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Member
Picture of jbcummings
posted
Those two terms seem to be showing up quite a bit lately. Not wanting to go off on a tangent in the O'Reily thread, I thought I'd ask my question here.

Is this just a trend the Left has perpetuated on society or is it really that common today. Granted, I've been retired about 4 years now and I know how rapidly things can change, but I can recall very little in the 45+ years that I worked that could be construed as sexual harassment. Verbal abuse, well maybe, but it was met out irrespective of gender. Heck, I made an intern cry once because I told her she didn't follow instructions and she was going to have to redo the assigned work. What I said wasn't abuse, no names were called, no inappropriate language or references were used; she just didn't do what she was told to do and the results were unusable.

How about some of the rest of you? Am I just too old to remember this going on or has it just become the tool of choice to get what you want, even if you don't deserve it?


———-
Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for thou art crunchy and taste good with catsup.
 
Posts: 4306 | Location: DFW | Registered: May 21, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Unapologetic Old
School Curmudgeon
Picture of Lord Vaalic
posted Hide Post
Now you would be hauled before HR for chastising her, would have to apologize for being upset that she fucked up and you would be mandated to take effective management classes.




Don't weep for the stupid, or you will be crying all day
 
Posts: 10719 | Location: TN | Registered: December 18, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Unapologetic Old
School Curmudgeon
Picture of Lord Vaalic
posted Hide Post
Sexual harassment is anything, literally anything, that some snowflake takes offense to. Could be anything from hard core "hey how about a blow job?" to "hey you look nice today," to "hey you were a few minutes late getting here today, try and watch it"

Anything is and can be harassment and you have zero, none, nada, zippo defense

Ask me how I know... I am a manager in a large company, and I have even had to sit through white privilege / white bias classes to help me become aware of how sexist and racist I really am, so I can be more open to diversity when I hire people.




Don't weep for the stupid, or you will be crying all day
 
Posts: 10719 | Location: TN | Registered: December 18, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Gracie Allen is my
personal savior!
posted Hide Post
Actually it sounds like the whole sexual harassment thing is making a comeback. I guess that's 'cause Bill Clinton is now safely retired.

Yes, it's vague. That's the point.
 
Posts: 27291 | Location: Deep in the heart of the brush country, and closing on that #&*%!?! roadrunner. Really. | Registered: February 05, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Knows too little
about too much
Picture of rduckwor
posted Hide Post
Simply verbiage applied to various offenses to make them seem real.

RMD




TL Davis: “The Second Amendment is special, not because it protects guns, but because its violation signals a government with the intention to oppress its people…”
Remember: After the first one, the rest are free.
 
Posts: 20303 | Location: L.A. - Lower Alabama | Registered: April 06, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Never miss an
opportunity to STFU
posted Hide Post
So true. Anything can be twisted if someone feels like putting you thru the wringer. And it is hard to defend against since the PC deck is already stacked against the 'abuser'. It is frightening because it maybe on your employment record forever.




Never be more than one step away from your sword-Old Greek Wisdom
 
Posts: 2294 | Location: SE Mich-- USA | Registered: September 10, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
Both can be used maliciously by the usual suspects.
 
Posts: 4273 | Location: Peoples Republic of Berkeley | Registered: June 12, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Lawyers, Guns
and Money
Picture of chellim1
posted Hide Post
quote:
And it is hard to defend against since the PC deck is already stacked against the 'abuser'.

If you are a white male, you are not a victim of sexual harassment or verbal abuse... you are the abuser.



"Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible."
-- Justice Janice Rogers Brown

"The United States government is the largest criminal enterprise on earth."
-rduckwor
 
Posts: 23946 | Location: St. Louis, MO | Registered: April 03, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
His Royal Hiney
Picture of Rey HRH
posted Hide Post
Like all good ideas, there is always a certain number of people who will game and abuse any system.

Everyone ought to be able to work in an environment without harassment or abuse of any kind.



"It did not really matter what we expected from life, but rather what life expected from us. We needed to stop asking about the meaning of life, and instead to think of ourselves as those who were being questioned by life – daily and hourly. Our answer must consist not in talk and meditation, but in right action and in right conduct. Life ultimately means taking the responsibility to find the right answer to its problems and to fulfill the tasks which it constantly sets for each individual." Viktor Frankl, Man's Search for Meaning, 1946.
 
Posts: 19588 | Location: The Free State of Arizona - Ditat Deus | Registered: March 24, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of FlyingScot
posted Hide Post
Guilty until proven innocent, but you will never be proven innocent. Basically in corporate America, be very careful what you say and always have a witness. Even when traveling - I'm super careful on the road, when taking team to dinner, etc. Have to treat it like the 3rd rail - and any emotion on your part i.e. "you f**ked up" will be used against you.

It does go both ways these days - male --> female or female --> male. Really just an extension of PC Culture. I don't think it is worse, actually better and a I do think there are and have been abuses...but honestly today is so different from 10 yrs ago, and for the most part everyone is practical about it. But if so inclined it can and has been used and pretty much impossible to shake off.





“Forigive your enemy, but remember the bastard’s name.”

-Scottish proverb
 
Posts: 1999 | Location: South Florida | Registered: December 24, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
20+ years in corporate America. (think Fortune 50 company)

You need to be careful.

If you make a habit of using 'loose / off-color language and humor' it absolutely can be used against you by a disgruntled employee.

Recent case in point - 'protected' employee was being repeatedly cited for legitimate work-related issues. He counter-accused using 'harassment' as a claim and it got major traction. A manager was let go because of it.

-----------------------------


Proverbs 27:17 - As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another.
 
Posts: 8940 | Location: Florida | Registered: September 20, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Muzzle flash
aficionado
Picture of flashguy
posted Hide Post
I had a call one day from our HR office that my supervisor and I needed to come there, so we did. Apparently some female over in Europe had reported me for sexual harassment. I was stunned. I worked with many females in my office and others and never had any problems. (Those ladies could not believe anyone would accuse me of harassment.) It seems that I went into too much detail in explaining how some of our software worked and she said she felt I was "talking down" to her and impugning her education and intelligence. I was required to make a formal apology to her, which I did, and that cleared the matter with HR. I told my supervisor that I would never speak or communicate with that person again--if she called for assistance in the future (and she undoubtedly would), someone else (preferably female) would have to handle it. (I'd really have loved to know how some of the females in my office would have responded to her inquiry...!)

flashguy




Texan by choice, not accident of birth
 
Posts: 27902 | Location: Dallas, TX | Registered: May 08, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
This sums up sexual harassment. Kevin Spacey blackmails his boss. For those that have not seen it here is the link:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJVXg1AHQTY
 
Posts: 17177 | Location: Stuck at home | Registered: January 02, 2015Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Get Off My Lawn
Picture of oddball
posted Hide Post
"sexual harassment" is the corporate version of "micro aggressions".



"I’m not going to read Time Magazine, I’m not going to read Newsweek, I’m not going to read any of these magazines; I mean, because they have too much to lose by printing the truth"- Bob Dylan, 1965
 
Posts: 16613 | Location: Texas | Registered: May 13, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
quarter MOA visionary
Picture of smschulz
posted Hide Post
Things that are just normal everyday interactions now have been magnified beyond recognition.
You can thank lawyers and the media for that.
 
Posts: 22858 | Location: Houston, TX | Registered: June 11, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Freethinker
Picture of sigfreund
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Sig209:
If you make a habit of using 'loose / off-color language and humor' it absolutely can be used against you by a disgruntled employee.


Well, harassment complaints—sexual or otherwise—aren’t the only reason to avoid such language.
I have virtually eliminated even mild profanity from my speech and, strangely enough, it has had absolutely no effect on how I get along with people, from young women co-workers to highly seasoned members of police tactical teams. Yes, I fully realize that doing that won’t guarantee someone won’t be accused of sexual harassment anyway, but not doing it raises the probability of such an accusation to a near certainty sooner or later. Not using profanity or “suggestive” language is simply a matter of self-control.




6.4/93.6

“Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something.”
— Plato
 
Posts: 47366 | Location: 10,150 Feet Above Sea Level in Colorado | Registered: April 04, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of bigdeal
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Rey HRH:
Everyone ought to be able to work in an environment without harassment or abuse of any kind.
That greatly depends on your definition of those terms. Unfortunately, harassment and abuse have somewhat become constantly moving targets over time, subject to just about anyone's interpretation. We do project autopsies once a project has been completed to determine what went wrong, and how mistakes and problems can be avoided in the future. That very often involves calling people and their departments to the mat. Some might call that harassment or abuse, but to those of us who've been doing this for a long time, it's an indispensable tool in refining our process, and getting better at what we do for our customers. The current corporate climate is destroying that 'tool' and making us less efficient/effective/competitive for it.


-----------------------------
Guns are awesome because they shoot solid lead freedom. Every man should have several guns. And several dogs, because a man with a cat is a woman. Kurt Schlichter
 
Posts: 33845 | Location: Orlando, FL | Registered: April 30, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
His Royal Hiney
Picture of Rey HRH
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by bigdeal:
quote:
Originally posted by Rey HRH:
Everyone ought to be able to work in an environment without harassment or abuse of any kind.
That greatly depends on your definition of those terms. Unfortunately, harassment and abuse have somewhat become constantly moving targets over time, subject to just about anyone's interpretation. We do project autopsies once a project has been completed to determine what went wrong, and how mistakes and problems can be avoided in the future. That very often involves calling people and their departments to the mat. Some might call that harassment or abuse, but to those of us who've been doing this for a long time, it's an indispensable tool in refining our process, and getting better at what we do for our customers. The current corporate climate is destroying that 'tool' and making us less efficient/effective/competitive for it.


The harassment I have in mind is harassment for non-work performance-related behavior and with a purpose that has nothing to do with improving behavior or productivity.

I should know. Because I have a habit of going right up to the line and have stepped over it from time to time inadvertently. Fortunately, those who were witnesses have never been offended. In contrast, an ex-co-worker just called me up to let me know his wife just got canned for something way mild compared to the antics he's seen me do before. What happened to his wife brought me to his mind.



"It did not really matter what we expected from life, but rather what life expected from us. We needed to stop asking about the meaning of life, and instead to think of ourselves as those who were being questioned by life – daily and hourly. Our answer must consist not in talk and meditation, but in right action and in right conduct. Life ultimately means taking the responsibility to find the right answer to its problems and to fulfill the tasks which it constantly sets for each individual." Viktor Frankl, Man's Search for Meaning, 1946.
 
Posts: 19588 | Location: The Free State of Arizona - Ditat Deus | Registered: March 24, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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