I haven't seen anything like this before. Those in the business have an opinion? Just curious.





Link to original video: https://youtu.be/9UxSqdkSysQ

A lot of years ago, when I was in HS, I was in the juniors of the local volunteer FD. Even back then we had a mechanical chest compression device. This one looks better, though.

These have been around for awhile. That one is similar to the Zoll autopulse otherwise known as the geezer squeezer. It's not as good in my opinion as the Lucas Device which has a ram and suction cup that moves the chest up and down.

Honestly though I think they're the best thing to happen to CPR since the AED.

I spoke with a department in very rural Ohio.

They use a device called a Thumper when they need to perform CPR on a patient who needs to be transported to a hospital.

CPR is very, very physical, that is why we rotate when performing CPR.

So are any of these devices remotely affordable for private ownership?

They're often referred to as a Lucas device. They substantially improve the ability of the first responders to focus on the other things they can do for the patient without the extreme fatigue of protracted chest compressions.

quote:

Originally posted by mark_a:
So are any of these devices remotely affordable for private ownership?

The Lucas is around $12-15k depending on the model, and I believe the autopulse is 5-6k.

For the amount of time a layperson would be doing CPR, you're better off just getting good training.

And for reference, this is the Lucas:



And this is the autopulse:

I have used several devices, Thumpers, Geezer Squeezers, etc. on real-world calls.

The main issue is they cost too much, so agencies that get them only get a couple, and in the end they decide not to buy enough to outfit the whole system. The systems I worked in were 900+ square miles. Hard to field enough to cover it.

Most EMS systems across the nation will only do CPR for half an hour or so, and they will remain on scene to do it. Seattle and Charlotte are the two best cities for CPR saves, at something like 65%. I know Charlotte does not have these things, not sure about Seattle. A good first-responder system (fire/rescue/police) to supplement an advanced life support (paramedic) EMS system is what makes the difference.

My experience has been that teaching lay people to actually DO CPR before fire/EMS gets there, and for fire/EMS to do GOOD CPR once they do there, results in many times more success than a mechanical contraption. I wouldn't say 'no' to one if it showed up, but for the money, more training on existing equipment would be better.

Best thing that ever happened in this country for cardiac arrest patients was capanography. For the first time we could actually see in real-time how good (or bad) our CPR compressions were. Totally turned around how we approached everything.

Our protocols actually just changed to where we have to do 4 minutes of manual compressions on scene before attempting to move the person and before putting on an automatic device.

Please allow me a slight thread drift because I am concerned that I might not be able to do manual compressions very long.
A former CPR instructor told me that once you start CPR you must continue without stopping or you liable for the injured person’s survival. Is that true? I would want to do what I could, but without providing a payday for the family of the victim if I physically couldn’t finish the job.

Your mileage and State may vary, but as a Red Cross instructor (see sig for details) we teach you can stop CPR in the following:

• There is an obvious sign of life.
  
• An AED becomes available. (And then follow its direction)
  
• Another trained responder or EMS takes over.
  
• You are too exhausted to continue.
  
• Or the scene become unsafe.
  

quote:

Originally posted by detroit192:
Your mileage and State may vary, but as a Red Cross instructor (see sig for details) we teach you can stop CPR in the following:

• There is an obvious sign of life.
  
• An AED becomes available. (And then follow its direction)
  
• Another trained responder or EMS takes over.
  
• You are too exhausted to continue.
  
• Or the scene become unsafe.
  

And as an American Heart Association instructor, I agree. If you start and become exhausted, you can stop. Most, or all, states have Good Samaritan laws that protect you.

Thanks for clearing that up guys.

I have witnessed the Lucas device used several times. Let me tell you its brutal to watch. If anyone has done CPR on one of those little training dummies that make the clicking sound, you will soon realize you dont push down hard enough as you think you are.

quote:

Originally posted by gpbst3:
I have witnessed the Lucas device used several times. Let me tell you its brutal to watch. If anyone has done CPR on one of those little training dummies that make the clicking sound, you will soon realize you dont push down hard enough as you think you are.

So true. The EMS agency I used to work for had the Lucas. All the supervisors had them and would rush it to the ambulance on cardiac arrest. I had two issues with them, first is stopping compressions to get the thing hooked up and thumping. If you were inexperienced with them there was a significant pause in compressions which is detrimental to the patient. Second is the battery life wasn’t great and they took a while to charge. Other than that those suckers are amazing! As close to perfect CPR you can get without interruptions. Automated cpr devices along with capno has to have boosted survivability pretty substantially.

Just remember if you are breaking ribs during CPR, you are doing it right!

In the late 80's early 90's when I was with the Department all of the private ambulance companies had a device that did this. It consisted of a flat plate that went under the patient on the gurney, a post with an arm that rotated, a cylinder, and adjustments for depth and speed of compression.

You placed the board on the gurney, lifted the patient and secured them. Once in the ambulance you attached the post/arm, plugged in O2 from the main supply, adjusted the rectangular pad so it touched the sternum, set the depth, and turned it on. It would pause every 5 compression to allow you to bag the patient. I understand that they originally came with a special mask that was secured to the patient and it would ventilate them as well, but these were easily damaged or lost so someone had to sit there and bag.

It was nice as it not only took the physical work out, but allowed the paramedic to roam inside mod, prep and administer cardiac drugs, treat other injuries if present, etc.

The days when that silly thing was broken sucked. Some of those were 10-15 minute rides and that is not fun rocking and rolling inside an ambulance.

I have to admit that new one looks pretty cool. If it fails it appears you can continue manually right over the top of it.