of all is the silly Jenny Craig type plans where they just mail you food in a box to mindlessly eat. What happens when you reach your goal...buy their crap the rest of your life? Of course not, but since you still have no clue how to eat healthy ('cause you were just eating their pre-made items), you'll just gain all the weight right back...

It is much harder to over-eat just healthy things like good quality meats, lots of veggies, nuts, healthy fats while avoiding grains etc.

quote:

Originally posted by Strambo:
I think calories in vs. calories out is so over-simplified as to be just about real-world useless.

There's no question about that, but the OP's original assertion was that all you had to do to avoid being overweight was control carbs.

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:

quote:

Originally posted by Strambo:
I think calories in vs. calories out is so over-simplified as to be just about real-world useless.

There's no question about that, but the OP's original assertion was that all you had to do to avoid being overweight was control carbs.

We're on the same page, it ain't that simple the other direction either!

I think it is always a mistake to just focus on avoidance of the "bad" thing and not focus enough on what's good. An example, following Atkins and avoiding the carbs, but not eating nearly enough veggies. Or; my Vegan cousin who does a great job avoiding the animal products but hardly eats any veggies!

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:
There's no question about that, but the OP's original assertion was that all you had to do to avoid being overweight was control carbs.

I don't really think you're an idiot, but the thought is there.

quote:

Originally posted by Strambo:

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:

quote:

Originally posted by Strambo:
I think calories in vs. calories out is so over-simplified as to be just about real-world useless.

There's no question about that, but the OP's original assertion was that all you had to do to avoid being overweight was control carbs.

We're on the same page, it ain't that simple the other direction either!

I think it is always a mistake to just focus on avoidance of the "bad" thing and not focus enough on what's good. An example, following Atkins and avoiding the carbs, but not eating nearly enough veggies.

That was essentially my point.

quote:

Originally posted by Strambo:
Or; my Vegan cousin who does a great job avoiding the animal products but hardly eats any veggies!

Wait... what? If he's a veegan, and he doesn't eat any actual, you know, veggies, then what the hell does he eat?

And how the hell can you be a veegan and not eat any veggies?

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:

quote:

Originally posted by Strambo:
Or; my Vegan cousin who does a great job avoiding the animal products but hardly eats any veggies!

Wait... what? If he's a veegan, and he doesn't eat any actual, you know, veggies, then what the hell does he eat?

And how the hell can you be a veegan and not eat any veggies?

I don't know brother. I basically only see her eat carbs, desserts, veggie burgers on a bun, bean only type chili etc. It's sad because she is young, but very over weight and always sick. Last Thanksgiving she was in charge of bringing the veggie dish I think, she brought some corn-coconut flour concoction. So, we had nothing green at all (not even a token salad) on the Thanksgiving table. For Easter dinner tomorrow the wife and I are bringing a salad and a green bean dish...and we are the hard core carnivores!

I've seen the same thing with acquaintances doing Atkins, lots 'o bacon and cheese but did they forget about the fibrous veggie part? I can be guilty of this as well when I'm specifically focused on being low carb...

quote:

Originally posted by Strambo:
I don't know brother. I basically only see her eat carbs, desserts, veggie burgers on a bun, bean only type chili etc. It's sad because she is young, but very over weight and always sick.

Ohhh... I think you mentioned her in one of the threads I referenced.

Geez, with a diet like that, can't imagine why she is overweight and sick all the time

quote:

Originally posted by Strambo:
Last Thanksgiving she was in charge of bringing the veggie dish I think, she brought some corn-coconut flour concoction. So, we had nothing green at all (not even a token salad) on the Thanksgiving table.

From the Department of You Can't Make This Up: A veegan assigned to bring the veggies fails to bring the veggies

quote:

Originally posted by Strambo:
For Easter dinner tomorrow the wife and I are bringing a salad and a green bean dish...and we are the hard core carnivores!

My wife and I are "balanced diet" types. So not normally low-carb. We do strongly limit the processed carbs. Very little processed food at all, really.

quote:

Originally posted by Strambo:
I've seen the same thing with acquaintances doing Atkins, lots 'o bacon and cheese but did they forget about the fibrous veggie part? I can be guilty of this as well when I'm specifically focused on being low carb...

Even when I was on that aforementioned low carb diet I still got my veggies. In fact I imagine veggies were a good part of the est. 50 grams of carbs/day I got.

This is a handy chart I just found:

Low-carb vegetables – the best and the worst

I'll turn 67 later this year. I'm 5' 10'' and weight 156 pounds. I still own and can wear a Brooks Brothers suit I bought in 1982. I don't diet.

But I do pay attention to what I consume. I limit fried foods, don't drink soda/cola/crap, don't smoke or consume alcohol, and stay active.

In my opinion, any diet that focuses on the government-approved "food pyramind" (now transformed into the "plate") is missing the entire point. ALL macronutrients are metabolized into one form or another of sugar. The "-oses" as I like to call them, are the only form of chemistry our bodies understand. These sugars are either used by the body as energy, or are stored for later use. As fat.

The body requires fats, proteins and carbohydrates. Restricting or eliminating their intake is not good for the body.

I'm a fan of Dr. Joel Fuhrman, author of "Eat For Health," "Eat To Live," and "The End of Diabetes" as well as others. Fuhrman's focus is on micronutrients and micronutrient-rich foods. Kale and spinach are veritable treasure troves of micronutrients, but the easy way to eat healthy the "nutritarian" way is to remember G-BOMBS: Greens, Beans, Onions, Mushrooms, Berries and Seeds. Think of eating a big salad with every meal!

If you think of the "plate" being half salad, you're well on your way. You can still eat meat, potatoes, bread, etc. as long as you consume enough micronutrients. And when you do, you will lose weight and possibly even reverse the onset of Type 2 diabetes.

Eating shouldn't have to be a science, a ritual of weighing and measuring, or a condemnation.